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O/T .223 Rifles

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by jakearoo, Nov 26, 2007.

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  1. jakearoo

    jakearoo Active Member

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    Continuing my Rifle education who knows about the .223 caliber. I know it is the main military caliber and the ballistics but what are good platforms for this round. If one wants both good accuracy as well as firepower what are the best guns. Obviously, the round can be used in most actions but are there semiautos out there which are more like a conventional rifle instead of the whole military thing? Thanks, Jake
     
  2. Sam (ATA Noobie)

    Sam (ATA Noobie) Member

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    I've owned a Savage FP w/ a bi-pod, Leupold hardware, and a Bushnell Elite 4200 (8-32x44mm) in .223 as well as Bushmaster.

    They're both long gone. As far as I'm concerned the .223 is useless unless ALL you're doing is punching holes in paper. And at that point, why not get a .22lr? You can get sub MOA in a .22 these days.
     
  3. Steve-CT

    Steve-CT TS Member

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    There are few .223 semi autos that are not AR-15 based. The main difference is the chamber specification. Commericial .223 ammo is NOT the same animal as military 5.56x45mm (5.56 NATO)Even though they are dimensionally almost identical to the naked eye. There are subtle, chamber and headspacing differences between the two that can make it potentially hazardous to shoot military 5.56mm ammo from certain, commercially made rifles chambered for .223 Remington.

    There are actually far more bolt action .223 styles than "non-AR-15 based" semis on the market

    If you get a commercial, .223 rifle - DO NOT shoot military style rounds such as "Ball, M-193 -55 grain fmj" or "Ball, M-855" or Ball, SS-109 (62 grain)Use only commercial branded .223 Remington in these rifles. I believe the Remington 742 and/or 7400 may have been offered in .223 at one time. I don't believe they currently are.

    The AR-15 style platform, is the most versatile, most proven and developed rifle system available in this caliber and most AR-15 style brands use compromise barrels that can handle either the military 5.56 ammo OR the commerical spec'd .223 Remington. If you're considering a ".223" auto - what are you considering it for? Target shooting? Then definitely get the AR.
    Varmint hunting? Again - the AR.

    That's pretty much the reason why there are few other "non AR based" .223 semis out there. It's a far superior rifle than the Ruger Mini-14 in every category. I can't think of other "conventional" appearing rifles that are semi auto chambered for this round. Although, I believe the AR-15 is VERY conventional and every American should own at least one and be proficient with it.
     
  4. Steve-CT

    Steve-CT TS Member

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    Actually, right now, Remington only offers the pump "model 7615" in .223 and it looks like a model 760 adapted to take AR-15 magazines. On the autos, it may have been that .243 - not .223 was the smallest they offered.

    Visit www.ar15.com for skinny on ARs.
     
  5. Jerry944t

    Jerry944t Well-Known Member

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    If you are ever interested in an extremely accurate, moderately priced bolt action .223 look no further than Savage. I have one with their 27" fluted heavy stainless steel barrel, "accutrigger" and laminated stock.

    With decent handloads it will put them all in one hole at 100 yards all day long. With factory ammo it groups less than 1". The only trick is to get a good scope. Take a look at the Savage web site.

    Smash Em,

    Jerry
     
  6. wyomingjayhawker

    wyomingjayhawker TS Member

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    I have 3 223's ,The best in my opion is a heavy barrel SAKO,I have a 14/5 by 50 Vampime scope on it very good up to 250 yards, deadly on prairedogs, they jusy go whoop, and that is about it for them,as for target shooting it is a tack driver
    Chuck
     
  7. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    USELESS?........USELESS?....My god, what closet have you been hiding in, Sam?

    I have to bring 2 so I don't have to stop shooting when the barrel gets too hot to touch.

    If I could only have one caliber it would be a .223, NOthing has given me more juice over the years than that caliber.

    A thousand brass for 35 bucks, instead of 28 cents apiece, and you're on the way to one of the few things that are the most fun you can have with your pants on.

    And if your rifle is heavy enough you get to watch the splat.

    HM
     
  8. maclellan1911

    maclellan1911 TS Member

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    I also got the 223 bug, camr across these looking around
    View Full-Size Image Our newest AR-15 pistol model featuring a 6.5" barrel, no buttstock and a padded receiver extension tube. Product Details...
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    $869.00 MSRP

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    • Must be logged in with Dealer account to order
    .
     
  9. Sam (ATA Noobie)

    Sam (ATA Noobie) Member

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    Not much a varmint shooter. Only kill the things I eat.

    However, if I were to buy another long-range rifle, it would be in a caliber bigger than a .223

    You can buy surplus .308 and .30-06 ammo too
     
  10. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    You don't buy the ammo, just the brass. then you load a nice explosive bullet with a powder charge for godawful speed and get out there to feed the nice eagles and other creatures a rodent dinner. Low recoil is necessary when you shoot 3-400 rounds a day.

    One time there were 7 eagles as our dinner guests. I like to think they appreciated it.

    HM
     
  11. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    .223 in a good rifle is easily capable of sub-moa.

