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PW 900 not indexing - help

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Hooked, Jul 27, 2007.

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  1. Hooked

    Hooked Member

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    Hi all,

    I just got the PW die removal system for my 900 and after installing it, I can't seem to get the loader to index properly. It seems like it only wants to index about halfway between stations and then stops/hangs up.

    I don't know if it's out of time or what. I've checked to make sure that the cylinder hold downs weren't dragging and I also removed the ball detent on the bottom in case that was the source of the problem (when I disassembled the original cylinder, the 1/4" ball detent was missing so I replaced it with a new ball). So far, no luck.

    Any help or thoughts on what the problem might be would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Brian
     
  2. five straight

    five straight TS Member

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    contact whiz white 605-341-4412 or whiz@swsupply.com Ed
     
  3. shootime

    shootime TS Member

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    Check the bearing on the center shaft, if flat spotted or missing it will cause the to not rotate completly.

    Shootime
     
  4. Jim Cunningham

    Jim Cunningham TS Member

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    As shoottime said above it could be the index roller bearing in the center shaft cam. Also, The conversion from the old cylinder to the new causes the 900 to become very sensitive to the amount of downward travel. If the cross head doesn't go down far enough the indexing is messed up. Remove the Primer feed and the shell seating post and see if the problem goes away. The cross head should just tuch the post in the back when it is all the way down. The primer feed and the shell seating post tend to get taller as we adjust. If that clears up the problem, lower the shell seating post to much and then raise it until the shell is flush with the botton of the die. At that point measure the post and make the primer feed one turn of the thread taller when measured from the bottom of the jacking screw to the top of the primer post pin. Thats the pin that connects the upper housing to the lower post and the primer sits on it when it drops into the hole.
    When you reinstall the Primer feed push it down to the stop by hand, using the cross head to force it down doesn't work most fo the time. On rare occasions I have had to lower the post in the back just a bit.
    Good luck
    Jim Cunningham
     
  5. chipking

    chipking TS Member

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    Brian One other thought / question. Are you sure that you got the guide bushing captured with the guide screw. When I first put mine together I missed the bushing (below the screw) and had exactly the same problems. It took me several hours of head scratching to find out what I had done.
    --- Chip King ---
     
  6. harleypilot

    harleypilot Member

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    I had some similar problems with my 900, and found that the shell seating post had gotten out of adjustment.

    These suggestions are all good, but the best idea would be what five straight said, call Whiz White.

    Jim
     
  7. Hooked

    Hooked Member

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    Thanks for the info everyone. Chipking, that was one of the first things I checked, unfortunately that bolt was where it was supposed to be. Shootime, if it is the roller bearing, how do I get it out in order to put a new one in?

    After giving up on it last night, I will try to tackle the problem with a fresh start this morning - looking particularly at the points mentioned above.

    A couple of things:

    1. The ball detent unit located under the cylinder is messed up (my fault) and I will have to order a whole new piece. Does this significantly affect the indexing and timing of the machine. I realize that it is there for a reason, but by not being there, is that lone cause of my problems?

    2. I put the old cylinder and associated parts (less the ball detent and dies) back in and watched the cylinder go around as I worked the lever. It would start out fine, but then after a few strokes, the cylinder would gradually start to lose alignment over each station. Eventually, it would become totally out of sync. What causes this?

    Thanks again for your help.

    Brian
     
  8. Gunman

    Gunman TS Member

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    Just a suggestion. Check the length of the screw that holds the ball in against the column channel. I had changed the screw to a new one from Ponsness and the
    screw and threads were not the same length of the old one. The threads would bottem before it held the ball in place. Took it to a local guru who understand the 900. He turned the shoulder off the screw and it indexed and worked fine. It is above my understanding but it works now. Hope that you get yours solved. Once they start running they are a good machine

    Bob Moser
     
  9. Hooked

    Hooked Member

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    We'll I took another crack at it tonight - keeping in mind all of the advice that I've been given. I still can't get the thing to index reliably. Here's what I've observed so far:

    1. I got the index roller bearing out and inspected it. No visible flat spots or burrs, but I did notice that when it was in the cam channel, it would slide nice and smooth on the straight portion of the channel, but when I got to the angled portion of the channel, there was some significant resistance.

    2. Sometimes, when the cross head is on the way down, the index collar chatters against the index post. I don't know if this is a result of #1 above.

