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Need some shoot $$$ advice

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by mixer, Jun 13, 2011.

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  1. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    My club, Markham Trap shoots at a county owned & operated range in the Ft.Lauderdale area of S. Florida. For ATA events the county charges us $24/100 plus an overage fee for actual targets thrown based on the machine counters.

    Add to that the daily ATA,FTA fees of $4.50 & county imposed lead reclamation $1 fee and it's up to $29.50 for the first event shot before any profit for the club to cover our expenses. The county is adament on the price they charge us so there's no chance of a reduction.

    The question is how much can we add to the above costs per shooter to cover our expenses without having the shooters say "too expensive?" As a comparison, the cost for the public to shoot 100 targets is $33/100.


    Eric
     
  2. dverna

    dverna Active Member

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    Asking here is a waste of time. Call clubs in the FL area (or get their programs) to see what your market is.

    Some guy will come here and tell you he shoots $20 ATA targets. But it will be some place in the middle of nowhere or a two trap club.

    Don Verna
     
  3. 320090T

    320090T Well-Known Member

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    Disconnect the counters?
     
  4. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    The city is renting their facilities to you for $24.00 bucks per hundred targets shot. If they have the only taxi in town you either pay the going rates or walk? I know it's a necessity these days but I hate seeing cities,counties and states getting in clay target businesses. That could create a bias when it comes to doling out permits for a new shooting facility in the area?

    Hap
     
  5. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    I don't know where the invisible 'too much' line is but there is a limit somewhere. Your club is in poor position to become profitable from registered shooting regardless of how high you raise the prices. There is already too many hands in the till.

    But on the other hand you probably don't have all the other financial obligations that go with throwing targets (assuning the county takes care of those costs) - so how much do you need?

    Probably the best way to keep your club solvent is to have other activities like meat shoots and games that bring in a lot of money with not that many targets being thrown. The registered shooting could then be done on a break even basis as a benefit to your club members.
     
  6. Pull & Mark

    Pull & Mark Well-Known Member

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    Mixer, Its $29.20 per hundred at the current Markham price, not $33. Have you asked Joe how he is doing it??? Break-em all. Jeff
     
  7. Nuts

    Nuts TS Member

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    Is the $1 fee for the day, or per hundred?

    Sounds like the county is double dipping,,,they charge you for lead reclaimation, then have a reclaimer come in and reap profits from the sale of reclaimed lead.

    And I take it there is no trophy money in the $24 fee, which when compared to this area is a bit steep

    Our club gets $18 for targets, then adds in trophy money, which usually gets it up to the $24 range, then though add on the state and ATA fees.
     
  8. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    Nuts,

    There has never been any reclaimer at the trap range. It's a very complicated ongoing issue. It's $1 a day per shooter for the lead fee. Your $18 is our $24, add to that ATA/FTA/County lead fee and it's now $30 for our cost for the first event 100 targets. We add a small amount for expenses and we give back $5 per shooter per event for class & yardage purses paid 2 places 60/40%

    Pull & Mark:

    It's $33/100 if you don't buy a 10 round ticket. A 4 round ticket costs $33. Joe who?

    Eric
     
  9. Pull & Mark

    Pull & Mark Well-Known Member

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    Eric, You have a PM. Jeff
     
  10. daddiooo

    daddiooo TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Smells like a ripoff. Most reputable lead reclaimers charge nothing. They take all the lead and pay the club for the value of half of the reclaimed shot.

    Example: One club had a harvest volume of 65 55 gallon drums of shot. Reclaimers took all the lead and gave the club a check for $20,000. Not sure how many pounds of lead are in a 55 gallon drum but I'd say it was a pretty good deal for the club.

    So the county is charging a $1 dollar per shooter, per day fee for lead reclaimation??? Look in Trap and Field magazine and there are a couple of lead reclaimers that regularly advertise in there. (Gipson & Ricketts) Call one and just inquire about their terms. Might not be a bad idea to call your county commissioner and casually volunteer that info and question why you're being charged a reclamation fee by your county government, respectfully of course.

    Please update us on the turn of events.
     
  11. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    Daddiooo,

    It's not that simple. There is no easy way to get the machinery into the drop zone given the tree growth and non level ground. The trees are Melaleuca's and can't just be cut down like other types of trees. There are strict EPA rules about cutting and disposing to prevent the spread of seeds as Melaleuca's choke off native tree's.

    You have to remember that we're dealing with a local government and they move very, very slowly and run everything through risk management and cost benefit analysis. BTW everyone who shoots is charged the same $1 a day not just the club.

    Eric
     
  12. j2jake

    j2jake Well-Known Member

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    Eric what expenses does the "club' have? Postage? All other costs are paid for by the county aren't they? As far as the counters go they are not trustworthy. I have found that they show less than actual. Jake
     
  13. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    pweld & j2jake,

    $24/100 is what we pay to the county. There's no profit in charging what your cost is. They no longer furnish pullers as they don't want to pay for them on tournement days. As far as expenses we have a $2400 per year premium on a $2,000,000 county mandated liability insurance policy so that's $200 a month.

    Then there's the extra target costs that we have to pay. When we throw 6,000 targets on a shoot day the county says it was 6600 targets by the machine counters so that's 600 extra at $24/100 or $144. It's always a battle to negotiate the overage cost.

    We used to have two ATA shoots per month but we had to cut it back to one because the county said that the public complained that we were using too many fields (3 out of 5) and they couldn't shoot.

    What we have done is to raise the cost to shoot ATA at Markham to $42 for the first event and $36 for the 2nd & 3rd events, ATA/FTA/county lead fees included. We are also going to put $5 per shooter per event into the class and yardage purses paid 2 places at 60/40%.

    Considering that the shooters used to shoot 2 ATA events per month at Markham and now it's one event they're actually saving money each month. As you said things are more expensive down here especially when you're the only game in town.

    Eric
     
  14. opa41

    opa41 TS Member

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    Eric you fighting a batle you can not win.Live with it.

    George
     
  15. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    George,

    As you well know, the more things change, the more they stay the same. Say hi to Jackie for me.

    Best, Eric
     
  16. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    Paul,

    We own the voice release systems and that's it. It's almost impossible to get a few volunteer shooters to score all they want to do is shoot not help out. Anyway our next shoot is on the 26th so we'll see what the reactions are to the new pricing. Thanks to all who replyed for your opinions and suggestions.

    Eric
     
  17. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    Paul,

    The county would love it if we stopped having tournaments. They say we are wearing out their trap machines too fast.

    Eric
     
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