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Reduced miles per gallon

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by Barrelbulge(Fl), Jul 18, 2011.

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  1. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    About a year ago I started a thread on the reduced gas milage in my Chevy Blazer,it dropped about 3 or 4 mpg. I had a lot of suggestions about additives and tried some but to no real gain. I found out what the problem is,Ethanol.With E90 which is 10% Ethanol you loose approx. 3 mpg and with E85 15% ethanol you can loose 7 or 8 miles to the gallon. The gas station where I get my gas is tied in to a grocery chain here in Pittsburgh. The more you spend at the grocery store the more of a discount you get 10cents per $50 spent. The problem is their gas is E90 and their food prices are a little higher than the other food stores. You get less miles to the gallon and you pay a little more on groceries. The result is no real bargain. Nothing in life is free and the deals are not out there to favor you they benefit the seller.
    Below is my research on Ethanol miles per gallon.

    EconomyGas MileageThe Effect of Ethanol on Gas Mileage
    Top 5 To Try
    How to Improve Your Mileage When Driving 60About Ethanol FuelGas Stations That Do Not Add EthanolGas Mileage Using Ethanol Vs. Regular GasolineAdvantages of Ethanol GasAds by Google

    Related Topics
    Better Mileage
    Getting Better Gas Mileage
    The Effect of Ethanol on Gas Mileage
    X Russell HuebschRussell Huebsch has written freelance articles covering a range of topics from basketball to politics in print and online publications. He graduated from Baylor University in 2009 with a Bachelor of Arts degree in political science.
    By Russell Huebsch, eHow Contributor

    Print this article 10 percent ethanol blends will reduce gas mileage by 2 percent. Fuel producers refine ethanol from 100 percent pure-grain alcohol. Although ethanol helps the world meet its commitment to pollution reductions, ethanol also decreases the gas mileage a person gets from their car.

    Considerations
    Ethanol usually gets mixed into gasoline, with concentrations usually not going past 85 percent, called E85. Ethanol's effect on a car's fuel efficiency depends on the blend that the person uses. E85, for instance, reduces fuel economy by 7 to 8 miles per gallon when compared to gasoline, according to the Environmental Protection Agency.

    Identification
    Ethanol has 34 percent less energy than gasoline per gallon, which equates to about 2 to 3 miles per gallon for E10 (10 percent ethanol), according to the New York Times.

    Significance
    Many fuel stations put ethanol in gasoline automatically due to a U.S. law that demands 36 billion gallons of alternative fuel be made available in the United States by 2022.

    Prevention/Solution
    Consumers who do not wish to use any amount of ethanol in their vehicle should look for gas stations that claim to sell only 100 percent pure gasoline.


    Read more: The Effect of Ethanol on Gas Mileage | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/facts_5882696_effect-ethanol-gas-mileage.html#ixzz1SSuqj9tJ
     
  2. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

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    The mileage in my Blazer also dropped about 3 MPG with 10% ethanol blend. Let's see, if you add 10% ethanol and get 12 to 15% fewer miles per gallon, where is the savings? Sadly there are no stations here in our part of the People's Republic of Maryland that sell gasoline with no ethanol. The Free State is a misnomer.
     
  3. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    You are both on the right track!!

    We have a bulk plant where I live that sells "non-ethanol" gas. I recovered my loss of 4 miles to the gallon after my second tank full. They will sell it as long as they can get it from the refinery.

    Oh ya, I got some power back also. And the ruff idle has disappeared.

    1998 Ford Explorer. 5L V8
     
  4. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    I started using lucas fuel additive everytime I fill up and seem to have recovered some additional power. It isn't quite the dog it was when I have the A/C on. Bulge.
     
  5. Bvr Tail

    Bvr Tail Well-Known Member

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    a bit off-topic but,...........I was fueling at a local BP station when the tanker pulled in to fill the station tanks.

    As he started dumping, this terrible odor came over the area.

    The guy beside me started complaining, and I instantly started getting a little dizzy( I was a auto tech, and had been overcome by carbon monoxide several times, so I am fairly sensitive to odors).

