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Shooting Bunker Trap This Weekend!

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by timb99, Jul 27, 2007.

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  1. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Any suggestions (besides, be prepared to be humbled???)

    I plan to use my skeet/sporting clays gun, and choke it IM (0.025)/full (0.035.) Shorter barrels and it shoots flatter. And, from what I've read, that's the way to go, correct?

    Also, what about foot position and gun insertion point? Any suggestions there?

    Tim
     
  2. Baber

    Baber TS Member

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    Tim:

    You are right about chokes and something that shoots flatter. The biggest problem with new bunker shooters is that they don't see the target. Put your barrel on the roof of the house and look out past the 10 meter line and wait until you see the target. Also use the whole body. Most ATA shooters arm swing with a rigid body position. Can't do that in bunker. Unlock the knees and swing with the entire body.

    Where are you shooting bunker this weekend?

    TB
     
  3. BunkerGuy

    BunkerGuy TS Member

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    I'd like to elaborate on what Tom Baber said:

    A bunker has to have a marker on top of the bunker in front of each station indicating the center machine location. Virtually always it's a white stripe. Put the bead at the BOTTOM of that stripe. Holding a high gun will allow targets to slip under the barrel and a new shooter will not see them.

    Second, Instead of saying look out at the 10 meter mark, gap your fingers about 3/8" to 1/2". Put the bottom part of the gap at the top of the bunker roof and use the top of the gap to find a landmark (dirt clod, weed, broken target shard, etc). That is the point where you should "look". I say "look" as it is only the center or inital point of your mandatory universal vision. The universal vision MUST cover about 6 - 8 feet either side of the center point to insure you can achieve target lock (see!)on a 45 degree 1.5 meter target.

    Re: foot position. Stand on station. Mount the gun and then rotate 45 degrees left, then right. Move your feet until you find no binding in either direction. Make certain your (left if you are right handed) knee is bent. If you are right handed, you may want to favor the right as you will find that you tend to shoot behind right hand targets (and shoot in front of left hand ones).

    Your chokes are good enuf to start. Consider shooting 1 oz loads of 7 1/2's at 1250 to 1300'/s. The first shell can be a cheapie, the second one should have some quality. For POI, note that a 1.5 meter target will be at roughly the height of your eyes at the 10 meter point and it is still rising slightly. A dead-on gun is good, but a argument can be made that a slightly higher shooting gun might just be an advantage.

    I think you should be warned that bunker shooting is extremely addictive once you have the basics down, and you will find it VERY hard to go back to ATA targets!

    - - Bill
     
  4. lumper

    lumper TS Member

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    Just a few suggestions to go along with what TB said ...

    First of all while on station waiting for your turn do not focus your eyes on anything close. Focus your eyes on something 3o or 40 yards away ... trust me you will understand why in a minute.

    When it is your turn mount the gun but just glance at the beads to be sure your properly mounted but do not stare at the beads for this will screw your eyes from the distance focusing you have with them. Eyes take a few seconds or so to refocus close to distant and distant to close and you want a somewhat distant focus for bunker trap.

    Now the hold position TB mentioned is up to you ... most shooters hold back from the center marker a foot or two from the marker but keep your eyes out above the beads at the edge or slightly ahead of the house so that your eyes will pick up the bird and the bird will not be blocked by any part of the barrel at all.

    Now swing and be sure you have the lead. You might think your leading some of the shots enough but trust me ... your probably not ... you might think you are but your not.

    When you miss a target continue to follow it down to the ground with the gun still in your shoulder. Starting out do not take the 2nd shot, yeah I know your allowed to but you dont want to become dependent on it. If you do miss with the first shot though and you just know that while your still following the target that everything is just right pull that trigger and smash that bird but only if you know its right. Dont shoot it just because your allowed to shoot it.

    Now if you have it available get a faster FPS ammunition before you shoot. Get a 1oz game or target load that is going to push 1250 and 7-1/2 or 8's are fine. But a little zippier speed will help you more than you think.

    Most bunker shooters are like skeet, sporting clay, 5-stand and trap shooters. They are more than willing to help those that ask for it and dont be shy ... watch a round or two or if your shooting with friends ask them for help. We just like the other shooting sports all stand around between rounds and bust each others gonads about this and that. You will find which ones will be more than happy to help you out.

    Now if you have read this far ... be ready to be humbled at first but realize that it is not impossible it is just different. If you can break them at ATA you can break them at the bunker. It is as simple as that ... it is the shooter against the target ... same as ATA .. you just have to remember that you must forget most of what you know of ATA cause it is time to meet "The Bunker".

    Good luck and have fun ... where are you shooting bunker at?
     
  5. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    TBaber,

    I'll be shooting at the Saddle & Sirloin Club in south Kansas City, MO.

    Tim
     
  6. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the suggestions! I would never have thought to hold so low.

    And I had planned on getting some high velocity shells too, as some of you had suggested.

    Cheers!

    Tim
     
  7. Baber

    Baber TS Member

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    The best value in the Bunker shell business today is the Kemen/Rio 24 GM. There are other more expensive shells and probably some that are better but there are no better cheaper shells.

    For more information suggest you go to shotgunreport.com and click on the Olympic section. There are a couple of articles by Les Greevey that you might find interesting reading.

    TB
     
  8. BunkerGuy

    BunkerGuy TS Member

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    Hmmm. Tom just reminded me that BJ McDaniels wrote a 3 part article on making the conversion from ATA trap to Bunker. It seemed useful when I skimmed them.

