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Short Rib VS Tall Rib for Trap?? Frustrated

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Rodney1966, Aug 16, 2012.

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  1. Rodney1966

    Rodney1966 Member

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    I have been shooting trap for about 8 months now, and when I realized that I loved the game I invested in a nice gun (for me) a Caesar Guerini Magnus Combo. Little did I know that by buying a gun with a very tall rib would change everything for me in a negative way. My struggles before with a BT99 were small in comparison, and I have never gone through more up and downs in shooting then I have over the past month. Question: Why is there such a difference for some people in shooting a tall rib gun? I do realize that a lot of people can make this switch without a hitch, but I can’t get it for some reason. I am at the point where I can go shoot 25 targets with the Guerini break 18 of them, and grab my sporting flat rib gun and run 50. I have never spent more time on the pattern board, and setting the targets up straight away then in the last month. Now I'm faced with selling a gun that I love, but can’t shoot. Thought?

    Rodney
  2. grunt

    grunt Active Member

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    Find out the POI. it may not be putting the shot where you think..
  3. Redcobra

    Redcobra Member

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    Is it an Impact combo or a Trap combo?
    I have one of each and yes they are different.
    If you are used to a flat rib flat shooter you will be over on the trap model.
    The impact can be adjusted to 50/50 if that's what you want, the trap model can't.
    For trap, the trap model rules once you get used to it. Float the bird, hold high. It's not good for sporting clays or skeet IMHO.

    Put the sporter away. Only shoot the CG. Lower the comb until you see overlapping beads. Raise the front of the rib. Keep shooting till you start smoking them. Note the float and get consistent at it. Use a LM choke.
    Then you can start raising the comb to a fig 8 bead and start lowering the rib and increasing the float until you can stand upright and smoke em all. Then go to a IM choke.
  4. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

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    I'm not sure high rib guns are a good idea for relatively inexperienced shooters. I think many inexperienced shooters don't have the ability to use a high rib gun successfully because they get lost without the barrel out in front of them acting as a rudder. Do you have any idea if the gun reasonably fits you? If you are stocky with a short neck this style may not fit you well.
  5. Uncle Screech

    Uncle Screech Member

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    Hi Rodney,

    First thing, congratulations on getting a fine piece of hardware, I have a Magnus combo as well and couldn't be happier. Well I could but that would involve leggy super models and whipped cream and that's not what we're here to talk about. It's a good gun, keep working with it.

    I made the change from shooting an SKB GC7 top single so I can relate to what you're going through. What made the transition for me so painless was 2 very good shooters at the club I shoot at. Hopefully you have someone like that where you shoot you can turn to. It is at best very difficult if not down right impossible to get your comb, your rib and your eyes all lined up for that initial tuning. I tried and I made a mess of things. You will probably need to get the gun flattened out to start as mentioned above, get the comb "centered" with just enough height so you see the standard figure eight. But no matter where you begin it is going to take you shooting a box and someone standing behind you to tell just what kind of adjustments you need to make next and that next step should be getting the comb moved right or left so your shot string is traveling towards the bird and not offline. Then start adding or removing height from the comb. Fight the temptation to go from 60/40 to 115% high in one step. Fight the temptation to adjust every little thing you can adjust. Adjustments should be slight and just one at a time and test to see what the actual changes are (did I bust the bird or not). Accept the fact that you'll probably go through this again since it is very common for us to make physical adjustments to ourselves instead of the gun and after a bit we relax and we start missing again. But that's OK, you have all the gizmo's so you might as well use them.

    Hang in there, small steps and a friend or two will get you to where you are smoking them all the time.

    Greg Sliker
  6. StansCustoms

    StansCustoms Active Member

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    Regardles of the rib..the most important thing is gun fit. A good fitter, like the Country Gentleman guys, can really put you on track.

    They can correct "whatever" is keeping you and the gun from being "one"!

    Much cheaper than changing guns..especially if you like your gun and want to get it where it will work for you.

    Best money I ever spent..several guns to late unfortunately.


    Happy trails...Stan
  7. Rodney1966

    Rodney1966 Member

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    All your responses are why this is such a great site. Greg, Stan, and everyone else that responded thank you all so much for your advice.

    I have the rib in its highest up position, and the comb all the way down position and still have a gap of the beads, no figure eight shooting 80/20. I know its probably not right but I'm a bead checker when I set up, and when I see a gap, I cram my face down trying to fix it, which causes many other problems mostly a sore cheek then flinching. I do want to stick with Guerini, and maybe an Impact is the way to go to get the adjustability I want. Right now with the Magnus and the high rib, I feel lost and unbalanced, almost lost while setting up. Its very strange that I can grab another gun, and shoot it fine. After spending many hours last week with a great AA shooter on the pattern board, trying F,LF,IM, and three different loads. and then just shooting tons of straigh out shots, I crushed those shots, as soon as we started shooting a round, the only ones I could hit were straight out, I shot over everything else. I could go spend a lot of money having the stock and comb cut down to get a better fit, but what then if its the rib and I just cant shoot it? Funny I can grab my daughters $400 bt99 and crush them. Not giving up, but stepping back a little for sure. Not selling yet but not sure what to do next. Thanks again for all your responses. Rodney
  8. Beretta687EELL

    Beretta687EELL Active Member

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    I was shooting a high rib unsingle and struggled with it for some time, as I figured it was just me. I had shot an unsingle for many years and didn't think anything would be much different with the higher rib. I would occasionally shoot a decent score. I traded my unsingle barrel for a top single barrel ... what a difference. Too bad I was too pigheaded to try it a few years ago. Bill Malcolm
  9. Avaldes

