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Potential Problem Purchasing K80 on TS.com

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Hitapair, Oct 20, 2009.

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  1. Hitapair

    Hitapair Active Member

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    It's a felony in many if not all states to sell secured property.
     
  2. WoodsonEnt

    WoodsonEnt Active Member

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    Well, this is an interesting post. I have never financed a gun, so I can only give my opinion. My opinion would be if someone bought the gun thru Hal, and he financed it, then sold it and quit making payments....I say yes it could happen. My other opinion is... if you bought gun with a credit card and quit making payments....credit card would be after balance and not gun. I am sure they wouldn't want to resell a Krieghoff. Now, if you went to the bank and financed a gun, more than likely you would have to put up something secured. Like I stated, this is only my opinion. I am not a banker, financial advisor, or attorney. I just sell Decot Hy-Wyd Shooting Glasses.

    Matt Woodson
     
  3. squirrelkiller

    squirrelkiller TS Member

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    Too lazy to look up, but the "good faith" purchase Rule of the UCCC may apply - or - you may have to have a certified lender in the mix.
     
  4. superxjeff

    superxjeff Active Member

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    An interesting concept and one that could play out. My understanding is that you need good credit and good references to buy on payments from Hal. The person that fits that profile is not likely to do what you are talking about. Possible? Sure but not probable from my way of thinking. I am sure that if Hal sells enough guns on payments he will get people who do not carry out their end of the contract. Jeff
     
  5. glenn mcleod

    glenn mcleod Member

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    If Hal is like most business men he probably sold that paper at a discount and the ones that are collecting the payments would have gone after the original buyer. Glenn
     
  6. Hitapair

    Hitapair Active Member

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    I don't know what Hal does, but I would bet he takes a security interest in the gun. He'd be a damn fool not to. If he sells the paper, which I doubt he does, as he's not like most businessman that need to sell the paper to get the capital for his business. I don't think Hal needs the capital and probably likes getting the interest. But if he does sell the paper, the security interest is assigned w/ it. Unlike motor vehicles, it's a lot harder to find a gun to take it back when there is a default. If the 2nd party to buy it doesn't send it back to the factory for service, it probably won't be recovered unless the original owner tells who he sold it to.
     
  7. threedeuces

    threedeuces TS Member

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    Never financed a gun and never will. Now we got that out of the way. I would think that maybe when one makes a huge investment like this they should check to see if there is any liens on it. It should not be any different than paying that much for a car or truck. I would think that one would make sure the vehicle has a clear title before laying down that much loot.

    Never less, a good point.
     
  8. eric

    eric TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Drew:

    Is this something you have experienced?

    Eric
     
  9. Auctioneer

    Auctioneer Well-Known Member

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    I hate to say it but even though you did nothing wrong you got screwed and caught holding the bag. Now the problem is how do you get out of it? If the person you bought it from was the person who financed the gun then go back to him. If he is not then the only thing you can do is try to find each person who bought the gun till you do. Now the question is what can you do legaly? I hope for the best for you and I hope it works out well. Please let us all know here how it turns out. Good luck.
     
  10. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

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    I'd bet the fact that a firearm is involved,,BATF would be interested at some level.
     
  11. X Trap 2

    X Trap 2 TS Member

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  12. Gold Medal

    Gold Medal Member

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    I know of two instances that involved financed Kriefhoffs that may shed a little light on this subject.

    As most of you know, Hal DuPont sells his financed gun contracts to Europa Finance. I believe this is a subsidiary business.

    1)A local man sold a financed Krieghoff and pocketed the money, NOT paying off the gun. Hal became aware of this and garnisheed his wages (through Europa)after he refused to pay. Hal collected the contract balance in full via the garnishment.

    The person who bought the gun was never contacted by Hal or Europa I was told. He did not know the gun was financed when he bought it from the original buyer
    finding out about it later.

    There is an innocent third party law in this state (Indiana) which MIGHT have protected the second purchaser if Europa tried to repossess the gun.


    2)A friend of mine died 14years ago. He had a K-80 that was financed through Europa Finance. His parents asked me to buy the gun for the payoff so they could settle his estate. They had been trying to sell the gun for about two months with no luck

    I called Europa, got the payoff, sent it to them and they sent me the UCC-1 form stamped paid. Europa had filed this form to perfect their lien on the gun. The payoff was about $500 more than the gun was worth but I did it because it helped his parents out of a financial bind.


    The filing of the UCC-1 form is the manner in which you perfect a lien on goods that do not have a title.

    Finally, I am a retired banker having spent 29 years in consumer lending.
    One thing I know is there is no easy answer to the question that started this thread.

    If Europa had filed a writ of replevin and legally reclaimed the gun in
    example 1 then the purchaser would have either had to retain an attorney to pursue the innocent third party law, or forget about the gun.

    Either solution is expensive.

    So be sure you know who the hell you are dealing with when you send money to anyone, anywhere, anytime.

    Do your due diligence. If you don`t it can be expensive.
     
  13. dverna

    dverna Active Member

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    A call to Hall would establish if the K-80 has been financed and if the debt has been paid. If the seller will not give you the serial number, run away from the deal.

    Don Verna
     
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