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SCREWED @ PA STATE SHOOT

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Ed Y, Jun 21, 2010.

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  1. Ed Y

    Ed Y TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Just prior to the PA State Shoot a customer brought a cracked forend wood to me for repair. It was missing two dog screws when I got it which had allowed the bolts to work their way loose which is probably why the wood cracked in the first place. I did the repair and told the customer that it would probably crack again, if the dog screws were not replaced. He asked where to get them and I suggested the PA shoot. He wasn't going so he asked if I might be able to get two for him. Thus starts the story. While there, I stopped at a popular gunsmith that services this brand of gun, to see if he had any to sell. He asked how many I wanted and I figured that I should have a few in my shop for future use, so I asked for 12. He put them in a very tiny bag, handed them to me and charged me 60.oo. I foolishly paid it but this 70 year old sure learned a lesson.

    Ed Yanchok
     
  2. Mr. D

    Mr. D Member

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    Hate it when that happens.
     
  3. ronbo142

    ronbo142 TS Member

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    !!!!


    Made of silver or titianium or gold?


    You have got to be kidding!


    Ronbo
     
  4. nomoloscofoso

    nomoloscofoso Member

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    This could get good!!
     
  5. gdbabin

    gdbabin TS Member

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    Anyone willing to screw-over Ed is a lower form of life.



    Guy Babin
     
  6. Ed Y

    Ed Y TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    They are the very tiny bolts that go in immediatly adjacent to a bolt head, to keep it from backing out. Almost too small to photograph. metric, about 1/4" long

    Ed Yanchok
     
  7. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    Ed,please mention the vendors name. This could be the most expensive screws in history. Some of these itinerent travel so called gunsmiths leave a lot to be desired. They have a history of damaging guns with no insurance. Leavin g the customer to fend for themselves.

    Phil Berkowitz
     
  8. Ahab

    Ahab Well-Known Member

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    What a bunch of self important a-holes!

    Why not just go to a hardware store and buy some?

    Oh! They don't have them ..... must be a special size screw!

    Ever try to buy a special screw for your camera, scope, or any other specialty item? Do you scream about that also?

    Oooops! Sorry ... I forgot that most of you never have run a business!
     
  9. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    I also paid dearly for a couple of small gold plated screws for my EELL. I had to get them from Coles and they were $5 each plus shipping. If you have a captive audience the chances of getting screwed are much higher.

    ss
     
  10. Ed Y

    Ed Y TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Phil,
    I deliberatly left out the name of this very well known vendor/gunsmith. I just wanted you all to know how foolish I was and for all of you to be carefull of what you ask for.

    Ed Yanchok
     
  11. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Ed- I am very sorry you are unhappy, but at least you made someone else happy.

    Pat Ireland
     
  12. SF SGM

    SF SGM Member

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    More than likely the same "Reputable" gunsmith who 2 years ago at the grand charged me $30.00 for the screw that goes in the barrel selector of a Beretta o/u. He is well known and a lot of people try him at least once. He got me once but not again!

    VaN
     
  13. blkcloud

    blkcloud Active Member

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    I've run a machine shop for 25 years..nothing used to please me more than some one walk in off the street, need some oddball screw made, which you couldnt buy one at the hardware store if you had a sack full of gold.. stop what I was doing, spend 30 minutes making it, charge him $10.. then they balk at the price and tell me to just keep it..
    Ed, add 30% to what you paid to the price of the screws or tell the guy to drive there himself, and pick them up..
     
  14. need to shoot more

    need to shoot more Active Member

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    Purchase, mark up and go to the bank supply and demand supply was limited and the demand was there
     
  15. semperfi909

    semperfi909 Well-Known Member

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    If you'd gotten those screws at a Honda or Toyota dealer's parts counter they prolly would have been more like $15 apiece. Check out how many $hundreds a computer module costs for about $.75 worth of components and they make MILLIONS OF THEM. Bend over and grab it - or walk.
     