    I quit fueling my Tahoe, as did the man next to me, and went inside to pay.

    Everyone was complaining to one of the clerks about the odor, and asked what it was in the fuel that was smelling so bad.

    She didn't know, but said it is always this way.

    After leaving, I drove about 2-3 miles when my vehicle slowed down and lost power. It took another 2-3 miles to regain momentum, but went on as usual.

    In the 70's, I owned a service station, and reports came in of distributors and jobbers adding "fillers" to the fuel. The fillers were cheaper than gasoline, and who thought it would matter......until the problems started.

    One station in Ohio paid several thousand in customer repairs, along with the lawsuits, and was forced out of business.

    What kind of junk are we paying for now?

    Danny
     
  6. chipking

    chipking TS Member

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    Unfortunately I have not found anyplace here around Fredericksburg VA that still sells non ethanol gas. All are 10% ethanol or E10 so I am stuck with it. If you think about it EVERY step in the emissions control effort beginning in 1972 has reduced basic fuel mileage. In fact if you look at the actual milage on a vehicle (my 2006 Dodge Ram work truck with a 4.7) compared with the same vehicle rated for E85 (my 2008 Dodge Ram work truck with a 4.7) the mileage will be significantly less on the E85 vehicle even when both were run on E10 fuel.

    --- Chip King ---
     
  7. Hauxfan

    Hauxfan Well-Known Member

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    On another note, but having to do with Ethanol.

    I had to have my catalytic converter changed on my Buick. It had started to plug up and then it will lose some power and get worse mileage.

    My mechanic said that this never used to happen until Ethanol came along and everyone started using it.

    He said he used to see maybe 2 vehicles a year with a failed catalytic converter, but now sees anywhere from 15-20 a month. He says he can't prove it, but he does think it eventually plugs up the converter much more than gasoline.

    Hauxfan!
     
  8. pyrdek

    pyrdek Well-Known Member

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    I have noticed in the past few months a significant reduction in MPG. I noticed this at about the same time that the local stations in our area got into a price war (or so I thought at the time). The price they were selling was about 19 to 22 cents a gallon cheaper than stations just 10 or 15 miles away.

    About the same time I noticed that, not only did the MPG go down but performance also suffered. I ended up filling up maybe once a week MORE often than in the past. I can see no change in anything else that would account for the decrease in mileage.

    Now I am beginning to wonder if it is not a price war but the refiners using our area as a "beta" test to see how many people notice the lowering of both performance and mileage, and how many actually complain about it. If there is not a large number of complainers then this may be the "New & Improved" gasoline sold in the future.

    One thing I did notice was that one station that did not have the "10% Ethanol Added" notice a few months ago now does show such a sticker. It is in print about 3/8" tall and is located just a few inches above ground. If you aren't actively looking for this you would never notice it.

    Barrelbulge, you may not want to mention the chain's name but I would be willing to bet it is "Giant Eagle". I am in northwestern PA and they do the same program up here as you mention. They were also a part of the price war. Incidentally, that price war is still going on. Today on my way to work gas in Meadville was $3.50 a gallon while in Saegertown only six miles away, it was selling at $3.69 a gallon.

    Most of my gas comes from "Country Fair" which is a local convenience store chain. It is Citgo brand gas. I have had the same problems with other brands sold locally also.

    Perhaps related, perhaps not, but my car, which I used to drive about 25 miles one way to and from work, but has now become my daughter's car effectively, down in Florida, suffered a plugged cat converter and bad O2 sensor only a couple of days after she arrived there. I am wondering if somewhere along the way she may have gotten some other gas, E85 or maybe something else, that reacted with deposits already left in the converter from the PA gas. I have to wonder if that possible reaction may have what wrote "Finish" to the converter.
     
  9. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    Ethanol has less btu's than gasoline so you have to burn more to get the same output. It is a Federal mandate that needs to be stopped.
     
  10. pdq

    pdq Member

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    When ethanol first came on the scene, Consumers Reports did a study involving different typs of cars, SUVs, etc.

