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should sattelite grands have to pay the ATA a fee

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Dr.Longshot, Sep 1, 2013.

  1. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    What advantage does a club get for the ATA Fee to hold such an event? The club gets no credit if weather causes an event to be cancelled or cut short.

    When Steve Carmichael held an event that the club had to pay a fee for, was not given any credit because of the weather causing cancellations and shooters left to go home, He had to mortgage his personal Home to pay the ATA their required fee to hold the event, But Steve paid all shooters.

    I do not feel the ATA should get any satellite grand fees, they are going to get the std ATA Daily Fees, does the ATA get paid twice? Daily Fees and a Fee for the Sattelite?

    The Sattelite Grands are a Promotion for the ATA and the Hosting Club has to do a lot more work to get ready for it.

    We want the ATA to grow, but the stiff fee to hold a Sattelite Grand is totally
    an un needed expense for the club and for the shooter.

    Plus the hosting clubs are bigger than the average gun club.

    The ATA approached the Cardinal Center to hold a Sattelite Grand and were told we do not need to pay you to hold a shoot, you need us more than we need you was the reply from the Cardinal Center.

    And I support the Cardinal Center's reply.

    Clubs should Re Name their previously held Sattelite Grands and keep the extra money for themselves and give the ATA the same reply that Cardinal Center did.

    It would be cheaper in the long run for the ATA Shooters.

    We need to change the way ALL American teams are chosen. A shooter should not have to shoot in several states to be chosen, it should be by Averages in each discipline.

    Maybe each states All American Teams should shoot at the Grand in the Claytarget
    Championship, The Doubles Championship, and the Grand American Handicap.

    The winning team would be the ALL AMERICAN TEAM, if there is a tie use reverse
    scores to get a winner, if there is still a tie, a Shoot off of 50 singles, 50 Handicap,and 25 pairs of doubles to break the tie. If still tied they would be declared CO ALL AMERICANS, The Best of the Best.

    Remember Each state has it's own weather to contend with, some states have nice weather and little rain, and that is a difficulty on it's own.

    Those states have a distinct advantage.

    Now how do we ATA shooters make it an equal playing field for the ALL AMERICAN
    TEAMS?

    Could we use several clubs VIA SATTELITE Computer Like the Racetracks use.

    Just some ideas to get more shooters involved on an equal playing field.

    Gary Bryant
     
  2. Jawhawker

    Jawhawker TS Member

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    Needing attention again, I see!
     
  3. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    Gary,

    The money that is paid for a club to host a Satelite Grand is substancial, if the club were to use the same money as added money they would not take the same degree of risk if the weather didn't co operate ... Once the club pays the money, the show must go on even under the worst possible conditions which is not always fair to the shooter or club for that matter ... I don't know what the fee is now, but when I was involved with the Old Phoenix Club and the Spring Grand they were not cheap and I can't help but feel they have not come down any ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  4. MTA Tom

    MTA Tom Active Member

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    Dr.Longshot asked, "What advantage does a club get for the ATA Fee to hold such an event?"

    The ATA fee for a Satellite Grand covers ATA trophies, pins, programs and mailing, and travel fees for ATA officials.

    The ATA trophies are high quality, bought in bulk. Comparable ones would cost the club more if purchased individually. The pins and programs are a wash.

    I believe the Michigan Trapshooting Association paid approximately $15,000 to the ATA for this year's Great Lakes Grand.
     
  5. grnberetcj

    grnberetcj Active Member

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    Travel Fee's for the ATA Officials...now that is a pile of bovine excrement!!!

    Curt
     
  6. running bear

    running bear Member

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    More B.S from Longshot. No club is forced to hold one.
    Buck
     
  7. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    The Cardinal Center was never "offered" a Satellite Grand. The Dr. continues to make that up in spite of numerous corrections. It's just not true, that's all. It never happened.

    The whole Satellite Grand program used to lose quite a bit of money because programs were sent out to almost everybody. Since 2007 they have been more targeted and the expenses closely match the income from the clubs. But with the increased daily fees they produce they are moneymakers for everyone when everything goes right. They are a nice draw for the clubs and a shot in the arm for the ATA. All in all, a successful and balanced promotion.

    Neil
     
  8. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    Ah BS Neil. Can't a guy make stuff up and post it anymore? I mean what would the Doc do if he didn't make stuff up.
     
  9. 27-T

    27-T Member

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    Another intelligent statement from AA27AA.
     
  10. hunter44

    hunter44 Well-Known Member

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    Longtooter never lets the truth get in the way of one of his stories! His "facts" are pulled out of the air........some would call this type of story teller a liar, but certainly not me.
     
  11. fast gun

    fast gun Active Member

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    Total recall of all thing's imaginary.
     
  12. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    Neil you know that is not a true statement, go back a few years and look at the reply that was given by Cardinal Center at a meeting with the ATA official
    or was it an official asking in an un official capacity for their thoughts.

    Gary Bryant
     
  13. Jon Reitz

    Jon Reitz Well-Known Member

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    Dear Dr. Longfellow,

    I have to tell you, when you post something here, I generally skip right over it. I even don't bother to read the dribble you post on this site.

    Jon Reitz
     
  14. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    You keep saying that Gary but it is not true. The only way a Satellite Grand can be approved (and so offered) is by a majority vote of the EC and I attended every meeting in the 6-year period involved. In the hundreds of hours of meetings, the idea never came up. The ED at the time personally assured me that he did no such thing and I believe him.

    You have told this story for years and I'm sure it is "Ohio Lore" just as the idea that Tom Ackiln wanted to move the Grand from Ohio and so on. But Gun Club lore is like TS.com or Shotgun World. Someone thinks that something would be nice if were true, posts it as true, the first guy who reads it decides it would be even better with some corroboration and so adds - using a fake name - the detail that "I was as there when it happened and saw it all" and off it scurries circling back as "fact" before anything can think "Wait a second, that's impossible!"

    And the tale you are telling is not true. It can't be true. That's not the way things are done. I've posted this sort of information for years and you somehow just don't get it.

    Neil
     
  15. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    My understanding as I know it he did talk to the OSTA at a meeting at the Cardinal Center and I do not believe your dribble, you were not there, from what I was told he did it on his own, and was told NO.


    Gary Bryant
     
  16. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Gary, the date in question was the fall of 2008 and the ED at that time you say was involved sometimes visits this site. Hoping that he will tell his version, I will say now that I will accept what he writes as the truth, no matter what he says. Will you?

    Neil
     
  17. running bear

    running bear Member

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    Neil, you can't argue with the know it all Longshot, he knows everything!

    Buck
     
  18. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    Neil his key statement was "you weren't there". Now my question to LS is were you in the meeting?? I think the answer is NO. So LS you are a third or fourth party "who heard something. Therefore you really know crap.

    Don