1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

O/T Climate Change at the North Pole - yikes!

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by joe kuhn, Sep 29, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. joe kuhn

    joe kuhn Furry Lives Matter TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,106
    Location:
    Naperville, IL
    It turns out you can't see much of a climate change in Naperville, IL, but you can see it at the poles which is where it counts.

    Instructive video. Check it out.
     
  2. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,489
    Two questions: #1 how does "science" know what the carbon dioxide levels were 100,000, 200,000, 300,000 and 400,000 years ago? #2 what is the evidence that burning fossil fuel is the cause of the change? He completely glosses over both those "facts" that he includes in his presentation. I think he is part of the "agenda" looking for money.

    The climate has ebbed and flowed over the years. Here is a quote from Wikipedia regarding Greenland:

    "The climate in Greenland was much warmer during the first centuries of settlement but became increasingly colder in the 14th and 15th centuries with the approaching period of colder weather known as the Little Ice Age."

    So, did civilization burn fossil fuel 800 or 900 years ago that caused Greenland to be warmer and what caused the glaciers that covered much of North America to recede?
     
  3. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,715
    If the ice has been melting in the north to the extent he says, where is the sea level rise? The man-created global warming champions themselves insisted from the get-go that all the world's low lying areas were going to flood if we didn't reverse global warming. I don't see any panicked levee building around the Florida coast.

    I can tell you that as a group scientists are among the world's great liars. They are utterly money and recognition (ego) driven, and the money comes mostly from the federal government through grants. If your work follows the leftist agenda of the people who control the grant money you get the bucks. So scientists as a group are agenda driven, both by their desire for grant money and their desire for recognition. Most of them would stab their mothers in the back if it would get them some kind of international recognition.

    If what this guy is saying is universally true, the world's low lying coastal areas would be flooding. Where is that evidence? This guy's presentation bears all the ear markings of a totally leftist driven agenda complete with lies, distortions and other deceptions. His statement that "this is not in dispute" is a typical leftist bold faced lie.

    I'm not maintaining that there is no global warming taking place. There may be, but when I see monsters like Al Gore seeking to use it to control my behavior and options I know I'm being screwed with. Global warming and cooling are more likely perfectly normal and not caused by man.

    I worked in the laboratories of a major university for 8 years and I got a real good look at how science and scientists operate. Secretly they even admit as much among themselves. It's all driven by money and ego. They have full time employees who do nothing day after day, year after year but apply for grant money. You think those scientists don't toe the line of the people who dole out the money, and reach the conclusions sought by those who control the money?
     
  4. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    15,639
    Location:
    Green Bay Wisconsin
    It's because the Mayan calendar says the earthe is going to shift the magnetic poles. As it spins around the warm parts will get colder, and vice versa.

    No? I like this one better, a comment from the link.

    Why is it bad that the Artic is receding. The earth for most of the Cenozoic did not contain permanent ice near its pole. In fact the earth is the coldest its ever been since the end of the cretaceous. There used to be forest on Antarctica and the tropics went farther toward the poles.Yes,in the short term global warming will kill organisms adapted for the cold. However, in the long term it will result in an expansion of the tropics, a plus for biodiversity. Plus with the extra CO2 plant life will have better growth. So I don't see human caused global warming as a threat to the planet.

    So I am not going to worry. My heat bills should be lower soon.

    HM
     
  5. dmarbell

    dmarbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    1,572
    Scientists use ice cores to estimate past levels of various gases in the atmosphere, as well as average temperatures and climate changes.

    http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/Study-Details-Distribution-Impacts-5393.aspx

    What is significant today is that the carbon dioxide levels are higher than the maximums seen from the above measurements, over the last 400,000 years.

    Very fast climate changes have been observed in the past based on those measurements. Much faster than what is being predicted for our next 100 years.

    I don't believe there is a dispute that burning fossil fuels increases the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. Whether we can do anything now to significantly reduce it is in dispute.

    Sea levels will not be affected by sea ice melting. Visualize a glass of ice water not overflowing as the ice melts. Melting of land-based ice, like the ice sheets on Greenland and Iceland will increase the amount of liquid in the oceans and can raise sea levels.

    Danny
     
  6. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,715
    Whether increased CO2 levels are CAUSING global warming is also in dispute, regardless of this preening peacock's insistence to the contrary.
     
  7. dmarbell

    dmarbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    1,572
    wireguy,

    That is true. It does seem curious that the current CO2 levels are 380 ppm, as compared to the maximum estimated 280 ppm over the past 400,000 years - and yet the global temperatures haven't warmed any more quickly than they have.

    Did I miss something? How long have the CO2 levels exceeded the 280 ppm levels?

    Danny
     
  8. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,489
    Estimates of CO2 levels are just that, estimates. The levels of CO2 gas between 400,000 years ago and the time they were first accurately measured are also in dispute whether scientists accept the estimates or not. Note that the guy acknowledges a relationship with the Obama administration. The disputes have been covered up as stated in numerous articles out of the UK.
     
  9. 5 Stand Dan

    5 Stand Dan Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2011
    Messages:
    427
    Location:
    Texas (DFW)
    Carbon dioxide emissions in the U.S. are at their lowest level in 20 years. It’s NOT because of wind or solar power.

    The Associated Press reports that new data from the Energy Information Administration shows that U.S. emissions of carbon dioxide emissions are back down to their 1992 levels:

    "In a surprising turnaround, the amount of carbon dioxide being released into the atmosphere in the U.S. has fallen dramatically to its lowest level in 20 years, and government officials say the biggest reason is that cheap and plentiful natural gas has led many power plant operators to switch from dirtier-burning coal."