    Their findings were consistent with what's mentioned above, i.e. yes, it is a "feel good, be green" statement to say we're now using 10% ethanol versus having to buy that much oil from the Middle East.

    However, their test confirmed that fuel mileage suffered across the board in the ehicles tested, such that by having to burn more of the blend per mile, they were consuming just as much of the oil based gasoline as previously. No measureable reduction in the amount of oil based fuel used.

    This is not a new issue, just one the politicians don't want to acknowledge given there's probably votes and campaign funding in the way.

    Pete
     
  11. Captain Bud

    Captain Bud TS Member

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    Maybe you guys just answered a question I was thinking. My wife and I drove from Phoenix to Avon, Colorado a couple of weeks ago.

    We were in the Beetle convertible which usually gets 28-30 mpg. As we filled in different areas on the way up, we noticed that the car was getting 33.2 and 33.4 mpg. And we were in the mountains????

    Maybe this is the answer.I think we use the E added fuel here in the Phoenix area.

    I will check for sure when I go by the station later today.

    Thanks for the info....

    Philip Santos
     
  12. sliverbulletexpress

    sliverbulletexpress TS Member

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    Ethanol has less BTU's per gallon than gasoline. Therefore it will take more of it to achieve the same power in a given engine. Interesting reading at the web site.

    Go talk to your local chainsaw/lawnmower repair place if you want to hear horror stories about ethanol.
     
  13. John Browning

    John Browning TS Member

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    The only place I can see Ethanol as a better choice, is in cities with smog and as a replacement for MTBE. MTBE is nasty petrolem based stuff that when it gets in a water supply, ruins it.
    E85 is 85% Ethanol and it takes more energy to produce than it saves and I have a farm. John 8703697
     
  14. ddrsuz

    ddrsuz Member

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    CAPTAIN- in the mountains you can use lesser grades of gasoline due to the thinner atmostsphere. We used to remind skiers that used high octane gas on the flatland that they could down grade in the mountains. Guess if we use ethanol, we should just all move up about 5,000 feet in elevation.

    d
     
  15. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    Ethanol in fuel is like watering the booze.


    Eric
     
  16. John Galt

    John Galt TS Member

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    Given the fact that E10 has about 2% less energy (BTUs) than E0, it's impossible for it to cause more than a 2% reduction in fuel economy. At 20 mpg that works out to a o.4 mpg drop, which wouldn't even be noticed.

    Anybody who has experienced a 20-40% drop has some have stated should look someplace else besides E10 as the cause. Still, the government shouldn't be forcing the oil companies to contaminate their fuel with ethanol, which causes all kinds of problems, not the least of which is making food prices go up.
     
  17. shannon391

    shannon391 Active Member

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    Our waterways are also being polluted from all the extra chemical corn needs dumped on it to grow in poor soil.
     
  18. oldgahchamp

    oldgahchamp Active Member

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    About 10 months ago, our 2003 Buick started running poorly and got worse each day. Diagnosis: Catalytic converter partly plugged. Was told by the shop owner it was probably ethanol related. The same thing happened to my Granddaughter's Mitsubishi. We used to get as much as 26-28 mpg. Now we're lucky to get 23 mpg. An earlier poster mentioned "horror stories" about small engines and chain saws. I agree 100% (from experience). Here in the Eastern Communist State of New York, ethanol is a mandate. I have not seen a gas station in months that does not sell that ethanol crap. Hess, Red Apple and Kwik Fill were the last to cave in to ethanol. Many big Farmers are bulldozing acres hedgerows to gain a few more bushels of corn. I have called and emailed our represenatives, but they just don't care. Larry Evans
     
  19. bill1949

    bill1949 Well-Known Member

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    I lose 4 MPG on my pick-up with ethanol gas. Thankfully we still have a place to get non ethanol gas...Bill
     
  20. Shoot-at-em

    Shoot-at-em TS Member

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    In my older vehicles I now have to use mid-grade fuel to off set the lack of power and mileage. Also, like someone mentioned above, in small engines they are now recommending that you use mid-grade or premium fuels and only mix enough 2 cycle that you need for 30 days. The ethanol breaks down the oil and attracks moisture.
     
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