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Reloading Discount Hulls

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by phirel, Nov 10, 2008.

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  1. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Is it possible that the steel heads used on discount shells could cause breech wear when they are reloaded?

    Pat Ireland
     
  2. pendennis

    pendennis Well-Known Member

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    Pat, wouldn't the breech of the gun be made of much harder steel than the head of the shell? It doesn't seem like it would cause any wear. Also, as doda wrote, if you resize, there shouldn't be any friction wear.

    Just a thought.

    Best,
    Dennis
     
  3. School Teacher

    School Teacher Well-Known Member

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    Pat:

    I don't shoot near as much as some on this forum but I did shoot about 5,000 shells last target year, in ATA, turkey matches and practice. For a while, at the beginning of the year, I shot about 1,000 Federal Top Gun and Estate and I began to have problems with hard ejection and stuck hulls in the two 870's that I shoot.


    I have switched to brass only hulls (Gold Medals and STS) and the brass headed hulls simply slide out with very little resistance. No more steel headed hulls for me.


    Yesterday, at a registered shoot, I had to switch to my backup 870 because one my primary 870's action bars broke in half. I can think back to the many instances of difficult ejection and the excessive force needed to eject the hull. I have replaced action bars three times previous to this over the years so this type of failure happens. However, given how smooth brass heads simply slide out, no more steel headed hulls for me.


    Ed Ward
     
  4. butch's90t

    butch's90t Member

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    I was informed by one of the gunsmiths that post on this forum that he has seen damage done by using steel hulls. I won't use steel hulls!
     
  5. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    If you resize the steel type hulls and your gun is set to extract only---what kind of additional where could I expect & what should I look for?

    Lou
     
  6. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Giacomo used to reccommend Remington primers when reloading. He said the other primers were made of steel and would cause wear damage to your gun. HMB
     
  7. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    Get a Browning. 50,000+ cheap shells through my BT 99 and no noticiable breech face wear.

    While I understand resizing the prevent chamber wear I don't understand it for breech face wear.
     
  8. miketmx

    miketmx Well-Known Member

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    Pat, on your original post you mentioned reloaded hulls and I don't understand how reloads would wear the breech any worse than the factory loads. I don't reload the steel base hulls as I use only new style AA brass base hulls for my reloads. I am a little nervous about damage to the gun from the steel base shells and at the Grand I had the firing pin hole on my TMX repaired.
     
  9. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    I fired several hundred thousand rounds through the Unsingle barrel of my K-80.

    Almost all of them were steel based hulls and Cheddite primers. After properly cleaning the gun, there was no detectable wear on the breech or chamber.

    I have seen guns, especially Ljutics, and others with less than robust ejectors have issues with these hulls. I have also seen pumps have extraction issues, generally because of rough or neglected chambers.

    My present clay target guns, Brownings and Perazzis, are beginning to get some serious miles on them with the same hulls and Cheddite and now Rio primers. I can detect no unusual wear.

    I imagine firearms that are neglected as far as cleaning and service may have issues and exhibit wear not evident in propery serviced firearms.
     
  10. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    Every time a shell is fired the breech face gets hammered. Pounding steel against steel has to do more damage than pounding brass against steel.
     
  11. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    miketmx - I did mention reloads in my original post. This is because upon firing, the face of the steel head becomes slightly bulged out and most resizers will not reform this surface well.

    Dennis- I am not certain about the relative hardness of steel shell heads and breech faces. In general, most gun parts are made of steel that is not very hard. Remember, with steel, hard = brittle and soft = strong.

    Pat Ireland
     
  12. fritzi93

    fritzi93 TS Member

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    I don't think hardness enters into this at all. For example, many mild steels rate about 150 Brinell (actually 112 to 163), while cartridge brass is nominally 155 Brinell.

    Cartridge brass is superior to copper in malleability and ductility, in the past this was an important consideration in the forming process. Furthermore, it is ductile enough to be used multiple times.

    Low carbon (mild) steel is more malleable/ductile than higher-carbon steel. Now, I have no way to test it (any metallurgists out there?) but it would make sense to use more-ductile mild steel for cartridges rather than anything else, plus it's cheaper.

    One characteristic many copper alloys share is low metal-to-metal friction, making them useful for bearings, for instance. I should think this is a factor when considering difficulty of extraction of brass versus steel.
     
  13. ljuticsscentennialpro

    ljuticsscentennialpro Member

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    Pat, The gunsmith I spoke to, mentioned the need to resleeve the chambers of some guns, due to the wear by steel bases. However, it takes alot of rounds to get to that stage. It's probably more of a problem with tighter chambers. Bob
     
  14. JB Logan Co. Ohio

    JB Logan Co. Ohio TS Member

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    Does anyone think that the way these steel based reloads are resized factor into the wear equation. It is my (fleeting) thought that a Mec type of resizer (collet) is a better base resizer than say my old Hornady 366 resizing method. I just know I don't have much of an issue with resized steel bases in my Browning auto. Anyone else notice this?

    JB=Jerry Beach 8503917
     
  15. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    My Mec 9000's are set with a chamber gauge that is actually an old pre war bolt action shotgun with the receiver and barrel cut off. It is tighter than any other chamber I have ever seen.

    When my hulls will fall in and out of this chamber, I know they will work in anything I am likely to shoot.

    Tightening the Mec collet one notch more than with brass shells has worked well for me.
     
  16. dr.beav

    dr.beav Member

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    Just a thought about Remington primers being brass. I just took a magnet and picked up a whole bunch of them at one time with it -- the box only says that the "anvel" is cartridge brass. I would guess the rest is plated steel just like all the rest -- and Remington primers are just not worth $169 per flat.
     
  17. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    dr.beav - Think about how much fun you can get from 5,000 Remington primers and then figure out how much they are worth.

    Pat Ireland
     
  18. dr.beav

    dr.beav Member

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    Pat: I believe I can have just as much fun on 5000 Winchester primers if they are made out of the same thing - and it looks like they are -- I have been believing Remington was better on the bolt face because of the brass - but it looks like there is very little brass in a Remington primer. Another bubble busted!!
     
  19. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    I have friend that for years has picked up anything on the ground (steel and brass shells) uses homemade or reclaimed shot, picks up old used wads, then cooks them back to shape in the wifes dryer, then buys the cheapest primer and powder available at the time. It all goes through a K-80, And has for years. He shoots anything that goes bang, and is cheap to make. He's a good shot, and to my knowlage has never had any problems shooting junk. Claim's he can make a box of shells for two bucks.
     
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