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Rush on BATF and Gunrunnergate....

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by Brian in Oregon, Mar 4, 2011.

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  1. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    RUSH: I've got this story down in the stack today. Apparently the US government had a policy to willingly allow AK-47s and other guns to flow into Mexico unobstructed. ICE agents, border agents, were told this. One of them has gone public now, one of them's blowing the whistle because he didn't understand the policy and doesn't understand it and has a put his neck out there, stuck his neck on the line, put his head on the line, stuck his neck out by going public with the policy. They were to look the other way. Guns were to be allowed into Mexico. These guns ended up in the hands of drug cartels and others and have been used to kill Americans.

    American guns allowed to go into Mexico! We keep hearing about guns coming into Mexico but one of the reasons they're coming in is because they're leaving this country first, and this guy went on and said, "I have to understand the people. Why are we doing this?" and he was told, "The reason we're doing it is so we can track the movement. We want to see where these guns actually end up and what route they take to get here," and the guy is saying, "Well, fine and dandy, but why are we providing the guns in the first place? They're being used against Americans!" Dead ICE agent, for example.

    All right, now, this from CBS News. This is Sharyl Attkisson reporting: "Federal agent John Dodson says what he was asked to do was beyond belief. He was intentionally letting guns go to Mexico? 'Yes ma'am,' Dodson told CBS News. 'The agency was.' An Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms senior agent assigned to the Phoenix office in 2010, Dodson's job is to stop gun trafficking across the border. Instead, he says he was ordered to sit by and watch it happen. Investigators call the tactic letting guns 'walk.' In this case, walking into the hands of criminals who would use them in Mexico and the United States. Center for Public Integrity report Dodson's bosses say that never happened.

    "Now, he's risking his job to go public. 'I'm boots on the ground in Phoenix, telling you we've been doing it every day since I've been here,' he said. 'Here I am. Tell me I didn't do the things that I did. Tell me you didn't order me to do the things I did. Tell me it didn't happen. Now you have a name on it. You have a face to put with it. Here I am. Someone now, tell me it didn't happen.' Agent Dodson and other sources say the gun walking strategy was approved all the way up to the Justice Department," Eric Holder. "The idea was to see where the guns ended up..."

    These are AK-47s and the like, by the way, that we're talking about. We wanted the guns to end up in Mexico so we could see exactly where they ended up and then build a case and take down a cartel, and we didn't even tell the government of Mexico this is what we were doing. Project gun runner been going on since 2005. Now, "ATF named the case 'Fast and Furious.' Surveillance video obtained by CBS News shows suspected drug cartel suppliers carrying boxes of weapons to their cars at a Phoenix gun shop. The long boxes shown in the video being loaded in were AK-47-type assault rifles.
    "So it turns out ATF not only allowed it -- they videotaped it. Documents show the inevitable result: The guns that ATF let go began showing up at crime scenes in Mexico. And as ATF stood by watching thousands of weapons hit the streets... the Fast and Furious group supervisor noted the escalating Mexican violence. One e-mail noted, '958 killed in March 2010 ... most violent month since 2005.' The same e-mail notes: 'Our subjects purchased 359 firearms during March alone,' including 'numerous Barrett .50 caliber rifles.' Dodson feels that ATF was partly to blame for the escalating violence in Mexico and on the border.

    "'I even asked them if they could see the correlation between the two,' he said. 'The more our guys buy, the more violence we're having down there.' Senior agents including Dodson told CBS News they confronted their supervisors over and over. Their answer, according to Dodson, was, 'If you're going to make an omelette, you've got to break some eggs.' There was so much opposition to the gun walking, that an ATF supervisor issued an e-mail noting a 'schism' among the agents. 'Whether you care or not people of rank and authority at HQ are paying close attention to this case...we are doing what they envisioned.... If you don't think this is fun you're in the wrong line of work...