    I just looked at the USAShooting website, and as usual, I can't find anything as the item of interest has disappeared. Maybe you can email them for a copy or perhaps someone has a copy they can email to you. It originally appeared in the USAShooting magazine and was also on the website at one time.

    - - Bill
     
  9. lumper

    lumper TS Member

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    http://www.deadtargetschool.com/

    http://www.deadtargetschool.com/articles.html

    http://www.deadtargetschool.com/ATAIntlTrapPart1.pdf

    http://www.deadtargetschool.com/ATAIntlTrapPart2.pdf

    http://www.deadtargetschool.com/ATAIntlTrapPart3.pdf

    Bill ... this is what your thinking of. Matter of fact I cant believe I didn't think of the above myself. I usually have a copy of the articles printed out in my shooting bag or car for when newbies show up and wonder what the difference of from regular to bunker trap.
     
  10. code5coupe

    code5coupe Member

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    If most trapshooters use full choke from the 16yd line, why would IM be recommended for bunker, where the birds will be even further out at the break point and the load even lighter/the pattern thinner?
     
  11. Baber

    Baber TS Member

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    code%coupe...

    I'll answer it two ways. First the first shot point at bunker and ATA is not that much different and most ATA shooters are over choked. Ink blots look good but they cut down your margin of error and are really not a way to go.

    TB
     
  12. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

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    I would love the chance to shoot bunker. I've been out to Hillsboro OR a couple of times, but they would not open it up for us. The other "close" ones are Missoula, Las Vegas, and Colorado Springs.
     
  13. JDinTX

    JDinTX Member

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    What is the speed of a bunker target compared to an ATA one? JD
     
  14. lumper

    lumper TS Member

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    FAST ... up to 60mph, I dont even think of the speed when I shoot it or I take the risk of trying to answer the question of just what in the heck am I shooting this game for.

    http://members.tripod.com/~gentryrj/otrap.html
     
  15. BunkerGuy

    BunkerGuy TS Member

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    On relative target speed: Well, it's apples to oranges, really. The ATA target is on the order of 45 mph. Figure around 75 mph for the bunker target. Remember that bunker targets very in height. That means the higher targets are slower and the lower targets are faster as they all have to go 76 meters. It was different in the 36 and 32 gram days as the targets were set to different distances as well as heights.

    As for chokes, keep in mind that choke is a performance, not a (dial) measurement. It really doesn't matter much on first barrel as Tom points out, but if you're shooting 24 gram loads and are a slow shot, you can't choke tight enuf as the 24 gram load gets pretty weak after 45 yards. Target breaks are as much luck then. As Neil Winston has pointed out to us.

    - - Bill
     
  16. lumper

    lumper TS Member

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    Bill ... if there is anything to be said about Bunker is ... its fast but seriously 75mph? Now that is all I'm going to think about on those low ground hard right and left screamers ... thanks man I really appreciate it my fellow bunker shooter.

    Ya know another hint for the original poster. Do not and I repeat DO NOT shoot climbing straight aways like an ATA straight away or ya gonna miss it. Get ahead of it and be ahead of it when you pull the trigger. I miss them more than I should because I slip back and dont to ATA style and not get enough lead.
     
  17. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    The three links to the pdf files helped immensely!

    Gave me a much better visualization of what to expect.

    Thanks!

    lumper, When you say "get ahead" of a straight away, I assume you mean covering the bird, or shooting over the top of the bird (vertical lead)?
     
  18. BunkerGuy

    BunkerGuy TS Member

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    Generally, when a dead straight-away 3.5 meter target is missed, the first barrel shot load goes UNDER the target. Takes a while to learn that you really have to DRIVE THROUGH this target.

    And those 15 to 20 degree targets? You have to learn to really lead them. They won't break if you shoot right at them. The worst ones are those set to 1.5 meters because of the target's speed.

    - - Bill
     
  19. Texas Crew'd

    Texas Crew'd Member

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    Hello Tim,

    Here's a few more good reads.

    http://www.shotgunreport.com/Olympic/AmerOlympicTrap.html

    http://www.shotgunreport.com/Olympic/AmerOlympicTrap2.html

    Don't over think it, If you like to shoot you'll love the game, the challenge and the fellow shooters. Find the target with your eyes focus on the leading edge and smoothly drive right through it and watch it break. Once you mount look only at the target, if you bead check it's gone. What I have really noticed that a lot of first time bunker shooters do is rush. Remember you have ten seconds after the shooter to your left shoots. Take a few seconds for your eyes and call for the target. Keep you eyes on the target. Keep you head on your stock and your gun moving.

    Have a great day shooting,


    Garry Barney
     
  20. Jim Pollock

    Jim Pollock TS Member

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    For those shooters in Ontario that would like to try Bunker Trap, the Toronto International Trap and Skeet Club at Cookstown has their bunker trap open on Sundays for practice. I have been there twice and found the folks to be very friendly and welcoming for people to try it out. Lumper's comments above about it being humbling are quite accurate from my experience but it really is fun to try something new and challenging.

    For people in eastern Ontario and Quebec, Joe Potosky's web site "http://www.losttarget.com/" has lots of information and links to two Montreal area clubs, Montreal International Skeet Club and L'Acadie. I understand both have bunker trap setups but I do not know their schedule. I hope to get there one day too.

    Jim Pollock
     
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