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More P/W 800+ Problems

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Rich219, May 6, 2010.

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  1. Rich219

    Rich219 Active Member

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    I'm really starting to lose my patience with this press. The timing is off, again. It happened last week when I had all of my problems with the press and the only way I could fix it was by completely disassembling the machine and reassembling it. It will not make the "click" sound at the top of the up motion of the handle. It is also only indexing the stations half way? Any ideas?

    Here's a vid of the index plate, I'm guessing it may have something to do with it?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA6eQsTeb3Q


    I can get vids of any other part/motion of the press just let me know. I'd really hate to have to send this to P/W to have them work out the problems because shipping would be a killer.
     
  2. setool

    setool Member

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    get ahold of whiz white, s&w supply...

    he knows this machine better than the factory guys !!!

    good luck,

    mark s.
     
  3. KEYBEAR

    KEYBEAR Active Member

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    I have loaded on PW,s for years and never had to disassemble one to fix anything ??
     
  4. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    call whiz, trust me
     
  5. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Very likely your primer feed assembly came loose. Check it by removing it and see if the machine indexes properly!!
     
  6. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    ONLY way you can get the 800 Plus "out of time" is by forcibly operating it.

    When something is amiss, go gently and/or STOP.

    Have you messed with the Index Pad? I assume so, because you say it won't go click. The click sound is made when pin #98 slips off the edge of the Index Pad and pops down. Sounds like the Index Pad is not adjusted correctly, rotation-wise.

    If you've changed the height of the Index Pad, you, unfortunately, have introduced a whole can of problems, UNLESS you readjust as per instructions. I suggest that you have enough clearance between Index Pin #98 and the edge of the Index Pad to be about the thickness of a credit card. The book says 0.020", but I error on the side of too much, and NEVER with the pin riding against the edge of the Pad. If you changed the Pad's height, then skip everything I have described below, and start at the paragraph below, "I would empty the machine......."

    If you are not sure what to do, ask before you change something. You change three adjustments and you have just introduced the possibility of 6 combinations or readjustments; alter 4 and you've introduced the possibility of 24 combinations. This is a machine that MUST have everything set correctly before it will operate smoothly.

    If you have changed the Primer Seating Assembly's height, the Shell Seating Post's height, or the Index Pad's height, you will have problems, problems that are not self-evident, if it's not done correctly.

    Also, in looking at the video, with the Crosshead in the full up position, and it refuses to come down, I have to think you have either (1) changed the setting of the aluminum turret on the Pinion Gear (possibly through excessive force), (2) have or had a shell stuck at station #8, the shell ejection station [not always easily visible as it attempts to drop out of the machine AND a hard pull of the handle can case the turret to get out of time], (3) a wad sticking in the hull AND still partly in the Wad Carrier, or I can't think of what else sitting here at the computer.

    I would empty the machine of all hulls, shot, powder, and primers, remove the primer seating assembly, AND shell seating post, and then work on getting the Index Pad set right-FIRST. Then raise the Crosshead, and make sure the die at station #2 is centered EXACTLY around the depriming shaft (this is the timing issue). Work the handle, smoothly, until you feel the machine is rotating properly.

    Then, and ONLY then, insert the Shell Seating Post. Work the handle to ensure that this post is not set too high which will cause the machine to not rotate or rotate with resistance. Set its height such that a hull is inserted NO FARTHER into the die than level with the base of the die... you may have to pull the die out of the turret several times during this process until you confirm a level insertion. Work the handle to insure the machine rotates flawlessly.

    Then, and only then, move to the Primer Seating Assembly. Insert it and rotate the machine WITHOUT ANY HULLS, to make sure it rotates smoothly without any hiccups. Then insert a hull, rotate to station #2 and pop the spent primer out of the hull... I then individually reset that spent primer on the top of the primer seating post and insert it, as if I were priming a hull, normally. Pull the handle and at the powder drop station, remove that die, and confirm that the primer is seated level with the base of the hull. A primer not seated into the hull far enough will cause the machine NOT to rotate. AND, INSERTING ONE TOO DEEPLY has the same effect because the actual Primer Seating Shaft will not lower itself far enough to let that hull rotate easily. When you are acceptable to a level insertion, start reloading.