    Presently have a Remington 24" heavy bbl varmint special in that cal. topped with a VXIII 6.5/20 that'll shoot 1/2 min groups all day long if I do my part. Also a stainless Ruger 77mkII sporter that's a lot handier and'll still shoot around 1".

    US Army let me use one of their M-16s back in 1967-68 but I preferred the M-60 machine gun for such serious work.

    That's the limit of my experience with the .223

    John C. Saubak
     
  12. KEYBEAR

    KEYBEAR Active Member

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    Sam Look around 30-06 is about gone (clean stuff) you can still buy 308 but that,s getting slow . The best rifle I,v found is the Remington PSS for the 223 and slow is better . Load down for a group 2400 is fast ??
     
  13. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Sam (ATA noobie), quote: "....As far as I'm concerned the .223 is useless unless ALL you're doing is punching holes in paper...."

    Yeeeeaaaah, tell all the sage rats, gray diggers, rockchucks, badgers and coyotes I've shot that the 223 is "useless unless ALL you're doing is punching holes in paper".

    I have several .223 rifles, and intend to acquire more. Most are AR15s, but my favorite is my Browning 1885 Single Shot High Wall. I topped it with a Leupold 6.5-20x 40mm scope with target knobs. I've killed more critters with this rifle than with all my other guns combined, and believe me, I have a large collection. The 28" barrel gives me an extra 100 to 200 fps, depending on the load and bullet. Have used it for coyoting too (though I prefer my 1885 in .22-250 for that). In fact, I like this rifle so much that I realized I might actually wear it out. So when I heard Browning was discontinuing this caliber in the High Wall and was replacing it with a Low Wall, I ordered a spare High Wall. This was nearly a year after I purchased my first one. And from some quirk of fate, the serial numbers are consecutive. Just bought my son a Savage Predator Rifle in .223. In addition to rifles, I also have a .223 handgun for coyoting. And at some point I intend to pick up an AR15 DCM model for high power matches.

    The .223 is a wonderful cartridge for varmint and coyote hunting. And with the proper bullet, it makes a good fur cartridge too. For high magnification scopes on a varmint rifle, the sight picture rarely is thrown off target from recoil, unlike, say, the .22-250. This means you usually don't need a spotter to see your hits on varmints.

    The .223 is easy to reload, brass has a reasonably long life, brass is usually plentiful and cheap, it doesn't require a lot of powder, and it doesn't burn out barrel throats. With careful handloads, it rivals the .222 Rem for accuracy. It's a very efficient cartridge from a case volume, powder amount and bore size standpoint.
     
  14. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    I have shot and loaded the 223/5.56 since before my army days. It is a fantastic round. Fast enough to do what you need out to around 300 yards, slow enough to not eat barrels. Cheap brass, cheap loading, world class accuracy, and since it is a military caliber, brass and loading data are plentiful.

    For rifles, I now load only the 223/5.56, 308/7.62 and the fantastic 30/06. Military standards and world class cartridges all.
     
  15. Inspector 12

    Inspector 12 TS Member

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    I have two .223 rifles. One a bushmaster AR 15 platform, the other a Remington XP 100 R pistol that was converted into a short barreled rifle. Both are extremely accurate both for shooting paper and varmints. The .223 will do much better on varmints than a .22lr in the wind.

    Also as noted, easily reloadable caliber with many favorable brands of components available.
     
  16. ricks1

    ricks1 TS Member

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    223 is grrrrrrrrate if you want a good auto the Ruger mini 14 is what you are looking for it will shoot both mil and domestic it is not a one holer but is good enough i have a rem 788 bought when they came out will shoot less than 1in at 200yd have got 2 foxes at over 300yds if you get one plan on loading for it or dont shoot the mil stuff brass is the best resize amd trim rick
     
  17. Rooksd1

    Rooksd1 Member

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    Best accuracy for non custom guns, Cooper, and Savage. www.whittakergun.com in Kentucky has a good web site and great prices. Call and ask for Darrell
     
  18. School Teacher

    School Teacher Well-Known Member

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    I am with Halfmile on reloading for the .223 Remington cartridge. Get some good brass (I use Remington) and stay away from military surplus ammo. For the really serious shooter, you can find very high grade match brass from Lapua and others.


    I shoot a Ruger 77 MKII Long Range Rifle in .223 Remington. I punch paper for fun as I don't shoot to kill anymore.


    For powder, I like IMR 4895 because of its versatility and also use it in the .30-06 and .35 Remington. In the .223, I use a Speer 52 grain HPBT match bullet over 24.5 grains of 4895. This is under a maximum load but, for me, is very accurate.


    I determined the Cartridge Over All Length to seat the bullet .002" off of the lands with a Sinclair International tool.


    With a Leupold 6x18 AO scope, I am able to shoot ½ MOA 5 shot 100 yard groups.


    The .223 Remington is a fine cartridge to shoot on paper.
     
  19. oddlott

    oddlott Member

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    When I shot my M-1A I used military .308 nation match brass with good results. What is wrong with .223 military brass? Thanks. Dennis
     
  20. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    All you have to do is weigh it. Provided it is trimmed to length, the case capacities will be equal for equal weight brass.

    Also, in my experience, the mil stuff has a little more capacity than commercial.

    Sod poodles don't care.

    HM
     
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