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Schools are not locked I have proof

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Dr.Longshot, Dec 14, 2012.

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  1. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    Today after this all happened the school nurse called my son and said your daughter is sick, you need to pick her up, he drove to the school and walked in the un-locked door and went to office to pick-up my grand daughter.
    He was pissed that he could just walk in the school doors un locked.

    Baltimore, Ohio School Elementary just 2 hours after the Ct. Shooting.


    Gary Bryant
    Dr.longshot
     
  2. fast gun

    fast gun Active Member

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    Most schools are that way I think they should have more security or security guards. I would go to the next school board meeting and throw a major fit They would probably say we dont have the funding.
     
  3. crusha

    crusha TS Member

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    I don't doubt it.


    Schools need to do a 9-11 style assessment of their procedures, NOW.


    It's not 1970 anymore, and it's plainly apparent schools are the target of the video-game-shooter psychos, and it will keep happening, and happening, and happening.


    We can't stop it, but we've got to re-evaluate the duck-and-cover model. The violent video game players are getting better at this, and we've got to focus on getting the kids running and moving for the nearest exit, or else installing solid doors everywhere inside.


    The duck-and-cover protocol, combined with doors that have glass in them, is just going to get kids killed.
     
  4. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

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    Most schools in Ohio are new (built with tobacco money) and have the latest lock down security systems.

    They just don't use them the way they are designed. Too much hassel for the staff.

    Bet that changes!
     
  5. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    The quickest way to demoralize Americans is to KILL THEIR CHILDREN.

    Check out the Beslan School Massacre. HUNDREDS of deaths.
     
  6. PatMiles

    PatMiles Well-Known Member

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    In a former life I worked for the local telco here in Albuquerque. I went to a public elementary school to install a T1 circuit. I parked my company truck about a block away due to lack of available parking and walked into the office with my tools and equipment where I told the receptionist what I was there to do. She gave me a visitors pass and off I went. After I completed the install I went back to the office and asked for the principal. Explaining that I wanted to show her the location of the equipment so she could show their vendor when he came to extend the circuit. After showing her we were walking out and I asked her how she knew who I really was and why I was really there as nobody up to that point had asked me for my company ID or to see the work order. I had no company branded clothes on and only carried a tool bag. I could have been a bad guy and done whatever I wanted without a soul challenging me. She was perplexed at first and then fear showed on her face when she finally realized what I was saying. I showed her my ID and the circuit order and told her that her people did a poor job of vetting visitors. I have no idea if she made any changes with her staff after I left as I never went back to that particular school.

    Pat
     
  7. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

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    About six years ago there was a shooting at my son's school. Tragic story where a student brought a gun to school. He shot the ceilings and walls and ultimately took his own life (no others hurt).

    The school's policy was to go into 'lock-down.' Students, teachers, etc. were to go to rooms and lock/barricade the doors.

    A custodian from the school talked to the boy through his locked door, and actually had the boy put down the gun, but because of the policy he did no go into the hall to retrieve the gun. The boy finally grabbed the gun once again and fired a single round into his head.

    In follow up queries I found the school's policy rather odd. There is a police station about 200 yards from the school. Would it not make more sense for the kids to run there for protection??

    When I challenged the administration on this the final response I got was "we need an accurate head count at the end of the day."

    They didn't care if the people were alive or dead - just that they had to have a true and accurate number.

    Bureaucrats...
     
  8. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Run 200 yards exposed outside? After being exposed in the school with a group of scared and unmanageable children? Are you insane? Have you never served in the military? Lucky you arent in charge of school HLDS

    Now Dr Longshot- your son is hours away from the shooting and he wants his daughters school in lockdown? Every school in America should be in lockdown? Maybe kids should never go to school and just be homeschooled?

    Security in schools- just like airports would cost big money. Did you vote yes for the last school bond ? Or just raise property taxes to gain walking patrols with dogs around the schools? Exactly what is the plan and what is the level of security?

    Regards from Iowa

    Gene

    HDLS

    PS- and you are in charge and hundreds are being slaughtered in the confusion in the hallway

    How do you know another gunman or person isnt outside just waiting for the targets to appear?

    How do you prevent the kids from getting run over in the road/

    How do you account for them later?
     
  9. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

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    Yes Gene,

    Run 200 yards outside a building - the kind with windows which do not open, so if he wanted to fire at them he would need to shoot out the windows first (a 20 round mag will only get you so far). This would expose him to being overpowered by others still within the building while he was focused on the outside.

