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shooting where you look?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Beretta687EELL, Jul 2, 2007.

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  1. Beretta687EELL

    Beretta687EELL Well-Known Member

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    You look at the target ... the gun will go where you look. You will see the muzzle of the barrel come into your view of the target. Once you have shot a fair bit your brain will recognize the bird / barrel relationship required to break the target and your finger will operate the trigger. It sounds like most of the other folks guns that you are shooting, shoot higher than yours. I suggest that you set the trap on straight away targets and shoot from post 3. Adjust your rib/ comb up until you like what you see when the target breaks.

    Good luck. Bill Malcolm
     
  2. smartass

    smartass TS Member

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    I sure wish I had one of those guns that "will go where you look". Mine, unfortunately, goes where I point the damn thing.

    It might be bad to have a gun which went where I looked. If a large breasted female walked by and I happened to look at her, it would be a shame to shoot her too.
     
  3. Rollin Oswald

    Rollin Oswald Active Member

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    The ONLY time to sight down the rib is just after the gun is mounted to check the mount. That is also the only purpose of a mid bead, to check the gun mount. It will only be necessary until the mount is perfected and consistent.

    Focusing on anything but the targets is never recommended. Your peripheral vision will notice the bead or barrel's approach to the target and with experience, you will know when to fire, when the right sight-picture, the relationship of the barrel or bead and the target, has been created.

    To create accurate sight-pictures, your gun must shoot were expected. I agree with Bill, above, and also suspect that when you shoot other guns, that they may shoot flatter than yours, i.e. that their points of impact are closer to their points of aim.

    Most shooters want their guns to shoot high, with their points of impact higher than their points of aim. This avoids having to cover trap's rising targets to get the necessary vertical lead.

    Looking ahead, if you have both an adjustable rib and comb, I suggest that you adjust the comb so the gun shoots slightly high (to avoid having to cover targets.) Then, if you want, adjust the rib so the beads align in a figure-8 pattern, which allows easy checking following the gun mount.

    If you are used to flat shooting guns, field guns, for example, it will take a little time to get used to not having to cover the rising targets. Once shooting slightly under targets is mastered however, you will benefit in always being able to see targets when you fire. This will be especially beneficial when shooting targets with a tail wind. You will be able to see them drop and will have a better chance of hitting them.

    Rollin
     
  4. ec90t

    ec90t Guest

    I wish that I understood how the "shoot where you look" thing works. I have had good days when I pointed the gun with the barrel and broke the target.

    The other night, while shooting games, I got so tired that I mounted the gun and called for the bird and just broke them into pieces. I was unaware of pointing the gun or anything else. My mind was over riding what the rest of me was telling it. I wish that I could trust it all the time. This was taking place from various yardages (25yd-40yd). It amazes me how this is done. I know one thing for certain, proper and consistant mounting are necessary for this to work.

    ec90t
     
  5. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    st8, there was a time, for a few years, I could look at the bird and break it. Now I can't, and really haven't been able to, consistently, for 50,000, maybe 100,000 birds or so.

    But here's a way to make sure the gun is shooting where you look. Look at the bird. Move the bead to it if it's a straightaway, ahead of and even with it if it's an angle. If the bird breaks, it's shooting where you look. If not, adjust it until it does. That got me a 198 in Laramie last Saturday (and 97 from the 27 on Friday) and there were probably hundreds there with the kind of shooting advocated here who didn't break withing 5 of either of those scores.

    Neil
     
  6. derbyacresbob

    derbyacresbob Well-Known Member

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    I wear bifocal shooting glasses and can't see the barrel or beads very good at all even when I try to look at them. When I mount the gun I do see enough of the barrel to know that it is there. When I shoot trap, skeet or sporting clays my eyes are looking for the target when I call for the target. I wish my vision was as good as it was when I was younger so I could see some of the targets better. Not being able to see the barrel clearly with my bifocals has not effected my shooting any.
     
  7. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    The technique I use is difficult to explain clearly to anyone who has not already used it. I mount the gun and align the mid and front beads and then shift my focus to the front lip of the trap house and call for the bird. When the bird appears, if Focus on it and my green sight becomes a small green blur that is outside of my conscious visual area. The sight is still there but it is not in the visual area I am clearly seeing. I automatically move to the bird and trust my gun to shoot when things are right. After I shoot, the green front sight again comes into my visual field as an out of focus blur.