    3. Sometimes the cylinder will actually index backwards as the cross head comes down. This happens sometimes in conjunction with the chatter of the index collar, but sometimes not.

    4. I removed the shell seating post and the primer ram in order to see if the indexing was any better with the cross head going lower. It helped a bit, but still not reliable.

    All of the above was done without the ball detent under the cylinder because, as I mentioned earlier, I broke that particular part. On Monday,I will order a new roller bearing and the ball detent assembly. Hopefully, that will solve my problem.

    Thanks,

    Brian
     
  10. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Brian- I wish you luck. Reloaders, all brands of reloaders, can become very frustrating at times. I am not smart enough to offer you any advice. I do not even know if the 900 indexes on a star gear of a slot in the center shaft like the 2000. But, I can assure you that after you finally figure out what is not working on the press, the repair will be rather simple.

    Please do not do anything with the malfunctioning press that will cause other things to get messed up. One simple problem can cause many other problems.

    Best of luck to you. I have been in your position.

    Pat Ireland
     
  11. kgunner

    kgunner TS Member

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    Have had the problem in the past so you might want to try the following:

    1. Bring the cross-head all the way up and check for any gunk in the center post track. Especially in the very bottom as one time I had an accumulation of old grease and a few pellets. It looked clean but was actually so hard it needed to be scraped out so the index pin will go all the way down.

    2. Remove the Index Post Roller (part SIZE600303) and Spacer/Roller Bearing (MULT481900) from the Index Collar. Then remove the cap screw from the primer feed assembly. You will find that this assembly uses the same Spacer/Roller Bearing in the Primer Feed Assembly (MULT481900) as used in the Index Collar. Swap the two parts, put some grease in center shaft slot and your problems should be over.

    Good luck
     
  12. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    If the crosshead is indexing backwards, the Index Pad is set wrong.
     
  13. C H S

    C H S TS Member

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    I have encountered a "chatter" in my 900 and have traced it to the heavy caps in the holes that the powder/shot bushings are changed through. I have taken to tightening the retaining thumb screws with the operating lever all the way down to get rid of the chatter, and I replaced the thumbscrew at the shot bushing with allen screw because the thumbscrew always came loose and allowed the shot to lift the plug; a really bad thing.

    Andy
     
  14. FarmerD

    FarmerD TS Member

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    RCBS "The Grand" and all your troubles will melt away. Richard
     
  15. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    C H S: The EZ-Fill uses plastic Caps. Get a couple of them or have someone make a couple out of Delrin for you.

    An RCBS Grand - sure, ha!
     
  16. Hooked

    Hooked Member

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    Pat: Thanks for the advice. I agree that all loaders can be frustrating and have their quirks. I once had an 800B that was older than me. That was my first machine and the one that I learned to load shells on. What an education!

    Whiz: The loader worked almost flawlessly before I installed the new cylinder system. Now neither the old cylinder or the new one will work. When it indexes "backward" as I mentioned before, it seems as though it's just sliding back under some kind of spring pressure rather than being forced back by the index mechanism. I'm really hoping that the broken ball check unit under the cylinder is the source of my problems.

    I've ordered the new parts and will try again once they arrive.

    No comment on the RCBS Grand, but I would buy another PW machine before buying anything else!

    Thanks all.

    Brian
     
  17. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    HOOKED: I have a new die removal system here at the shop on a reloader and the cylinder was machined wrong. A new one fixed everything.

    You could be correct about the "sliding back."

    When you install the new set, I don't pay attention the the BLACKENED gear tip and setting it to the pinion gear. I just bolt them into place.

    Check this: There should have been two black washers that came with the new Star Gear bracket. Install those two black washer between the aluminum gear housing and the crosshead. This will effect when rotation starts (a bit sooner).

    There is quite a strict procedure to set the Index Pad height, and I won't get into it here, but I would be happy to email it to you (if I can find my instructions).

    Both the top and bottom hex-head "Button Head Cap Screws" 3/16" version much be fairly tight. The bottom one on the center shaft MUST BE ABSOLUTELY TIGHT - I use a smidgen on blue Loctite on it when I assembly it as on the two that hold the Star Gear bracket.

    It really sounds like the Index Pad is most likely trying to advance the cylinder too far, and it backs up into the two detents 180ยบ apart under the center cap.

    Whiz
     
  18. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    Use it to hold your boat secure in a fast moving river, then buy a Dillon.
     
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