    Every yard I gain decreases his likelihood of a hit - sitting in a classroom almost guarantees it.

    Also, most buildings have four sides - an individual can only cover one so his field of fire would be very limited.

    Stop being a sheep, and take your meds.

    I would rather my son had a chance to survive than sit and wait to die...

    Addendum

    Turns out my niece (wife's side) works at the Sandy Hook School.

    From what I have heard she hid her class safely away until the danger had passed - she comes from good stock...

    Wow...
     
  10. School Teacher

    School Teacher Well-Known Member

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    As a substitute teacher, I work in a different school almost every day. Sometimes I teach on a full time basis for a month or two when a teacher is out for an extended period of time. Some of these schools are "alternative" schools for middle and high school students that have exhibited disruptive behavior in their regular schools. These "alternative" schools have enhanced security similar to that you find in airports and court systems.

    In both normal and "alternative" schools, we have fire drills, tornado drills and lock down drills and published policies and procedures.

    This enhanced security takes a longer time for students to enter or leave school and more staff. They IMO are necessary and effective but not foolproof. They also are expensive. Some schools have student populations in excess of 1000 students and some over 2000 students. These students have to enter the schools within a 30 minute time window with large numbers of students arriving at once when a school bus arrives. Adding airport type security with sufficient capacity to allow 1000 students to enter in a short time window would be very costly.

    Many things are possible with more school taxes including more teachers for smaller class sizes, improved facilities and security, better textbooks and so on. How much is the public willing to pay?

    In the schools I visit, all doors are kept locked during the school day and visitors and temporary staff are required to wear badges. Overall, the security is light years beyond some of the banks and corporations I worked before I retired and became a teacher.

    Yet even tight security can be compromised by broken window or a door held open by a pencil or tape over a lock.

    If an individual is determined to create an incident, no school, workplace, public place, etc. is 100% secure.

    One thing that scares me is the violent content of many video games that today's youth love to play. They glamorize automatic weapons and provide realistic sound effects. Nobody really dies in these games but IMO some kids see these games as normal behavior in everyday life. If something or somebody bothers you, just blow them away.

    Ed Ward
     
  11. Bob Hawkes

    Bob Hawkes Well-Known Member

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    Very true Ed. The one common thread that seems to be is the age group. We have a whole new generation of young people who were brought up with the violent video's, no work ethic, or responsibility for ones actions. How many of our young people are on medications for issues that years ago were handled differently. As a society we/they just take the easy way out. Shame on us.
     
  12. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    GN777777 my sons schools front doors should not be open for anybody to just walk in, all doors should be locked so no one can enter.

    But look at it this way what if a conspiracy was going to happen and a lot of schools were in the same situation. We don't know that.

    I worked for a city as a building inspector when 911 came down, we locked the city bldgs and schools and sent everyone home as we were under attack and we treated it that way.

    AIR FORCE ONE flew low over my area with fighter escort w/President Busch aboard, it was only a few thousand feet above Delaware County, Ohio.

    Tell me schools should leave doors un-locked, I think you know the answer.

    I had a hell of a time sleepinging and crying last night for those kids, some may have bled to death as there was no one to stop the bleeding and I can hear them crying for mommy and daddy for help. Now tell me that does not make you cry.

    Gary Bryant
    Dr.longshot
     
  13. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

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    Bob, I agree. (have you noticed we agree a lot?) When you consider that we use to take guns on our school bus so we could hunt on the way home, or even store them in our shop class closet, and everyone had one in their truck, and we had just as many guns as we do now...Something has changed, and it's not the guns.

    When you have twice a many people now as we did in the 70's, you'll have twice as many mental cases. On top of that, we have fewer mom/dad families, more fractured households, less ethics and morals, and virtually no teaching of personal responsibility. But the media will blame the gun.

    I believe that if this 20 year old didn't get into the building, he would have probably run over the Superintendant or a bunch of kids on the sidewalk with a car, or caused death some other way.

    I'd still like to know how he got into the building when they had lockdown door hardware.
     
  14. Catching Chrome

    Catching Chrome Member

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    While in the 60's there were bomb drills and now I wonder if schools should conduct homeland terrorism drills for these type of situations. It makes me sick to think that our country has come down to this where people are killing people like this. I was worried about talking to my kids about sex and the pressure of drugs, now it seems like those are the least of my worries.
     