    I have a hunch that what Neil has described is not really different. Using different words, I suspect what he is doing is looking at the bird and letting his body automatically move the gun with its out of focus front sight to the bird and shooting. His style and mine might actually be the same but simply expressed with different words.

    The hard part is keeping my head down while looking for the bird. The bird is easier to see if I lift my head but nearly impossible to break.

    Pat Ireland
     
  8. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    Pat, I didn't read Neils post the same way you did to come to the same conclusion. Here's what he wrote below.

    "st8, there was a time, for a few years, I could look at the bird and break it. Now I can't, and really haven't been able to, consistently, for 50,000, maybe 100,000 birds or so."

    Whats that mean? Does that mean he takes his eye off the clay at the last instant to measure some distance in front of it and place the bead in that moving spot? That's the way I read it in his post in that beginning paragraph. And..

    "Look at the bird. Move the bead to it if it's a straightaway, ahead of and even with it if it's an angle. If the bird breaks, it's shooting where you look. If not, adjust it until it does."

    What method is he using to determine this,, " ahead of and even with it if it's an angle." Is it using his peripheral vision to accomplish this as you do, or, is his eyes leaving the clay at the last instant measuring the necessary lead in front of it? Many times he stated he was an "aimer" for trap clays and it works pretty well for him whatever method used.

    A lot people use their peripheral vision much more than they realize without being aware of the process taking place in my view. Pistol/rifle shooters focus on the sights while the target is blurred in the front. Shotgunners glue their eye to the moving target and the bead becomes that out of focus, out in front object. That's my opinion of how a lot of shooters see that relationship. Hap
     
  9. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

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    I have set my gun up so that when I mount it properly I am looking down the center of the rib. I also know that it shoots straight. It took some effort to get the gun set up that way, but it was worth it. I mount the gun and look out at where I expect to pick up the target. When I see it, I move to the target and fire. When I move as a unit, all locked in so that head, stock and torso move as a unit, I am peripherally aware of the bead. I now know that I do in fact use the bead, even though I am looking directly at the bird. I also see an after image of the rib as well. As Hap and others say, you are using peripheral vision whether you consciously aim or your subconscious controls your move to the target.
     
  10. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    1.) Check the bead alingment

    2.) Soft focus about to the 50 yard stakes

    3.) Call for target, and never, never, never take your eyes off the bird.

    4.) Trust your ability to pull the trigger at the right time.

    Sometimes we forget how to do these four (4) things. Nothing else is required. It's a simple game!!!!!
     
  11. revsublime

    revsublime TS Member

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    i hard focus in the "zone" and never focus on bird until it gets into the zone. I find that trying to follow bird outta the trap makes it too hard to catch up too.
     
  12. Bvr Tail

    Bvr Tail Well-Known Member

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    DR BOB,

    Kinda' like thos helmets fighter pilots wear....shoot where you look!

    Interesting

    Danny
     
  13. miketmx

    miketmx Well-Known Member

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    Back in April we had an excellent thread started by Pat Ireland called Bird Bead Relationship. I saved the entire thread on my hard drive and deleted the posts that don't really apply to my style. I use pretty much what Pat says except I don't check the bead alignment when I first mount the gun. I read the Daro Handy book many times and I believe his method about a timed Set Up routine and Soft Focus in front of the trap house. My Set Up ritual consists of 3 phrases: 1. I can Break this target 2. Notice the front bead 3. Soft Focus in the zone. After that I follow the Star Wars advice to Luke Skywalker, "Use the Force, Luke". I am not capable of noticing the bead during the track but after the shot, I know where my green Uni-Dot front bead was at the moment of truth. By 'notice the bead' I mean look right through it and not AT IT. To me Hard Focus during the Set Up causes too much tension and leads to jumping at the streak instead of a confident movement with the target.
     
  14. Beretta687EELL

    Beretta687EELL Well-Known Member

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    You have a good point there devil ... I don't think I will bother waisting my time posting to this site anymore. Bill Malcolm
     
  15. chiefjon

    chiefjon Active Member

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    IMHO it is all about consistancy. You have all the data you needm, above. It is practice, practice, practice that makes it all work. Use the beads to check consistant mount. Learn where the gun shoots when you hold it the same every time. Never hesitate to have a practice trap set to throw straight aways...stand on post 3 and figure the gun out. Then it all comes into place and you break 50 or 100K straight.

    Good luck.

    JON
     
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