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Question on Pat Trap breaking targets

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by jsalling, Mar 31, 2010.

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  1. jsalling

    jsalling TS Member

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    I am a member of a hunting & fishing club which bought a Pat Trap machine that
    throws singles, doubles & wobble. We have very few members who use the machine so it can often go weeks without being used. We bought it new about 3 years old & it has worked beautifully until about a month ago. All of a sudden it has started letting the target often drop at an angle on the thrower arm and when the target is thrown it breaks coming out of the machine. We threw about 1,000 targets today and I suspect we only got 350 whole targets. I have very little mechanical skills myself. We have a few guys who seem pretty savy when it comes to working on machinery, but at this point they are stumped.

    I have replaced the brush which helps hold the target. We have adjusted the little rail at the back of the machine. We have messed with the micro switch on the left of the machine. There is about 1/8 inch clearance between the thrower arm and the table where the target rests before being hit with the thrower arm. I question it would be wise to lower it so there would be less clearance.

    Has anyone had this problem before? If so do you remember how to solve the problem? Any constructive suggestions would be appreciated.

    Thanks!
    Jim Salling
     
  2. Bob Hawkes

    Bob Hawkes Well-Known Member

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    Jim, I would give a call to Pat Trap. It sounds like a timing issue where it's falling at an angle.

    Also, hopefully Vince will notice your post and be able to help. Good luck, Bob
     
  3. jsalling

    jsalling TS Member

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    I talked to someone up there about a month ago, but I am not swift enough to be able to follow his suggestions. He did talk about the bicycle-like chain going around a gear that could be out of kilter. I probably need to get someone else to talk to them. BTW, it is terrible to be as dumb as I am!

    Thanks!
    Jim
     
  4. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

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    not sure if this is the correct term.....but it sounds like the elevator is not lowering the birds,and as a result they fall onto the plate.....
     
  5. Mikeegak

    Mikeegak TS Member

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    It has been awhile since I worked on one, but I rememeber experiencing similiar symptons and found that the magazine was out of time and the target wasn't leaving the magazine cleanly and often dropped with a distinct clatter. I remember there was alot of target dust so I removed the magazine and thoroughly cleaned the entire machine. I did have to adjust the arm and the target rail slightly after cleaning but it stopped breaking targets. The post by YODA100 is another culprit that I experienced. Once I cleaned the crud out it worked fine. Good Luck. Pats can be quite aggravating.
     
  6. guerini

    guerini TS Member

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    Jim,

    It does sound like a timing problem, but it could be a number of things, I've worked on them for 12 years. If you want give me a call next time your at the club maybe I can walk you of someone through it... I sent you a PM...
     
  7. 320090T

    320090T Well-Known Member

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    If you think Pats can be aggravating you should work on some GMV's.
     
  8. cottondoctor

    cottondoctor Member

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    One of the conveniences of a cell phone – if you have cell phone coverage where the machines is located……..get in the house with the machine and get the folks at PAT on the line – I bet they can talk you through ID’ing the problem and correcting it. – Good machines and good people.
     
  9. setter

    setter Member

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    The machine is out of time. Pat-Trap has a procedure for this, it takes longer to explain than to do. Sent you an e-mail.
     
  10. Kingbang

    Kingbang TS Member

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    I dont understand why Pat dont pin the small sprocket onto the shaft instead of just pressing it on! That would solve alot of timing issues in my opine.

    Dennis
     
  11. setter

    setter Member

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    Dennis,

    The ones I've worked on are screwed on. Pat-Trap did correct this issue by going to a larger diameter pinion shaft and using coarser threads on the shaft, gear and pinion block.

    Jim
     
  12. Hooked

    Hooked Member

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    Jim,

    Do you know approximately when they made the switch to the larger shaft? We had to go through and pin the sprocket on all of our Pats.

    Thanks,

    Brian
     
  13. setter

    setter Member

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    Brian,

    I don't know when that change was made.

    Jim
     
  14. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    It is a timing issue and the way you resolve it is to break the chain and re-position the indexing pawl between the indexing blocks then relink the chain. The adjustment increments are one gear tooth, and usually one tooth of adjustment is all that is required.

    If you have another machine that is throwing targets without breakage check the alignment of the indexing ratchet in the index blocks and compare that to the machine that is having trouble. This will also tell you which direction you need to advance or retard the ratchet.

    Good luck
     
  15. Harv Shell

    Harv Shell TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    My guess would be an elevator problem. We had the same problem on one of our six machines as far as breakage, but also got a flat hard right target fairly often.
    Shut the machine off as the elevator raises, remove the spring and see if the elevator is nice and free going up and down. If not repair whatever is binding it up. If thats the problem it's a pretty simple fix. Good luck.
     
  16. shotgnrox

    shotgnrox TS Member

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    My name is vince valois if I can help you call me I'm sure I can help 813-277-6543
     
  17. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    I agree, magazine timeing or elevator problem. Early machines had a hydraulic elevator which could be a pain.

    HM
     
  18. Kingbang

    Kingbang TS Member

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    Jim its good to here they fixed that. We have one intermediate G that snapped a shaft. I upgraded it to the newer 9/16" shaft. It went out of time yesterday at our PITA shoot. luckely it was on the last spquad of doubles.I had no way of knowing when I put it back together if I had put 110# of torque on the pinion block. Obviously I didnt!. So I had someone with bigger shoulders than mine put a twist on it. He got damn near another half turn on it. We'll see how that works.Its a pain to get that link back in the chain without loosening that motor. We have 8 Pats 4 SW 1 Intermediate G 2 older G's and one new G. So I am learning alot about working on these things.

    Dennis
     
  19. N. J. BOB

    N. J. BOB Active Member

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    Call Vince.......
     
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