1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

Recoil reducers, which one?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by KF9VH, Apr 24, 2009.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. KF9VH

    KF9VH TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    76
    Is the 100 straight dead mule recoil reduce better than the c&h mercury recoil reducer? The ones that fit a Beretta 390 from cap.

    You thoughts please.

    Thanks,

    Mike
     
  2. C Prince

    C Prince TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    351
    Mike,

    Are you looking to reduce recoil or add weight? If you are looking to reduce recoil, I would have to recomend Ken Ruckers "AutoBuster". It is about the only thing that will reduce felt recoil in an Auto.

    Chad
     
  3. KF9VH

    KF9VH TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    76
    I am wanting to reduce recoil with out spending hundreds on it. Just wondering which of the two reduces mentioned above is the most effective. Or if there are any other low cost options I should be looking into.

    Thanks
     
  4. j2jake

    j2jake Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,284
    Not trying to be a smart butt but have you tried softer loads? Jake
     
  5. JACK

    JACK Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    14,686
    Location:
    NW Wisconsin
    Jake. very true. Tah tis why I reload. Because you cannot buy softer lods off the shelf.
     
  6. KF9VH

    KF9VH TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    76
    Stick a fork in me I am done.
     
  7. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,226
    Location:
    Mesquite, Nevada
    <a href="http://s142.photobucket.com/albums/r104/HapMecTweaks/?action=view&current=recoilreduction.jpg" target="_blank">[​IMG]</a>

    Heres the best I ever used to reduce felt recoil, and, the cheapest! Copper tubing with melted lead. The above is 7/8ths OD, weighs approx.4.xx ounces per inch. Hap
     
  8. Steve Campbell

    Steve Campbell TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    31
    You could look into Angleport's recoil reducer. I use it on my 391 and have no issues with it.
     
  9. KF9VH

    KF9VH TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    76
    I looked at Angleport and did not see anything for a 390, only 391.

    Considering the cost perhaps I should just buy a 391 urika 2 target and forget about the 390.
     
  10. Steve Campbell

    Steve Campbell TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    31
    That is one issue with older guns-getting stuff for them.

    Shoot Angleport an email because if they made something in past for the 390, they might have one laying around that could work for you.

    You might want to compare thread size for the 391 and 390 and maybe you could retap the female opening on the reducer or have a bushing made if the 390 is smaller threads.

    I have an extra Angelport recoil reducer for the 391 that I could part with at a good price if you wanted.

    Good luck to you.
     
  11. KF9VH

    KF9VH TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    76
    Thanks for the offer Stone. I think I will not try to make a trap gun out of a 390 field gun. It seems it is just going to be a money pit.

    I will keep an eye out for a nice used 391 urika optima parallel target. That is what I had before and had great success with it.
     
  12. BT-100dc

    BT-100dc Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2008
    Messages:
    1,487
    I like the Edwards-type of recoil reducer. A good recoil reducer is worthless unless the gun fits and you're comfortable with your loads. BT-100dc
     
  13. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    4,771
    Location:
    Rapid City SD
    This thread usually pops-up annually and it has been over discussed, but here goes...

    Recoil can be represented in physics with the formula: F = ma; Force = mass x acceleration. Playing with number here, to reduce recoil, you need to increase mass.

    If you do a search for recoil reducers on this site, you will eventually get to the discussion at length about the uselessness of recoil reducers. In all honesty, they are a gimmick and worthless, save their MASS.

    Take a sock, pour some lead shot into it, tie it off and drop it on concrete. It won't bounce. This is to say that the recoil has been "absorbed" to a point by the mass of shot in the sock. Take a steel plate or ball and drop it on the concrete, it will bounce a bit. Take a recoil reducer, drop it and it will bounce, EXCEPT for a BearTrap. If you can drop a B/T correctly, you can even get it to stand up-right without any signs of bouncing. The bouncing is the recoiling effect.

    The BearTrap uses a lead weight, springs, and oil. It is as close to a recoil absorbing device as there it. I have used all of the recoil devices out there in the last 35 years. The BEST one is a PFS stock, but you are talking about well over $1,000.

    DO THIS: Remove your recoil pad, pour in some lead shot, top it off with a short plug to keep the shot off the pad,. That is about the best recoil reducing device you can devise AND the cheapest. What you have done is merely increased the mass (weight) of your gun, which helps to offset felt recoil

    No, it won't ruin your stock, as some have intimated here in the past. I have lead in all three of my expensive Perazzi trap gun stocks, and have had no problems whatsoever. The ONLY problem is when I want to adjust the comb, I have to remove the shot first, but that's no big deal.

    Here's a picture of some of the most current recoil reducers available. I took the time to cut them apart on the lathe to show folks how really ineffective and simplistic they are. The manufactures probably were not happy about this, but facts of physics are etched in stone; QED.

    [​IMG]

    Whiz White
     
  14. rodbuster

    rodbuster TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    713
    Good pics Whiz! I had wondered what was in those recoil devices. Thank you for the info.
     
  15. KF9VH

    KF9VH TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    76
    Thanks Whiz, you just saved me some cash.
     
  16. Steve Campbell

    Steve Campbell TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    31
    Awesome info.

    Whiz, can you explain though how the BT would work that it could stand up compared to a cylinder of just shot?

    I guess if I had a tube filled with lead shot and dropped it, it wouldn't stand up on its own. So what is happening in the BT that is not happening with the lead shot in the tube?

    Thanks in advance.
     
