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Small rifle primers for AR any difference

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by t901, Feb 6, 2013.

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  1. t901

    t901 Member

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    I'm just starting to load 223 for my AR have 8 pounds of TAC coming with a 16in barrel 1/7 twist and wanted to know about primers. I read that I need different primes for ball powder and harder primer because it's an AR, so many people saying so many different thing I don't know what to believe.
    So I was hoping my fellow trapshooters can set me straight. I have bought basically what ever primers I could find (cci 500, Winchester, Fiocchi, Fed) but want to do it right when I can buy more. For shotgun I stick with the big 3 Winchester, Fed, and Rem.
    Sorry it's so long but thanks for the help
    Todd
     
  2. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

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    Over simplified 'normal' small rifle primers have been known to slam fire in AR's.

    There are 'harder' primers - typically sold as 'AR' or '556' primers.

    From my experience it appears to matter from gun to gun. I've never experienced a slam fire with an AR and I have used all different makes of primers. Perhaps I have been lucky.

    Even in an AC556 (full auto Mini-14) I had no problems.

    Your results may vary...
     
  3. slobhyunter

    slobhyunter TS Member

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    CCI ARE HARDER.
     
  4. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    I use regular Winchester sm. rifle primers in loads I run through my Stag AR's. I haven't had any issues thus far. I have heard the slam fire story too. Not saying it isn't true, but it has yet to happen to me.
     
  5. shadow

    shadow Active Member

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    There is no firing pin spring in an AR and the firing pin can move foreward enough when the bolt slams shut to make a dent in the primer. Yes--it CAN fire, but it is a rare thing to happen. When you have a choice buy some CCIs'.
     
  6. Harley Lekvold

    Harley Lekvold TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    CCI 41 Primers are made for 5.56 ammo.
     
  7. Kerz

    Kerz Member

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    little difference until you get back aways, at least 500 yds. Just something you would need to do with chronograph and group size. I've shot 10s of 1000s of 223 in NRA HP.
    Vic
     
  8. t901

    t901 Member

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    are the CCI 41 magnum primers or just standard primes that are thicker

    Thanks for all the help so far,
    Todd
     
  9. Hill topper

    Hill topper Member

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    The main thing you want to do is to throughly clean the primer pocked and seat the primer fully.

    If the cartage wobbles when you stand it on a flat surplus I would not fire it in a AR or M1 garand.

    It is best to use the CCI milspec primers in the military auto loaders.

    e
     
  10. Harley Lekvold

    Harley Lekvold TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Number 41 Mil-spec primers are made to the same specifications of the U.S. Military and reduce the chances of a slam-fire. While designed for you in Military-style semi-auto rifles, they use the same data as CCI magnum primers.
     
  11. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Been using Federal 205 primers in my AR15s for a couple of decades without any problems.

    I think people who have issues are not making sure the primers get fully seated. Especially when using military cases. The primer pocket needs to be swaged properly and the primer crimping completely removed. Otherwise the primer may not see, or it can become partially flattened during seating. When it is partially flattened the cup can get pushed closer to the anvil.

    I have a 223 AK that absolutely will not tolerate high primers. It's slam fired and doubled on some reman ammo. But never on my Fed 205 reloads because I ensure the primer pocket is properly prepared.
     
  12. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    The best way to avoid a slam-fire in the AR, Garand, M1-A, or Ruger Mini-14 is to ALWAYS load the chamber from the magazine or clip, and NEVER put a round in the chamber and let the bolt fly forward.
     
  13. Leo

    Leo Well-Known Member

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    Shooting Coach has the answer. I have never seen a slamfire in a weapon that had stripped the round out of the magazine. I have shot enough rounds mostly with the AR chassis in years of competition to have worn out a dozen barrels, at least 8 of them were stainless Kriegers. I have NEVER had a slam fire with Standard CCI or Winchester primers. I have used the Mil Spec CCI with no problems also. Letting the bolt strip the round out of the magazine is the easy way to go.

    One thing I have seen several people do wrong is to over oil/grease the Bolt Carrier group. Very little oil is required on the piston rings, and very little lube is needed on the cam bolt. When things are sloppy lubed, any excess lube sticking to the floating firing pin attracts debris. When it builds up like tar, and the pin does not float, it can make a slam fire.

    A trigger job with poor geometry and tolerance is the second thing I run into with slam fires on the line. The stock design and most quality aftermarket triggers are really dependable if an inexperienced person does not over adjust them too much.
     
  14. t901

    t901 Member

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    So do all bullet Manufacturer use the harder primers on there 223 ammo
    thanks for the help
     
  15. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Shooting Coach, the .223 AK I cited above was indeed loaded from the magazine. I do not single load semi-autos unless a SLED is used. (For those wondering what a SLED is, click the link.)

    And a local rifle club here requires all semi-autos have their muzzles pointed down towards the ground when chambering because of slam fires. It's not common, but it certainly is not rare, either. They can't afford to have a round go over their berm wall. They do a lot of DCM shoots and specifically stated M1 Garands are the biggest offender, even with surplus ammo.
     
  16. claybrdr

    claybrdr Well-Known Member

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    Several years ago I bought 15,000 .30 caliber carbine pulled primers cheap and I used them in both 9mm and AR-15 USPSA practice sessions with good results. They came in Winchester small pistol sleeves. Shot them in my STI Stinger, Rock River 9mm AR and various AR15s. Didn't seem to matter.
     
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