    That's a Fracking Good thing
     
  10. ntgr8

    ntgr8 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Messages:
    681
    What is the temp supposed to be??? Give me the perfect number so I will feel safe.
     
  11. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2007
    Messages:
    7,946
    Location:
    Eastern Washington
    Its still a HOAX!
     
  12. Shooting Sailor

    Shooting Sailor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2008
    Messages:
    1,080
    I had lunch with a climatologist at a convention a few years ago, when this hysteria was approaching maximum. He was telling us that the Romans left records of the grape harvest from vineyards just south of Hadrian's Wall, in northern England, and how many amphorae of wine were created. Those same Romans also left records of the Nile freezing 500 years later. I don't recall hearing of any internal combustion engines, coal fired power plants, or any other of the present day villains of climate change being in existance back then, nor any efforts being made to reduce their output of CO2, to cause the cooling recorded.

    This is weather variation, and not the catastrophe as which it is being portrayed. Even my eco-nazi ex-neighbor, who is a physicist researching this stuff, will admit that the whole thing is overblown, but still insists, that even though that is so, it doesn't change his mind that we are responsible for the changes, even though his own data doesn't support him. You just can't reason with a true believer.

    The earth has changed polarity at least 4 times during its history, which means that the North and South poles have rotated through 180 degrees. This is an ongoing process, as is evidenced by the increasing variation between True North and Magnetic North. As the difference increases, the poles will become closer to the present day tropic regions, and vice versa. That will cause a change of surface weather worldwide, but probably not in the grand scheme of the world as a whole. Other natural occurences have caused worldwide weather changes of varying intensities and duration, such as the eruption of Krakatoa. The dust cloud spread by that eruption eventually covered most of the world, causing lowered light intensity, cooler temperatures, and lower crop yields. It has been suggested that the Dark Ages were caused by volcanic eruptions, as well, resulting in not just the darkness of light, but also the darkness of repression of the populace by the Churches and ruling class.

    As a side note, of the 1700 "scientists" who signed the declaration on global warming, approximately 3/4 of them were concerned about the potential for a new mini Ice Age just a few years before, and were researching that. When it became evident that the real money was in researching global warming, they changed sides.
     
  13. bocephus

    bocephus Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    527
    Why no mention of the amount of CO2 given off by volcanoes, or other gasses-toxic even? How about the volcanic vents by Mammoth in the Sierras, get too close you die!! Man could never produce enough CO2 to make a difference, the Earth itself far outdoes anything man could do. Without CO2 plant life will cease to exist, and the more CO2 the better plants grow.

    Interesting how the left blames CO2 but they also say that composting and doing other "green" things helps our environment, anyone know what happens when you compost waste?
     
  14. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,489
    The above website has some interesting reading. An excerpt:

    "Other problems with the ice cores include meltwater moving through the ice; Bacteria in the ice releasing gases even in 500,000-year-old ice at great depth; and contamination and losses during drilling and core recovery process. Jaworowski wrote,

    “Until 1985, the published CO2 readings from the air bubbles in the pre-industrial ice ranged from 160 to about 700 ppmv, and occasionally even up to 2,450 ppmv. After 1985, high readings disappeared from the publications.”

    Beck found,

    “Since 1812, the CO2 concentration in northern hemispheric air has fluctuated exhibiting three high level maxima around 1825, 1857 and 1942 the latter showing more than 400 ppm.”

    Chicken Little is alive and well.
     
  15. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,715
    I don't even give credence to the methods used to age the ice cores. Those methods are based on assumptions that are outside the realm of science - but that doesn't stop "science" from using those methods as long as it helps to further the leftist agenda, to which nearly all scientists belong.
     
  16. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,238
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    What a huckster. He shows us one season of glacial ice falling into the sea. That's what it normally does.

    I remember the gloom and doom scientists in the 1970's telling us that global COOLING was going to endanger us all, and they presented a lot of science to prove an ice age was coming.

    It's all a political scam.
     
  17. joe kuhn

    joe kuhn Furry Lives Matter TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,106
    Location:
    Naperville, IL
    I have to agree with an overall criticism here: James Balog is only presenting a small part of an argument.

    He needs to focus him cameras on sea levels at the beaches around the world to show that effect and he also needs to include something about the CO2 levels relating it to temp.

    The argument goes like this: man puts extra CO2 in the air, temps rise to unprecedented levels, ice melts, sea levels rise, people move away from the coast...Why is a higher sea level bad? (Am I missing something?)

    His presentation needs work.

    Thanks

    Joe
     
  18. oskerspap12

    oskerspap12 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    Messages:
    1,235
    These scientists have to have a job......right? Well,they have to study something or they will be out of work.So its global warming,or stand in the unemployment line......we'd never know one way,or the other.....would we?

    D.P.Reynolds
     
  19. joe kuhn

    joe kuhn Furry Lives Matter TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,106
    Location:
    Naperville, IL
    Sent an email to his Extreme Ice Survey suggesting they show video of sea levels rising. This guy is into photography, but the sea ice melting is only part of the picture. To be convincing the rest of the story will have to be told in a message just as clear.

    Maybe they can join up with the groups concerned about sea levels...

    Somebody needs to put it all together.
     
  20. joe kuhn

    joe kuhn Furry Lives Matter TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,106
    Location:
    Naperville, IL
    Here's a Google Map on sea levels and land shrinkage. Europe would get clobbered.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.