    "'Maybe the Maricopa County jail is hiring detention officers and you can get $30,000 ... to serve lunch to inmates...' On Dec. 14, 2010, Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry was gunned down. Dodson got the bad news from a colleague. 'We just knew it wasn't going to end well. There's just no way it could,' Dodson said. According to Dodson, 'They said, "Did you hear about the border patrol agent?" And I said, "Yeah." And they said "Well it was one of the Fast and Furious guns." There's not really much you can say after that.'" Two assault rifles ATF had let go nearly a year before were found at Terry's murder. Dodson said, 'I felt guilty. I mean it's crushing. I don't know how to explain it.'

    "Sen. Grassley began investigating after his office spoke to Dodson and a dozen other ATF sources -- all telling the same story." For the life of me, I can't understand the purpose of this operation. I do not understand. I'm open to having it explained to me. Obama just yesterday in the press conference with Felipe Calderon assured the government of Mexico that US agents working in Mexico would not be armed, but we're letting guns "walk" from Phoenix gun show. They're being bought by Mexican cartel members and walked back home, and they end up being used for criminal purposes. I guess the stated purpose here is to capture these guys in criminal act. It's one thing to buy the gun, I guess it's legal, at a gun show, take it across the border and use it in a crime. It's apparently what's going on. That's what is meant by, "You gotta break some eggs if you want to make an omelet."

    One other thing. I don't go to gun shows, but do they sell that kind of quantity? I mean, can somebody walk in and buy that kind of quantity of AK-47s? Can you go to a gun show and buy 200 AK-47s and walk 'em across the border? That doesn't sound right. I don't know. But there's an ATF operation, and they are letting this happen. Now, don't forget Obama wanted evidence. The left has an accusation out there about crime and drugs: "You think they're coming from Mexico? No!" Remember this? It's all part of the illegal immigration business here. The pro-illegal immigration, the amnesty crowd is questioning this notion that crime and drugs come from Mexico.

    So what better way to counter that than to have the guns come from America, to take Mexico out of the equation? So the guns coming in are not a problem as far as immigration. "Those guns are American! It's a whole different thing." What better way to stop one of the arguments that would say, "Tighten the borders because of all the crime, all the drugs, all the guns coming from Mexico"? That's one argument. How better to nullify that than to end up arranging for the guns to be American guns? Look, I wouldn't put it past this bunch. You know damn well they want amnesty. They're losing independent voters fast.

    We know what this is all about. We know what the immigration push is all about; getting new voters for the Democrat Party, expanding the welfare state. Pure and simple that's what it's about, and yet all this crime coming into the country from Mexico, the drug cartels, the guns. Well, what better way to refute the argument that it's coming from Mexico than for the guns to end up being American? So if you run the regime, you are the regime. You come up with a program designed to (as far as public is concerned) be able to track the drug cartels so you let American guns "walk" into Mexico; those guns end up being used in crimes in the United States. "Those are not Mexican guns," the regime can say. "Those are American guns! We don't have a problem here." (interruption)

    Do we have to apologize to Mexico for sending the guns to them? No. Remember, now, they're not officially admitting that's what's going on. We've had a whistleblower, Agent Dodson, saying this is what's going on, but we're not admitting it, but the story is now out. The whistleblower's done his job. CBS, the source of the story, is doing it's job, reporting: The gun that killed the border agent is an American AK-47; it wasn't Mexican gun. This has been a huge argument, folks. It's been a huge argument. With the ranchers being shot, Arizona trying to stanch the flow of illegals, one of the big arguments has been the crime element, the criminal element of all this. Mexican guns and so forth.

    So now you have, "Looky here! Looky here! They're American guns, they're not Mexican guns."

    It's just a thought.
     
  2. TOOLMAKER 251

    TOOLMAKER 251 Active Member

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    I would bet that both #1 and #2 halfbreeds were behind it, perhaps to cause a civil war in Mexico.
     