  17. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,226
    Location:
    Mesquite, Nevada
    The smaller the shot you put into the stock bolt hole, the more weight added. I've used shot in the stock bolt hole long enough that I didn't like the mess it makes when you do have to take the stock off!

    Study the popular models Whiz took apart? How far does the actual weighted part have to move before coming to a dead stop? By that time, "in shotgun speak", your gun has already kicked you because of the spring or fluid actions involved!

    The picture I posted above is the easiest to make and work with of any I've ever used, bar none, regardless of claims or price! It's also the heaviest I've made due to the internal size which holds a lot of melted lead! I have to use a heavy stocked gun and have for several years due to arthritis in my back and neck. I'm having a heavier than usual stock made to my specks, with a pre-drilled hole to accept the size weight shown above in case I need more weight later on. Costs? Pennies per inch instead of 50 to a hundred bucks for some fancy sounding device! Solid weight works better and is quicker acting on recoil than anything pictured above!

    Hap
     
  18. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    4,771
    Location:
    Rapid City SD
    I always forget about the Brownings with the hogged-out area in the butt-stocks.

    I did one here in the shop quite a while ago. I made a Plaster-of-Paris mold of the cavity, after I inserted a wood dowel into the cavity to serve as a stock bolt removal hole like on most stocks.

    I then removed the casting and dowel, and fashioned a wooden plug in the shape of the casting out of pine. I inserted that plug into the butt-stock, and then poured in some shot for the customer. I then made a Delrin plug with a partially drilled hole in its center, tapped it ΒΌ-20, so he could use a common bolt, if necessary, to remove the plug. The plug serves to keep the shot away from the recoils pad base. In some guns, the underside of the recoil pad is hollow, and I didn't want him changing pads and have to deal with that problem.

    Haps comments are so true. By the time the plugs move, the moment of inertia is long gone.

    I had a disagreement with the C&H Mercury guy when they first came on the market. Many arms manufacturers sell them or make provisions for them on their guns. Far be it from little old me getting in their way. BUT, it is a waste of money. Anyway, he gave me one to try, I did, and then gave it away.

    I had taken it apart and saw how it was made and just shook my head because it absolutely could not work, only its mass was the savior. If you sit down and think about it, looking at these devices, they make about as much sense as a Perpetual Motion machine. There's always a gimmick like the magnetic plug you put on your gas line???? As long as someone "thinks" a gimmick will work and is willing to give away his cash, there will be those who are willing to sell them.

    One can do a bit of Integral Calculus to determine the best mix of shot to get the maximum weight in a cylindrical cavity. I could have done that, but it's not that much rocket science to simply pour in shot and call it good. I still prefer shot versus a melted slug. Although you get more shot into a particular volume, each piece of shot is also smaller and therefore less mass. Think about your reloader's shot bushing... size of shot is not the concern, but the volume of shot in the bushing.

    Consequently, smaller shot makes better use of the voids (sphere-to-sphere compacting), but they still weigh less. This phenomenon just goes on and one. Pick the size you have and use it.

    Oh, forgot one thing (came back here and edited this in). Using a weighted mass, for instance in the barrel of an O/U, would be OK. The problem for me then is that the mass that far forward creates a second problem. Having to hoist up the gun 200-300 times at a shoot, my left arm would get darn tired of holding up that mass while shooting and swinging. It would serve to slow down one's swing a bit, if you needed that. I prefer to put the mass in the butt-stock and when it's sitting on your shoulder, your body frame can easily handle the added weight, more so than my forward arm.

    Whiz
     
  19. Shell Shucker

    Shell Shucker TS Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2009
    Messages:
    43
    Hi Mike

    The best recoil reducer I,ve ever used is the Enidine "Shot Stock" from
    Mesa Tactical.The Enidine shock is the heart of a butt stock conversion
    system for Remington 870 & Mossberg 500/590/835 pumpguns as well as AR-15
    based rifles. This system gives a true 70 percent recoil reduction using
    12ga. 2 3/4" heavy buckshot loads. With trap loads,the system is positively
    delightful to shoot. The bad news is that it's only available for the guns
    mentioned above at present.

    I built up a Remington 870 Tactical Dessert Recon using the Mesa Tactical
    "High-Tube" stock assembly w/Enidine shock.This model comes with a top rail
    (Picatinny type) to which I mounted a Simmons 42mm Red Dot scope using a
    Leapers picatinny riser mount.I use Carlsons and Comp-N-Choke tubes for all
    my shooting. My 870 "Space Gun" as most shooters call it at PITA shoots,gets
    a lot of attention from other shooters who want to try it. So far, everyone
    who tries it are smiling afterwards. At the last shoot I attended, this big
    Itailian guy with a Perazzi tried my gun and pronounced "This is the future
    of trap guns." Well it might be if some good shop with CNC machining equipment
    could make adaptor stocks for fancy O/U and single shot guns that trap folks love.

    I'm now building up a Mossberg 835 with a 28" vent-rib barrel and Mesa Tactical
    "Low Tube" Recoil Stock so the "Barrel Pointer" types can give it a try.
    These stock assemblies w/Enidine shock are quite affordable at around $400 bucks complete and are worth every penny.

    Happy Blastin'

    JJ Clarke
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Search tags for this page
100 straight dead mule recoil reducer
,
c&h mercury recoil reducer
,

dead mule recoil reducer

,
dead mule recoil reducer review
,
edwards recoil reducer review
,
mule recoil reducer
,
recoil reducer
,
shotgun recoil reducers review