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pitch and its effect on muzzle jump?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by skeet_man, Aug 4, 2009.

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  1. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

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    what effect, if any, does pitch have on muzzle jump? If i'm experiencing excessive muzzle jump, would I want to increase my pitch (i'm @ zero pitch now).
     
  2. miketmx

    miketmx Well-Known Member

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    I don't know positive pitch from negative pitch but when I put my gun on the floor, the muzzle is about 3 inches away from the vertical wall and when I mount my gun the recoil pad contacts the top and bottom of my shoulder pocket at the same time. I don't feel any face slap or muzzle jump.
     
  3. yobyllib

    yobyllib TS Member

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    if you look at some factory specs,you will see like 5-7 degrees positive pitch.
    this all depends on how big your tata`s are.....
    I like 2-3" minimum off the wall to the muzzle
    that is I think 5 degrees over a 30" bbl.
     
  4. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    Yes skeet_man, pitch has a BIG effect on muzzle jump. Increase the positive pitch and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

    John C. Saubak
     
  5. WNCRob

    WNCRob Member

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    I'd refer it as "up pitch" (raises the bbl), or "down pitch"...Usually increasing down pitch will reduce "face slap", BUT be cautious...a very small change can have big results.

    WNCRob
     
  6. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Before you cut on your stock, try this:

    Loosen the bottom (toe end) screw on your recoil pad.

    Completely unscrew the top (heel end) screw on your recoil pad.

    Put an 1/8" thick washer between your recoil pad and the wood of the stock, on the top screw. Retighten the top and bottom screws (being careful not to overtighten. The plastic part of your recoil pad could crack in this condition.)

    Go shoot the gun and see if that improves things.

    If so, you might be due for some pitch adjustment!
     
  7. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    captin,

    When you add a washer on the top (heel) screw between the stock and the recoil pad you've effectivly INCREASED the positive pitch.

    John C. Saubak
     
  8. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    John- Check your post, it may be backward.

    Pitch is the angle of the stock butt to the barrel, or the rib if the rib is parallel to the barrel. It is typically measured in inches at 30 inches from the chamber. I measure it with a 48 inch square used to cut drywall. If you have a square door way, that can also be used (use the hinge side of the door). If the butt of the gun is placed on the floor against a square door jam, and there is a one inch gap at 30 barrel inches between the door jam and the barrel, that is a one inch down pitch (down pitch = negative pitch). It is not easy to tell if you actually have a square door way unless you have a 48 inch square and if you have a 48 inch square, you should use it instead of the door way.

    Pat Ireland
     
  9. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    I don't know if pitch affects muzzel jump; I do know it affects slap. My gun has 7 degrees negative pitch. The toe is further out than the heel.

    Phil Berkowitz
     
  10. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    Then Pat,

    Either you or I are mistaken. My understanding is; "down pitch"=positive pitch

    John C. Saubak
     
  11. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    John- I always thought that down pitch is negative pitch--- I also believe that the terms up pitch and down pitch are better than positive and negative pitch. It would eliminate some, perhaps my, confusion.

    Pat Ireland
     
  12. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    Down/Up.....I sure wouldn't argue with that Pat. Also, it seems to me that it would be more proper to refer to pitch in terms of degrees from perpendicular to the bore line instead of inches.

    John C. Saubak
     
  13. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    If down is positive and up is negative, than I am mistaken. I agree that measuring pitch in degrees would be better but much more difficult to measure.

    Pat Ireland
     
  14. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    It also seems to me that it'd be more proper to measure length of pull from the rear of the trigger guard instead of from the trigger. Consider these shotguns that have triggers that can be adjusted by sliding them back or forth about 1/4".......IMO the "LOP" measurment should reflect the distance from the grip hand to the shoulder. Sliding the trigger fore & aft a quarter inch technically changes the length of pull, but it doesn't change the way the gun fits?

    John C. Saubak
     
  15. Rollin Oswald

    Rollin Oswald Active Member

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    Pitch is positive when the barrel is away from a vertical surface with the gun standing on its butt. (Dennis DeVault disagrees and calls that negative pitch. the argument of positive verses negative pitch definitions is scheduled for this winter.)

    Inadequate pitch does cause cheek slap (along with other poor fit and form elements). The pitch is correct when, during the gun mount, the entire pad, top to bottom, makes simultaneous contact with the shoulder pocket with the shooter in a normal shooting posture.

    Cheek slap is often caused by barrel-rise during recoil. It is minimized when about an inch of the recoil pad makes contact with and extends above the collarbone (or clavicle, if you prefer).

    Rollin
     
  16. Dennis DeVault

    Dennis DeVault Well-Known Member

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    If you go to our web site, and click on past newsletters you can locate the newsletter that was written about positive or negitive pitch of a gun stock. I have drawn a couple of examples on the letter as well. Pitch most definetly effects the way a gun reacts to recoil. Thank you,

    Dennis DeVault
     
  17. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Rollin- Based on the meaning of words, I would have to side with Dennis. Down and negative fit together better than up and negative.

    Pat Ireland
     
  18. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Bryce- I have done a little search and it seems that many, but not all, do use the term "positive pitch" for moving the barrel down.

    This should be pointed out to some government officials. If economic indicators go down, they could then call it positive.

    I now see that this question will have no resolution. Adding pitch will increase the space between a wall and the gun barrel and some apparently call this positive. Others will consider pitch as the angle between the barrel and the butt of the stock and are then forced to use the term negative pitch. I will continue to use the term down and up pitch until I can figure out a way to actually measure the angle.

    Pat Ireland
     
  19. yobyllib

    yobyllib TS Member

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    here you go....

    http://www.csgnetwork.com/righttricalc.html

    do your door frame test.
    enter the value [in decimals] for side "little a"
    enter the value for bbl length for side "little b"
    hit calculate,and your angle will be displayed at "angle A/B"
     
  20. Onceabum

    Onceabum TS Member

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    Up/Down...Positive/Negative? All crap. My stocks are all equipped with REVERSE pitch.

    BB
     
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