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Need info on Nitro shells

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Tyrone Biggums, Nov 6, 2011.

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  1. Tyrone Biggums

    Tyrone Biggums Member

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    Today while shooting we had a bit of controversy regarding shells. The maximum velocity allowed was 1290 fps. Nitro or Winchester sporting clays shells were not allowed. One shooter was shooting Nitro shells and had them in a box that said nitro 27 handicap which would be legal. However he was dropping his hulls on the ground and someone brought it to our attention that his hull said neither 27 or gold sporting. They had nitro then a space below where 27 or gold should have been. Also on the bottom they said max-1 1/8-7 1/2. One shooter that reloads had a bunch of nitro hulls and this is what we found the nitro 27's said hdcp-1 1/8-7 1/2 the sporting clays hulls said max-1 1/8-7 1/2. When asked the shooter said the shells were fifteen years old and that's why the hulls said neither 27 or gold sporting. So my question is does anyone know when the sporting clays shells were introduced or if the nitro 27's used to say max instead of hdcp?
     
  2. kgp912kgp

    kgp912kgp Active Member

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    I'd "up" this question someone here must know the answer and I'm interested in the findings....
     
  3. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

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    For what its worth, I don't believe they were making Nitros 15 years ago.
     
  4. TC

    TC TS Member

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    Is it possible those hulls were reloads?
     
  5. Tyrone Biggums

    Tyrone Biggums Member

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    They looked like new shells but I guess could have been reloaded. Part of his defense was they were new shells and were not sporting clays but that's what the hull looked like to us. If they were reloaded it wouldn't have been an issue.
     
  6. RayReys

    RayReys Member

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    Don't know if this helps any but:



    I have in my hands a 1995 Remington Catalog....

    There's a listing for 'Premier(tm) Nitro 27 Handicap Trap Loads'


    RTL12NH 12ga premier nitro 27 hdcp 2 3/4" HDCP dram, velocity 1200fps (@ 3ft), 1 1/8 oz shot, avail in 7.5, 8

    NEW for 1995.


    unfortunately the shotshell cutaway, well, shows everything but the outside...
    ...but the top of the box, from what I can make of the catalog pic...only has four listings ( gauge, ...can't make this one out..., dram equiv., shot size)


    No other Nitro 27 loads listed for 1995


    I also have a newly bought box of Premeir Handicap Nitro 27s...

    top of box lists:
    12ga 2 3/4" HDCP dram 1235fps 1 1/8oz shot, size 8
    *new, with softer recoil*
     
  7. Tyrone Biggums

    Tyrone Biggums Member

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  8. Longbowsmith

    Longbowsmith Member

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    Saw some Nitro Sporting Clay loads at Dick's last week that were listed on the box as 1300fps. Said on the box they were not ATA legal.
     
  9. MKillian

    MKillian TS Member

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    Considering that SAAMI specs permit a factory load to vary up to 90 fps either side of its advertised velocity, it hardly matters whether the loads were advertised as 1290 or 1300 fps.

    Mike K
     
  10. Tyrone Biggums

    Tyrone Biggums Member

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    It does matter if they are 1290 or 1300 fps. This was not an ata shoot but the rules cleary stated 1290 max velocity. I personally see no difference in 10 fps but sporting clays shells were not allowed. All I want to know is if Nitro 27's ever had Max listed for the dram eq. on the hull. All I have seen listed on the hulls for Nitro 27's is HDCP for a dram eq.
     
  11. miketmx

    miketmx Well-Known Member

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    I bought some Winchester AA Super Handicap shells in the early 90's and they kicked like a mule compared to today's Super Handicap shells which are rated at 1250 ft/sec. The question should be: When did Remington first make Nitro Sporting Clays loads ?
     
  12. FlaLagarto

    FlaLagarto Well-Known Member

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    Don't remember the year.. but Nitro's come out the year of the big blizzard that shut down KY .. I remember this because I was sitting in a truck stop waiting to get back on the road headed to the Dixie Grand at Savannah, GA. When I got there and walked into the building carrying 2 flats.. everyone was wanting to buy some from me because the truck from Remington was stuck in the snow somewhere.
     
  13. Longbowsmith

    Longbowsmith Member

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    TB, These particular Sporting Nitros that had 1300fps listed on the box had Max dram equivalent inked on the hulls.
     
  14. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    If it says not ATA legal, there not. But, over the years rem has marked a lot of things on their shells for promotion also...
     
