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One of the reasons that our country is failing

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by bigdogtx, Oct 13, 2009.

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  1. bigdogtx

    bigdogtx Well-Known Member

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    We have had the ability to reason to THINK and REASON taken from us due to political correctness. Punish all for the actions of some, so you don't offend THEM. It is amazing that years ago we could take our shotguns to school and grab a little hunting on the way home. Everyone had pocket knives and NOONE used them other than what they were to be used for. The school wanted to send this kid to REFORM SCHOOL FOR 45 DAYS!!!

    "Cub Scout utensil gets boy, 6, school suspension
    First-grader brought it to eat his lunch with; now he’s facing reform school
    Video


    First-grader suspended over camping utensil
    Oct. 13: 6-year-old Zachary Christie was suspended after he brought a camping utensil to school. TODAY’s Meredith Vieira talks to Zachary, his mother, Debbie, and her fiance, Lee Irving, about the incident.
    Today show



    By Mike Celizic
    TODAYShow.com contributor
    updated 2 hours, 58 minutes ago
    Dressed in a button-down shirt and tie and speaking calmly and articulately, first-grader Zachary Christie hardly looks or acts like the sort of kid who should be spending 45 days in reform school. But, thanks to a zero-tolerance policy, that’s where Zachary’s Delaware school system wants him to go after he made the mistake of taking his favorite camping utensil to school.

    A Swiss Army-type combination of fork, spoon, bottle opener and knife, the tool has been Zachary’s favorite ever since he got it to take on Cub Scout camping expeditions. “He eats dinner with it, breakfast and everything else, so it never occurred to him that this would have been something wrong to do,” the 6-year-old’s mother, Debbie Christie, told TODAY’s Meredith Vieira Tuesday from Newark, Del.

    ‘Can I have that?’
    Zachary, an A student who sometimes wears a shirt and tie to school just because he likes to, told Vieira he put the tool in his pocket on Sept. 29 for a very simple reason: “To eat lunch with. I had absolutely no idea this was going to happen. I wasn’t thinking about this. I was thinking about having lunch with it.”


    But when the tool fell out of his pocket on the bus and he walked off the vehicle with it in his hand, a teacher intercepted him. “She said, ‘Can I have that?’ ” Zachary recalled.

    What Zachary didn’t realize was that he had fallen afoul of the Christina School District’s zero-tolerance policy toward weapons in school, one of many such policies implemented in the wake of such incidents as the Columbine High School massacre. The policy does not allow teachers or administrators to take into account intentions or the character of the student; if a student has a knife, suspension and subsequent assignment to the district’s “alternative placement school” — aka reform school — is mandatory.

    Racial issue
    Christina, which, according to its Web site, is the largest school district in Delaware with some 17,000 students, made its policy zero-tolerance because of concerns over racial discrimination. Studies have shown in other districts that when school officials are given discretion over such cases, African-American students are disciplined at a disproportionately high rate.


    TODAY
    A combination fork, knife, spoon and bottle opener is Zachary Christie’s favorite utensil — but it got him in trouble at school.

    “The idea was to avoid discriminating against any student and to treat all students the same,” George Evans, president of the Christina school board, told NBC News.

    While some experts favor such zero-tolerance policies, others question their efficacy, saying there is no indication that they cut down on violent incidents in schools. One of them, national school safety consultant Kenneth Trump, told NBC News, “The school administrators have to be able to administer consequences and still have some discretion to fit the totality of the circumstances.”

    The totality of Zachary’s circumstances was that he had no idea that it was wrong to take his favorite camping tool to class. When the teacher asked for it when he got off the bus, he handed it over, unaware that he was already in serious trouble. He went to class while his principal called his mother.

    “She said that I needed to come to the school immediately; that Zachary had brought a dangerous weapon into school, and I needed to come and pick him up. He would be suspended for five days pending a disciplinary action committee hearing. She said that he had a knife,” Christie told Vieira.


    When his mother arrived at the John R. Downes Elementary School with her fiance, Lee Irving, Zachary was called from his first-grade classroom to join them.

    “When they called my name up, I was like, ‘Uh-oh,’ ” he said.

    Home school, not reform school
    Zachary was suspended immediately for five school days. At the end of the suspension, he and his mother appeared before the district’s disciplinary action committee, where his principal and others spoke up for his good character. It didn’t matter. The committee’s hands were tied. The rules said he had brought a knife to school and would have to spend 45 days in the reform school.

    Christie decided she would not send her son to that school. Instead, she has been home schooling Zachary while waiting for an opportunity to address the district’s board of education, which was to meet Tuesday night.

    “I understand why they have it, but I don’t agree with the implementation of it,” Christie said of the zero-tolerance policy. “I think they need to look at the age, maturity, intent, situation; bring in the teachers who know the child or the principal, and allow them to make the first call in these situations,” she said. “Looking at other schools’ codes of conduct in the Delaware Valley, their first step would have been a suspension.”