  16. Rastoff

    Rastoff Active Member

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    This is not getting "screwed". The vendor told you a price and you chose to pay it. If Ed felt it was too much, he wouldn't have paid it at all. You can only be screwed when the vendor lies or cheats you. A price clearly set before hand is not lying or cheating.

    Now, some specialty screws can be very expensive. Have you guys priced the washers used for comb spacers? One little plastic washer can cost $0.75 or more. That's a lot to me. But then, it's all supply and demand. They have what you want and you're willing to pay their price, they'll continue to charge it.

    Value is ultimately decided by the guy writing the check. If those screws weren't worth $60 to Ed, he wouldn't have paid it.
     
  17. AveragEd

    AveragEd Well-Known Member

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    The mention of some less-skilled traveling gunsmiths reminds me of an experience - also at the PA State Shoot - from back in 1990 or 1991. I was a fairly new shooter and had recently bought a used KS-5. I read all the articles about shotgun barrels and listened to the wise gentlemen on gun club porches all over south central Pennsylvania. From that research, I learned that if I had my barrel "worked on," my patterns and my scores would improve.

    I took my gun to a gunsmith from western Pennsylvania who inspected the bore and told me he could make it shoot better patterns with less recoil if he lengthened the forcing cone. "How soon can you do it?" was all I wanted to know.

    He broke out his electric drill and a long reamer and proceeded to remove copious quantities of metal from my barrel. When no more would come out, he pronounced it finished and charged me what I thought was a fair amount.

    The next time I ran a cleaning rod though the barrel, I thought I felt "bumps" in there and asked another gunsmith to look at it for me. His eyes widened and he asked me who was in there. When I told him, he ran his bore gauge through the bore and showed me how much the indicator wobbled as the probe passed though the forcing cone area. He repaired it for me for next to nothing because he saw how distraught I was.

    Since then, I am very careful who I ask to do work for me. As I constantly tell customers and my children, this country is experiencing a severe shortage of craftsmen. I appreciate the ones like Ed Y. that we have left.

    Ed
     
  18. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Ed, it might be best to have called Krieghoff and talked to Braxton. He likely would have given them to you for free. If you went to the notorious thief and invited a screwing on some screws you should have known better. Like the rest of shooters who seemingly enjoyed getting screwed by that individual and keep going back for more-TS!!
     
  19. Shoot-at-em

    Shoot-at-em TS Member

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    I paid $12.00 for a spring no bigger than a staple for my 682. The gun was useless without it.
     
  20. 700X-user

    700X-user Member

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    I am not taking sides on this thread! But I can see both sides of the argument on this one. I have been a Tool & Die maker for over 23 years. People think nothing of dropping stuff off at my house for me to fix. "Can't you just take 5 minutes off of your lunch break to fix this?

    After one of my friends did this about 3 times over a 2 month period I decided to reverse the roles on him. My friend is a letter carrier for the post office. One day I dropped off 5 or 6 letters at his house and asked him to take them to work and mail them for me. I purposely didn't put any stamps on them, he immediately pointed this out to me. Stamps? You don't need any stamps! You work at a post office don't you? Mail them at lunch time. I admit it wasn't very subtle. We are still friends to this day. At least now he asks me how much it will cost to fix something. If it was so easy to fix why did he bring it to me. If anybody and his brother could fix it, it wouldn't cost so much.

    My point is this! You can't compare precision tool & die work to the mass produced bolts and screws you buy at your local Ace hardware. There is a reason why they don't use 1/4- 20 carriage bolts to hold your guns together.

    The threads that are used on screws and bolts in gunsmithing are very fine precision threads. These parts are designed for a particular purpose. This is not something the average person can even relate too or understand. It took over 4 years of schooling and on the job training for me to get my Journeyman's card. You want me to make a part for your gun and you balk at paying the high price. But you think nothing of walking into BestBuy and asking some pimple faced kid just out of high school his opinion on which $2000.00 flat screen TV to buy.

    Go Figure!

    Ed
     
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