  3. 221

    221 Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    It's standard procedure anymore.......why can't we see that this nonsense just does not happen.....it's a business, these agencies, like the ATF and the DEA, Xe, the military.....the all need the business.

    Things have got out of hand, and these people, who are paid to protect us are out of control.

    There's way TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much money to be made in this war on drugs, terror, immigration........These things are all being fueled by out of control agencies who are making careers out of it.

    They used to say that no general could die and rest in peace unless he had his own war.

    You can see it every day , on the news on these cop shows, where cops are making the decisions to let drug dealers walk in return for a bigger piece of bait......look how many times you hear that a weapons or drug dealer was under surveillance for 2 years.......all the while whole departments are drawing overtime checks.
     
  4. Ahab

    Ahab Well-Known Member

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    Maybe it is time for the Head of BATF to be charged with Accessory t Murder!
     
  5. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

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    You don't understand. Those guns might have been going to an arcade game down there like "shoot the zombie" or something. BATFE had NO IDEA where those guns might end up. They had to KNOW! I'm sure they are shocked, simply SHOCKED they ended up in a drug cartel's armory. Well anyway now they know. They can just run right down there and arrest Mr. D. Cartel and bring him back and have a nice quiet day in court and then everything on the border will be good again.
     
  6. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Wireguy, maybe BATF thought there was a chance Mexican trapshooters were getting them, and they had to know for sure before arresting anyone.
     
  7. shelly

    shelly TS Member

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    That seems reasonable Brian, the BATF was jut trying to help out those Mexican trapshooters- LOL
     
  8. Hawk46

    Hawk46 TS Member

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    The scary part here is not just the idea that the ATF is ensuring job security.

    The real agenda here may well be to make a case for gun control. Obama and his libs can say, "See what happens when people can buy guns? Sales need to be strictly limited, guns need to be registered, gun shows need to end, sales between individuals need to be reported or made illegal. Bad things happen when people can buy and sell guns."

    What better way to build support for gun control than to allow guns to cross the border so that they can blame "American guns" for all the killings? "Gee, it's not the fault of the poor innocent drug runners, it's all the fault of our gun laws. People don't kill people - legally purchased guns kill people."

    Think about it.
     
  9. unplugged

    unplugged Active Member

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    They "lost control" of many of these guns and TWO of them were used to kill our BORDER AGENT!Our Border agent that was required to use BEAN BAGS FIRST! Before deadly force on these drug creeps, that had AK47's from the ATF!!!
    WTF is wrong with those in power here!!


    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/03/04/eveningnews/main20039492.shtml?tag=cbsnewsTwoColUpperPromoArea
     
  10. quartering

    quartering Active Member

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    legalize drugs. problem solved. good luck with it
     
  11. 221

    221 Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Y'all Recall in the early days the commanders in Iraq got the wild idea to hand out Ak47's and Rpgs so every household had one......then later on, they gave one of the factions another 10,000 AKs and RPGs, and enough ammo to last almost forever????????


    OH and all the while, our field commanders and officers were giving away, millions in cash to just about anyone that asked for it. Cash lost and unaccountable.....just wrote off.

    I would love to live another 75 yrs to read what the truth really is.
    We are only now learning the truth and what has been myth about WWII and Korea...A lot of Vietnam has been finally investigated and more of the facts are coming out regularly.
     
  12. crusha

    crusha TS Member

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    Ok, allow me to write the remainder of the story:


    Obama makes a statement: "It makes no sense to me....uuuhhhh...that American authorities should be providing...uuuuhhhh....guns to Mexican drug dealers..." So maybe some ATF supervisor loses his government pension...Eric Holder leaves a year from now to join some big Chicago law firm (with Rahm Emmanuel funneling business his way), and the Regime washes their hands of it...end of story.


    Issue over.


    It will be another Ruby Ridge. The Drive By Media will lose interest fast. (221, be sure to report back to the group, as soon as Daily Kos reports it was BUSH's FAULT!)
     
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