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Pointing Labradors how?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Bruce Specht, Aug 15, 2008.

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  1. Bruce Specht

    Bruce Specht Well-Known Member

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    I've hunted over labs for over thirty years and all three of mine would hesitate a bit when they made game; but not a point in the true sense. I have hunted with friends that have "pointing labs" and they hold a strong and stylish (for a short coated dog) point. My thought is that at some point somebody cross bred some solid lab stock with some solid short hairs? Your thoughts?
     
  2. highflyer

    highflyer TS Member

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    That would be the best and quickest way to get a "pointing lab". If you look at one of the retrieving breeds and one of the pointing breeds and understand dog anatomy you will quickly see the differences. The retrievers carry more body fat and have a bigger bone structure. Their bellies form a curve from from the front legs to the back legs with very little tuckup at the waist. They are thick necked. They are thicker coated. A good pointing dog has a deep chest, smaller boned for more speed and endurance, a small waist, a narrow neck. They are built for speed and endurance in the uplands. Their coats and bodies dissipate heat rather than hold it in. One was designed for retrieving and one was designed for running. Their is also a difference in character. Lab men think the indepenence displayed by pointing dogs is a sign of stupidity. It isn't. It is a dog developed to reach out and find birds. You take a retriever hunting. A good pointing dog takes you hunting. They were not developed to follow hand signals like a robot. Most pointing dogs quickly become bored with the repetitious training that labs thrive on. They are very different dogs designed for very different tasks.
     
  3. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

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    Good response highflyer. However, we have all our pointers trained to directional hand signals, and it's not hard. Takes a week with a long rope and whistle. There are times we see birds run out the edges, and we want our dogs to cut them off. Hand signals work great for that.
     
  4. blrmkr83

    blrmkr83 Member

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    Here is how it was explained to me by the owner of Alma Bottoms pointing labs about 7 years ago. All dogs have the instinct to point, some breeds just hold a point longer than others. When labs were found that had the instinct to point they were bred to emphasize pointing. Now if they could just breed the shedding out of labs I might get one since I don't mind a varmint in the house but don't care for hair everywhere. I ended up with a german wirehaired pointer since I was looking for a strictly pheasant dog and they don't shed. She's is tough on pheasants and tougher on large male labs that have come too close when she is returning with a bird in her mouth. Fun to watch a 60# wirehair tackle a 100# lab by the throat. Fortunately no one has been injured, other than the lab owners pride.
     
  5. berettaman7

    berettaman7 TS Member

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    Can pointing labs be called snitches?

    Berettaman7
     
  6. Dove Commander

    Dove Commander TS Member

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    sarge, I disagree with most of your statements about pointing dogs. I've been a dog dude since the 70's and have seen GWP's and Drahthaars that will out do many labs in both brains and duration, especially retrieving. A GWP is a non certified Draht, but they carry the same genes and desire. Face it, it's all about the genes and training. Dogs are like computers, you put crap in, you'll get crap out. No one can say their dog or breed is the best. The best dog is always...my dog. We train 2-3 pointer pups and labs every year, and I can't name one breed that hasn't created a loser, except the Drahthaar, and thats because of their strict breeding and cerification regiment. Thats why they cost what they cost. In general, the labs are the biggest risk due to the haphazard breeding. Hips, cancer, and random breeding for money requires a buyer to seriously research his potential pup's background.
     
  7. Lyle

    Lyle Member

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    I've owned labs since 1981, you do the math, and I have hunted with other peoples labs over the years. I've not told someone else their dog is "weak" but several of the labs I've seen ARE week. They are too heavy to hunt and their ability lacks. Now, I have seen some FANTASTIC labs, and I've owned a couple myself that could hunt with any pointer any day. The key to a good lab is to follow the breeding. Don't buy a cheap lab out of the paper. The field trial guys are breeding athletes so take advantage of it!

    My current lab points and holds points. I was not pursuing a pointing lab but rather an athlete who was 75lbs at the most so he would last in the uplands and not be arthritic at age 5. His father is a National Champion and it has been money well spent. He is a all-star on the long tails and a hell of a retriever. My only complaint on him is that my vest is starting to rip out because when hunting with other guys my lab always beats their pointers to the retrieve and I end up carrying all the birds!

    Lyle
     
  8. Dove Commander

    Dove Commander TS Member

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    sarge, I like your dedication, and I surely can't fault a guy that hunts with dogs like you do. I'd hunt with you anyday. We don't do the quail thing either, nor do we appreciate big running dogs. We hunt wild pheasant, ducks, geese, and do the "pheasant farm" thing just to keep the dogs sharp. I love to see the "switches" finally come on in a young dog. Good luck this season.
     
  9. birdogs

    birdogs TS Member

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    Pointing Labradors (sic) - Why?
     
  10. JDinTX

    JDinTX Member

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    Why? Because Labs already had the best personality and the best retrieving ability, and they were excellent flushers. So you you breed in a liitle pointing ability and you have the best all around, one can do it all dog out there. That is my opinion and the reason I own one, and think she is the best dog I have ever been associated with. JD
     
  11. frank t

    frank t TS Member

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    Labs are great dogs but I have to take issue with JD when he says they have the best retrieving ability. Compared to pointing dogs yes, but compared to a Chesapeake they are second best. Chessies have an uncanny ability to mark downed game.

    Frank T
     
  12. BRGII

    BRGII TS Member

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    I have had Labs, Chessy's, Springers, and now a German Short Hair. They have all been good companions and have their attributes. But for duck hunting the labs have been the best. More courage than brains at times. The German Short hair is better at upland game. Mine doesn't like to retrieve and hates water, when it is cold. I loved and love them all, and miss the one's that are gone. BRG II
     
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