  15. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    So Longshot you still think every school in the country should have been locked down because like 9-11 there could have been a conspiracy huh? How do you sleep at night?

    And HDLS- like I stated- lucky you dont have any responsibility of any type for childrens safety, because you couldnt handle it-- what part of you cant understand that if you put everyone out in the halls attempting to run from the school (heck they will even trample themselves to death) that they are sitting targets- that people will be killed in the hallways- that people moving 200 yards in an open area are sitting ducks?

    Yet you all want to critique what happened the other day and attempt to blame it on the schools? You are insane, inept and pitiful. Did you son do that?

    Regards from Iowa

    Gene

    PS what parents usually are pissed off about is that they have to take off and go get their sick child that they shouldnt have sent to school in the first place but that they didnt want to pay for child care or take off work. Who would send a knownly sick child to school to infect others? Is that what your son did?
     
  16. Jerry944t

    Jerry944t Well-Known Member

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    As has been noted the latest reports are that the murderer shot out a window to gain entrance.

    He had it all thought out.
     
  17. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    GN77777 she was not sick when she went to school and my son had the day off, get real, all school doors should be locked when school is in session, it is cold here and the kids go to the gym for exercise.

    People who think like you are the problem.

    An ounce of safety is worth a ton of non thinking people.

    They reported earlier that the shooter was buzzed in as they knew him, I bet the window was shattered by police getting in to get to shooter.

    The shooter was arguring with the principal and swearing was on the school intercom before he shot the principal.

    Because the intercom was on teachers locked their doors.

    Childrens safety is my top priority.

    Get a grip Gene.



    Gary Bryant
    Dr.longshot
     
  18. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    MR LS- and so you hire a full time policeman to guard each door and window during school hours?

    How do visitors get in by the way?

    So people are saying that the gunman broke the window but you somehow believe that the police broke the window and this is all part of a coverup?

    Let me go out on a limb here about sick kids- your sons daughter was sick when she was sent to school

    Maybe we not only should have locked down schools 1000 miles away like your sons but lets lock down Alaska and Hawaii also- heck lets send them all home for 2 weeks until we start congressional hearings at least to see if this is a conspiracy? Maybe Obama is involved? Get real. This is the real world and you want to critique people who were on the ground and made the deciions at that time?

    Regards from Iowa

    Gene

    HDLS in case you missed my earlier PS

    PS- and you are in charge and hundreds are being slaughtered in the confusion in the hallway

    How do you know another gunman or person isnt outside just waiting for the targets to appear?

    How do you prevent the kids from getting run over in the road/

    How do you account for them later?
     
  19. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    The two most common denominators in these mass shooting cases are, mentally ill, and access to the guns. Access to the buildings is really just a second line of defense, that in most cases would not be needed if the guns where not easily accessed. Mass killings are much harder to accomplish, and have to be thought out, taking more time to commit, than just picking up a gun. Are we going to close all public access buildings, and put armed guards outside, require everyone employed inside these buildings to carry, and shoot anyone that is a threat? Really, is that feasible? What would the cost be, as to the results? Do you think that there maybe is a cheaper, more effective way?

    I think what has to be understood is this mentally ill kid obviously had bad thoughts about his Mother. Because he was mentally ill, he not only killed her, but anyone associated with her that cared about her with feelings maybe he did not think he received from her. He killed the kids that where in her class that she taught. The kids that liked her as their teacher, the Principle, etc.

    THE PROBLEM WAS THE ACCESS TO THE GUNS, not the guns or type themselves. As was stated above he had access to the mothers own guns, that where not secured as they obviously should have been, especially with a known mentally ill kid in the house. So, why where the guns not trigger locked, or stored in a locked safe? Maybe they where, but then he had access to the key. The blame in this case is the access to the guns, as it is to blame in most of these cases in mass shootings. Access in this case could have been easily prevented. The impossible part is determining which people are incompetent enough to restrict gun purchasing, if there are no signs of violence, or proven mental illness.

    As far as thinking that this was planned by the Government, that is so far out there I can hardly comprehend that I am talking about it in this manner, IMO.
     
  20. tanda1

    tanda1 Active Member

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    I wonder if easy access to knives, cleavers and hammers were the problem in the school attacks that occurred in China in 2010 and 2011.

    Seem to recall that the focus was on mental illness as the root cause.
     
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