    Christie assured Vieira that her son is well aware of the necessity of not taking anything new to school without first asking and is not a threat to anyone. She hopes the school board will agree with her.


    Share your thoughts
    Should 6-year-old be suspended for bringing utensil to school? Discuss


    “I hope that they expunge his record and allow him to go back to Downes immediately,” she said of the board. “I think he has had an over-excess of education on this issue. I’m hoping that out of all of this the policy changes and that no other child is affected negatively by what is supposed to keep them all safe.”

    Vieira asked Zachary if he’s nervous about the prospect of eventually returning to his school.

    “I’m not very nervous,” Zachary said. “I like being home-schooled. It’s happy in some ways; it’s sad in some ways. Sometimes I’m strict, and sometimes I can get into my serious mode. I can get into my happy mode. It’s just kind of fun being home-schooled, but I’m not scared to go back.”

    And what has he learned from everything that’s happened to him?

    “To always ask before taking something new into school,” he said."
     
  2. Bruce Specht

    Bruce Specht Well-Known Member

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    One reason, democrats at the helm
     
  3. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Webster's Collegiate Dictionary: Weapon:

    Noun, An instrument of Offensive or Defensive combat. Something to fight with. A means of contending against another.

    It is clear that the members of this school board are uneducated! A pencil or pen meet the definition of a "Weapon", Are they going to be "fair" and ban them also?

    How many of their students get sent to reform school for kicking, slapping other students? Hands and Feet are "Weapons"

    Parents WAKE UP, kick these people out of YOUR school, quit voting this type of people into office!

    I vote against the Public school system every chance I get!! Its NOT about the Children, its about the Idiots in charge!
     
  4. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    There is another case going on, a 17 year old Eagle scout, already finished Army Basic, had a pocket knife in his car in the school lot, and they are messing with him.

    The interesting thing is that the knife is small enough NOT to be classified as a "weapon".

    Is there a little light at the end of this tunnel?

    HM
     
  5. highflyer

    highflyer TS Member

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    Modern American liberalism. With it the death of common sense. We are in too deep. They run our schools, our media and our courts.
     
  6. Dahaub

    Dahaub Active Member

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    You guys are bitching about a kid who's parents knowingly sent him to school with a knife. These people are idiots. They should be charged with a felony themselves for arming a kid with a weapon. Everyone knows for the past twenty years you can't take a knife to school, not any kind of knife, none ever. How hard is it for this group of conservatives to understand? My own son was given a money clip for his 16th birthday a little over 10 years ago and the money clip had a nail file on one side of it and a knife blade on the other side of it. The knife blade was almost one and an eighth inches long. He was seen showing it to someone and a teacher saw it and turned him in. I was called to school and we had a confrontation over the knife. My son was suspended for 10 days and rightfully so over the infraction. I had told him when he got the money clip from his grandmother that he could never carry it to school. However there are rules and they go for everyone. How anyone can set on camera and suggest that their kid is above the law of the land is beyond comprehension. How many school kids are there in the US? Why is their kid above the law? For anyone to think it's ok to carry a weapon in school I'll let you in on a secret, that secret is "It ain't ok" Dan
     
  7. highflyer

    highflyer TS Member

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    When I was young it wasn't uncommon for any boy to bring a pocket knife to school. We even did it in elementary school. But it was before liberals had destroyed our schools, our morality and our families. It was before kids killed each other at school. It took a few years of liberal control to bring us to that point.
     
  8. BLACKDOG

    BLACKDOG TS Member

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    Dahaub you are a morron, Our counrty is turning to S$#! and some how make it right. A good deal of YOUR presidents people are TAX CHEATS, they are saying the CIA, lied, and many other item's
     
  9. H82MIS

    H82MIS TS Member

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    Here is a huge part of our problems,,,,,,,,
     
  10. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    More from the likes of Dahaub.

    Ya you won, nothing to be proud about
     
  11. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Hey,

    Don't art classes still have those knifes for painting, ban art!

    Don't wood shops have those sharp wood chisels, ban wood shop

    Don't home ec classes have paring knifes, ban home ec.

    Does band class still use drums, you know the guy with the sharp pointie sticks, ban band

    Back to teaching the 3 R's and all will be fine.
     
  12. Bisi

    Bisi TS Member

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    Jackass government schools.
     
  13. comp 1

    comp 1 Well-Known Member

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    Dahaub, you have bought into the"obey the rules at any cost" liberal mentality-- I pity your kid--he'll never have any balls cause of you.
     
  14. Bruce Specht

    Bruce Specht Well-Known Member

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    like to shoot, most of the people in the teaching profession are democrats! Poll some teachers some time.
     