    Avaldes Active Member

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    When you say rib all the way up, are you referring to the muzzle end or receiver end of the rib? It is a teeter-totter style right?
  10. bigben

    bigben Member

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    Rodney 1966, I do believe you are going the wrong way with the rib, most angle targets are missed by shooting under and behind, Your trying to sustain a figure 8 throught your shot is getting you into a lot of trouble, you cram your face down on the comb, lowering your face way down and forward, the target appears, you don't see it PROPERLY, you come out of the gun, -lost. The fact is if you see some space beween the beads you will see the target much better and see a shootable target faster. You have a good adjustable gun, use it to your advantage. Make sure the pupil of your eye is EXACTLY in the middle of the bead, and above it, you do not want your pupil hiding behind the rib, The angle targets are bothering you, move the rib down in front one notch, shoot some, all along keeping your head level and bring the gun up to it, if you hit a couple, go down another notch, soon you will be really hitting them hard., remember, the faster lock time in the trigger, a higher impact is needed when going from a slower trigger gun. all the best, incinerate em!
  11. Rodney1966

    Rodney1966 Member

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    bigben, Thanks for your advise, I will try this today.
  12. slayer

    slayer Active Member

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    gun fit is everything. If you haven't had it fitted, do so. It's worth the money. When I read about situations like yours, it makes me realize how important it is to try out a gun before you jump into buying it. If you frequent a club or two, there is always somebody that's got the gun your thinking about and they are usually more than happy to let you try it out. If nobody has that gun maybe you shouldn't be thinking about buying one! jmho Bill
  13. bigben

    bigben Member

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    Rodney, after today's shoot, please pm me and we will go further into your better shooting, incinerate em!
  14. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Well-Known Member

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    Listen to BigBen. He's onto you!!
  15. bubba68

    bubba68 TS Member

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    First off, this is a good example of why it is suggested that you shoot before you buy...especially when spending this much dough.

    Second, have you thought about whether you shoot off the bead/rib or do you shoot off the barrel? This makes a huge difference. For me, I don't see the bead or rib when shooting. My primary focus is on the target and I only see the barrel in my peripheral vision. So, I shoot off the barrel. For me (and anyone that shoots like me) moving the rib makes no difference in the world. And, if the gun is an unsingle, that really throws me off. The oly way for me to change POI is to move the comb.

    So, stop and ask yourself what you see when shooting. If you don't see the rib/bead, then having an adjustable rib does nothing for you. And, if you have an unsingle, you will be way off when comparing the POI of a BT99.

    Good luck.
  16. Hal1225

    Hal1225 Member

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    Get rid of it, sell it, take a tax loss. The shotgun has to fit you first, then practice, practice and Iverson it. Also the pad on the stock has some influence, I prefer a curved one like a Browning Monte Carlo stock may have. My Dad's Model 12 had a straight pad and a straight stock and never fit me so I shoot a REM Comp,
    Win Pigeon Grade 101 or a BT 99. The fancy high rib is not the answer. Go see a professional in person.

    Harry Lyga
  17. Rodney1966

    Rodney1966 Member

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    The hero of the day BigBen. You pegged me, I had my face so crammed that I was losing the birds from the house causing a flinch of surprise when I picked the bird up again, and I knew it when you said it. I went out today, shot for the first time head up, no cramming my head in the stock, I didn’t pay attention to the rib, except left right. which I'm still shooting the lefts off the targets, so going out again tomorrow for some fine tuning with an AA shooter to help me on station five, mostly hard rights. I powdered them today, I couldn’t believe it. Ben I shot my first 50 thinking this should be interesting, and gradually got better like I could see the target for the first time A BEACH BALL IF YOU WILL. Never had I seen the target like that. My confidence grew with each shot; I called pull and powdered them faster than I have ever hit them before. Occasionally when I looked at the rib I noticed a big gap, maybe an inch to an inch and a half, I shrugged at it and said I'm hitting them. For tomorrow a series of just hard rights until I'm smoking them and then back to the fun. I can’t tell you how it felt today, to gain a little confidence back. Happy and keeping the Magnus. Thank you BigBen.
  18. bigben

    bigben Member

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    Rodney, God bless!, if you are taking the left side of the target off, have your AA shooter buddy do this, make sure the gun is empty, close your eyes, mount the gun where it is comfy, looking at your AA shooter, your gun mounted, open your eyes, he will look to see if your pupil is in fact in the middle of the rib, since you are taking the left sides off, maybe a 1/16th move of your comb to the right will be a good start, if the comb is too far to the left, you will shoot behind the rights and shoot ahead of the lefts, this is where a full choke is invaluabe, most all accomplished shooters shoot with full chokes, they can see the smoke off the target anywhere and adjust combs, to make soot balls, so very glad to be of help, your squad mates may have to sue you for black lung for hitting the targets so hard! go get em! all the best uncinerate em!
  19. copey

    copey Member

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    Imo..there is a definitive learning curve to the hi rib transition...a re learning of hold points I found helped the most...start on Straight aways....mirror your poi. On paper...then adj hold point till it smokes.
  20. Rodney1966

    Rodney1966 Member

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    BigBen, I will also switch to a full choke, today was IM tomorrow a LF, then I will get to a full choke. I do think the reason I missed the hard right today was shooting just behind them, should have known it when you can see the dust come off them. I will let you know how it goes. Thanks again to everyone who responded. Great crowd! Rodney
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