  15. Cheetah

    Cheetah Member

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    Tyrone,
    In the mid 90's is when the Nito 27 Handicap Remington shell became available.
    The boxes were marked 2&3/4, 1&1/8 o/z, MAX dram, with no designation of velocity and the shell bore the same markings.
    I had been using the Remington Duplex 3 dram 7 1/2 X 8's untill these were introduced and switched to the Nitro's when they became available.

    Hope this helps !!!!

    Best regards,

    Harold Steen
    Master Class Veteran
    NSCA# 500292
     
  16. Border Bandit

    Border Bandit Well-Known Member

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    Excuse me; but did you use the word "confronted"... over what was NOT printed on a factory hull? Do you guys test all the reloaded shells for shot size and velocity? Please tell me where you hold these shoots, so I can make sure to never attend any of 'em.

    Our friend Spears likes to talk about Kentucky "8's"...that's 1 1/4 oz of #4's

    amazed in PA....mike
     
  17. Tyrone Biggums

    Tyrone Biggums Member

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    I guess confronted was a bad word for someone who looks to be a bit sensitive. He was asked. Not by me as I have nothing to do with management there I just overheard and wanted to know who was right. The issue wasn't with what wasn't printed on the factory hull it was with what was printed. Which to all of us looked identical to a sporting hull except it said neither 27 or gold sporting. I called Remington today and they told me they have never made a nitro 27 handicap shell that said max. They said the only hulls that said max were the gold sporting. It really makes no difference to me what anyone shoots I just simply wanted to know who was right. This was not a heated confrontation just a group of guys talking with different opinions on who was right.
     
  18. Dougbbbb

    Dougbbbb TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    2 years ago at the NJ State Shoot I was going around picking up empty hulls after a Handicap event and found numerous 3 Inch magnum empties.. Whomever it was didn't think to pick them up.Guess he didn't care..


    Doug
     
  19. Mike Hessong* (MH*)

    Mike Hessong* (MH*) Active Member

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    I hate that so many people felt a need to "delete" their messages; I thought this was a good, informative discussion. I have something to add to "RayReys" thread. I went and pulled one of my original issue boxes of the "first" generation Nitro 27 (Premier Target Loads), and like RayReys described, everything he mentioned is on the top of the box EXCEPT the FPS is NOT called out. The only thing on the top of the first boxes of Nitro 27's was: Gauge (12), Length (2 3/4"), Dr. Equiv. (HDCP), Oz. Shot ( 1 1/8") and Shot (7 1/2). The newest generation (almost marked "New Softer Recoil"; and from what I understand, this is the 3rd generation of Nitro 27's) has an ADDED notation for Velocity FPS (1235).

    The original Nitro 27 boxes are marked as code "RTL12NH-7 1/2", and the headstamp still says "Remington - Peters" just like the old Blue Magics. The newer version Nitro 27's are marked as code "STS12NH7" even though they are 7 1/2's, and the headstamp is marked as "Remington - 12 GA."

    I do know one thing; the original shells without any speed markings on them will "rattle your teeth" !!!

    I do lots of shooting of my shells over a Chrony F1 chronograph to "try" and match my favorite factory shells, and I shoot to verify if I have achieved the results I wanted. I shot some of the "original" Nitro 27's (thru a 34" K-80 trap barrel with my LF choke, not how test standards are used to prove shell speeds), and the Chrony is a light sensing chronograph, so they tend to read higher FPS's, plus the extra 4" of barrel, but in my gun, those old shells were averaging 1352 FPS !!! I shot a dozen or so "newer" (softer recoil, 3rd generation) Nitro 27's and they averaged out to 1266 FPS. Those are the shells I like shooting in my handicap events.

    I also shot some of the Winchester AA "Gray) Super Handicap shells, and like others stated, they kick a little as well, and I also shoot them in handicaps events. They chronographed and average of 1281 FPS thru my trap barrel. The box is marked as them having a 1250 FPS speed.

    Just some things I dug up around the house this evening. Hate that some of those starting this thread won't hear some findings that people have wanted to help with.

    Mike* (MH*)
     
  20. Tyrone Biggums

    Tyrone Biggums Member

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    Mike I appreciate your info the reason I started this thread was to get my questions answered. The reason I deleted it was because a few guys started to offer opinions on a situation they weren't there to see. I responded to those opinions and they deleted their threads which then made my response confusing to others viewing. I then deleted my original post because I didn't want this to turn into an argument about how a situation was handled. I simply wanted to know if Remington ever listed a max dram eq. on a nitro hull that wasn't a sporting clays 1300 fps load. I called Remington today and they said they only listed max on the sporting clays hulls. Thanks for your response I just don't see why other feel the need to comment on a situation rather than answer a question that was asked.
     
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