  15. crusha

    crusha TS Member

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    Hot-head Dahaub gets in a confrontation with the school and causes his kid to get suspended for 10 days...hilarious.


    Must suck to have a dad who's an idiot (his words, not mine).
     
  16. Chango2

    Chango2 Active Member

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    Could Dahaub be trolling? I am retired from the schools; I did testing and evaluation only and never was a teacher. I wish schools would teach common sense SAFETY...like getting on the cases of younger kids running on the first rainy day of the season when things are really slick, staying to the right side of a running/walking area to prevent a broken collarbone due to collision, (yes, I saw that happen, a fracture), staying away from the paper cutter etc. (Damn teachers would let kids into workroom and use the papercutter...little kids, unattended, could lose a finger due to busy and spontaneous hands..I'm NOT kidding..it could happen in a flash..) I used to have kids put their hands in pockets around a paper cutter. The kids got it; some teachers used the damn tool carelessly.

    But pocket knives? Absurd. A sharp pencil is much more dangerous as is a pen, metal keys, plastic forks and knives used in the cafeteria, metal butter knives, playgrounds in Los Angeles that are on asphalt only, etc. Hell and ballocks I say, in kindergarten, yes kindergarten, we developed some skills with hammer and nails making little wooden toys!! Honest truth, and this was in Los Angeles circa 1952. That law/rule about knives and "weapons" made me so angry that I'd always carry a four inch bladed Stihl promotional knife with me...and if anybody gave me crap about it, I'd say it was to allow myself to cut my car's seatbelts were I in an accident and the belts failed to release due to damage.

    BTW, what is a weapon? I believe a full coke can or wrapped inside a garment makes a handy makeshift blackjack. And the schools are complete with aluminium baseball bats. There are also lotsa nice rocks and pebbles in the gardens in schools and lotsa brooms around. Oh, and the transom window crank is a metal rod. It's a dangerous world, teach the kids to work with and within it and come home each day throughout life with no or minimized personal damage. That's called being responsible and putting the brain in gear before movement or speaking.

    Yup, it's an uneven parallel universe. My favorite line when I see the absurd: The judge admonished the jury: "If you can't be fair, at least be arbitrary."

    I believe that was from the book, Naked Lunch by William Burroughs. Oh, and when I was in school, I remember a friend getting busted in study hall for reading Catcher in the Rye. He had been encouraged to read the book by his English teacher. "But we tried not to let school interfere with our educations.."

    Now I don't think my complaint(s) are due to liberal thinking per se, but, are due as much in part that we are a society that tolerates lots and lots of lawsuits. School districts that I have seen see lawyers that go after them as the scariest monster ever. School districts tend not to take a stand, but find the cheapest way out in the short run is to buy off the plaintiff(s)...and that is sad, no soul, if you will, no stand up attitudes and actions, but the path of least resistance out of short term gain and the false pragmatic hope that a problem solved in the quickest way will go away. That is hardly ever the case..
     
  17. Grizzly

    Grizzly TS Member

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    Just go back to the good ole days when children were taught at home first the meaning of the word "RESPECT". If you got into any kind of trouble at school and they notified your parents,,,you were scared to death the rest of the day, dreading the arrival of your Dad getting home from work because you knew what you were gonna get. In those days the school kids were scared of their parents and scared of their teachers and especially the principle, that isn't the way it is today. Just listen sometime when your at the mall or in the grocery store how kids behave,,,backtalking, dirty mouths and disrespectful everyone and everything.....

    Grizz
     
  18. Chango2

    Chango2 Active Member

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    Grizz...and not only that, the parents are disrespectful to the school and to the school personnel. This starts a vicious cycle; those who deserve respect by being good teachers etc. leave the system. Those that may not deserve or earn respect replace them: poor teachers. And the cycle is perpetuated.
     
  19. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Its time for some union busting! Its time for the NEA to be disbanded!
     
  20. highflyer

    highflyer TS Member

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    I wouldn't blame most of the teachers. They are put in an unwinnable situation. I have a daughter that is a teacher now in an urban school. In elementary school they already have students that will cuss out a teacher or get up and run around a classroom causing trouble. They are not allowed to do anything to correct them. The liberal mentality has taken over the classrooms. When I was in elementary school this would have been taken care of with a good spanking and that would have ended the trouble. Now one kid can ruin the entire year for every other child in the class and nothing can be done about it. You can call the parents but most worthless kids come from worthless homes where the parents, or usually parent, can't or won't control the kids either. The only way it is the teachers fault is in their joining the liberal teachers union and voting for liberals that have caused all these problems in the first place. It is a problem that can't be fixed. Liberalism is here to stay. Rotten schools are just one small part of liberalism. Most of the worst kids will end up in our bulging prisons already full of the result of liberalism in our society.
     
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