    Regarding the timing of the turret, the two, long 3/32 set-screws in the turret MUST ME DAMN TIGHT IN THE TURRET to prevent turning of the aluminum turret on the hardened pinion gear. Forcing an 800 Plus when you shouldn't will more than likely cause the aluminum turret to "slip" on the pinion gear and really start the timing problems.

    I'd reread your manual to be comfortable with what I have described above. How about the dealer you bought this machine from, if bought new; can't he be of service to you if close by? Is anyone around there knowledgeable enough to help?

    If none of the above helps you, and even though you didn't buy it from me, send it to me and I'll get it set correctly. Freight will be your responsibly, AND it must ship in an original P/W shipping box with all the plywood, etc., to protect it in transit.

    Jim White
     
  7. Rich219

    Rich219 Active Member

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    Whiz,

    Thanks for the info. I have not made any adjustments to the index pad. I did however tighten a bolt on the machine and it started working perfectly again. I bought the press used about 8 months ago and it worked flawlessly up until a week or two ago. The problems I'm having seem to be very minor and are usually fixed within a few hours at most.

    In the video the machine actually wouldn't continue up, the sizing dies where hitting the shell extractor on station 8. If I continue to have problems with this machine I'll ship it off to you and just pay you to give it the once over. Thanks.
     
  8. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    Whiz is a Whiz on PW. My P 2000 never worked smoothly from the day I bought it. After talking to Whiz and with a couple new parts he sold me, it now works like butter and I couldn't be happier with it. I cannot believe I used it for 8 years not working correctly and all the time I thought it did. Whiz is the man. While talking t o Whiz I realized that some of what he was telling me left me lost because I really did not understand how the loader worked as well as I should. I studied it very hard and operated it countless times without shells and then put to use his advice. I now feel like I actually understand it and what to do when it breaks or malfunctions. Bottom line - if it does not feel right, stop and figure out why before you bend or break something because there has to be a reason. If the primer assy or any part of the primer system is out of proper alignment, it will cause havoc
     
  9. skeeljc

    skeeljc Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    This just seems to confirm that the 900's and 2000's are a little bit more bullet proof when it comes to indexing.

    Jim Skeel
     
  10. Cowboy1

    Cowboy1 TS Member

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    "If the primer assy or any part of the primer system is out of proper alignment, it will cause havoc"

    Ain't that the truth!
     
  11. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    The bolt that you tightened... was it the 3/16" BHCS on the top-center?

    Normally, this does not loosen up because there are two roll pins on either side of it. However, if someone has removed it a couple of times, then its edge can get worn enough such that the roll pins won't hold it in position. I always replace that BHCS in a rebuild for this reason.

    This bolt is never tightened down all the way; just enough to ensure correct indexing AND enough to prevent shot from getting underneath the black plate.

    P/W used to ship the black plate with pieces of paper as spacers, but that is not presently done on the 800+ machines.

    WW
     
  12. 870compman

    870compman TS Member

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    Did you know there is a bushing in the wad feeder. The left main post is bushed where the wad feeder indexes. What happened to me was a piece of that bushing got worn and lodged under the wad feeder guide screw and would not allow the press to index.

    It caused me all kinds of headaches until I found it. When I finally did the guide was worn so bad I had to file it flat. I called PW and got a new bushing kit.

    You might look there if you are still having problems,

    the 870compman
     
  13. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    Actually, there are TWO bushings in the wad guide assembly; a flanged and a non-flanged bushing, #63 and #64 in the drawing below. I have these two bushing kits.


    View attachment 249173
     
  14. TjayE

    TjayE Member

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    Jim, THANKS.

    A picture is worth a thousand words.
     
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