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MILWAUKEE, A CITY OF STRIP MALLS & LOW PAYING JOBS

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by senior smoke, Aug 12, 2009.

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  1. senior smoke

    senior smoke Well-Known Member

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    HELLO:
    when you graduated highschool back in the 50's, it wasn't if you could find a job in the city of Milwaukee, it was where did you want to work? at that time Milwaukee was a city with good paying factory jobs where an able bodied man could support and raise a family on his income. over the years, most of the big factory employers left Milwaukee and low paying minimum wage jobs took there place. Milwaukee is now a city that offers low paying jobs with an abundance of area strip malls as your possible potential employer. Today, Milwaukee's number one employers are hospitals. if you are a male and over 50 years of age forget finding a good paying job in this city. yes, the hospitals have workers over 50 years of age, but they are mostly women. the other day at the gun club, i counted 12 men over the age of 50, and only one person still had a job. their jobs were either eliminated, or they were forced to retire. now i find out some of the largest hospitals in milwaukee are slashing ft good paying positions. where is a man over 50 to find a good paying job anymore? at the end of world war ll, 97% of all women stayed at home and the men worked. nowadays, most men over 50 are at home and their wifes are working. it is degrading. most parents want their children to have it better than themselves. at this point our parents had it better than most of us. i worry about my granchildren growing up in the world we live in today. seems like no one has any use for men over 50 years of age in the present workforce anymore. what do you think?
    steve balistreri
     
  2. spitter

    spitter Well-Known Member TS Supporters

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    Americans want to have it all ways... high paying jobs, while paying as little as possible for quality goods... how do you make that happen?!

    We continuously support outsourcing of manufacturing hardlines and textiles to foreign countries so we can buy our inexpensive linens, clothing, appliances, electronics, tools, etc... yet give lip service to buying "American".

    Look at the guns we buy, the cars we buy. Yes, American jobs support the distribution of foreign owned manufacturing, but the days of making our own toys has evaporated with our resolve.

    Look around the house, tell me how much American made product is in the kitchen, in the garage, in the bedroom or bathroom?!

    We did this to ourselves willingly...

    regards to all,

    Jay
     
  3. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    What you are describing SS is also known as the end of middle class america. Today's bread winner really needs to bring alot more to the employer's table than in the past if they want to keep their job. For better or worse, we are competing in a global economy for or livelyhoods. Most guys over 50 aren't prepared for this and they don't really have enough time left in their working life to get prepared. Not good but that is where we are.
     
  4. senior smoke

    senior smoke Well-Known Member

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    both of you bring up good points. but how did it work for us back in the 50's? is our current situation this mostly due to the trade agreement with mexico and canada?
    steve
     
  5. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    Well, I wasn't around in the 50's so I don't know how things were.

    But in my 30 years of being in the work force, I have seen a big shift away from manufacturing. Seems like we have an economy based on lawyers, doctors, real estate agents and the internet. I think that was what Jay was getting at.

    We like cheap goods and we-think we deserve to make six figures even though we don't really have any skills superior to what can be found in most third world countries. Can't have it both ways.

    NAFTA certainly didn't bring any jobs into this country although a few people did get wealthier.
     
  6. senior smoke

    senior smoke Well-Known Member

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    woldfram- i was around in the 50's. the first pt job i had i made 87cents per hour. believe it or not it seemed like i had more buying power than then today, even at those wages. it was a lot nicer time. most employers valued a long term employee, employees were usually proud for the company they worked for. a married man could start a family and work a ft job at the local factory and live pretty good. here in milwaukee, good paying jobs were plentiful, women could stay home raising their children and keeping them inline. sundays were a day of rest, families went to church. alot of people had families get together at grandma's or grandpa's house. plain and simple, it was a nice time to live in the 50's. people 50 and older remember what the country was like at that time. where did we go wrong?
    steve balistreri
     
  7. Bisi

    Bisi TS Member

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    Where did we go wrong? When we stopped being individuals and started becoming part of a group.

    I know what you’re talking about Steve, when you talk about the 50 plus guys having a hard time finding a job. I know a number of guys at our club whose jobs have disappeared or their businesses fell on hard times. These guys are having no luck at all finding good jobs. The jobs they are finding are in retail: Walmart. Home Depot, etc.

    Let’s face it - the white male has became the scapegoat for every problem in the world. The older white male still thinks he is an individual and can think for himself. The politically correct world doesn’t want that anymore. Everything in business and government is team/group now. Don’t have any strong opinions, just join with the rest of the team and have a group hug, or circle **** I have a friend whose son works for Toyota and they are told to go with the group/team consensus when confronting a problem even if he knows the group consensus is wrong. Better to be wrong with the group than right as an individual.

    Go take an employment test now. You will think you are applying to become a member of the Packers, Brewers, Cubs, Yankees…….. It is all team this, team that. What? I thought I was applying for a job that you needed done, not wanting someone to join a team.

    That is the problem with us old white guys, we just haven’t been used to being part of a group. Even the white women have been convinced by the government schools that their fathers & brothers, are the enemy. The enemy who is just waiting to discriminate against you because of your sex. So they have incorporated the group/team mentality and they are welcomed with open arms by corporations and government. Women are more adapt at being part of a group, so that is why they are more sought after in the corporate world . than the evil 50 plus year old white man.
     
  8. BRGII

    BRGII TS Member

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    When I was working in the private sector I was always getting called up to the supervisors office and getting my ass chewed for not being a TEAM player. I was a civil engineer. I finally got tired of that crap and told them to shove it up their posterior and started my own business. Best thing I ever did. Not an engineer now but a farmer and happier than hell.BRGII
     
  9. crusha

    crusha TS Member

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    Milwaukee, a town of Strip Malls and low-paying jobs? Can you show me an American city anymore that isn't? Milwaukee is a great place steeped in history and American culture. But to be truthful, also mostly a factory town. Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Detroit, Youngstown, Flint, Lansing, Saginaw, Cleveland, Toledo...the list just goes on, and on, and on. You and Luther are not alone, Smoke, trust me. You have a lot of company in this ordeal.


    For our part, Americans have been lazy and "entitled" for a long, long time, and now it's finally catching up with us. We've been blowing smoke up our own ass. All this talk about the "Greatest Generation," etc. was always hiding an unpopular truth. Unions, Medicare, Social Security...Obama is right about one thing, we HAVE had a welfare state in America for a long time now. It's just that the Corporations and the Unions were underwriting the cost of it. We were never quite as free and self-supporting as we believed we were.


    That situation worked well, as long as we were predominant over all other nations and there was no competition. As soon as the rest of the world woke the hell up and got their head out of their ass, it was all over. It has been for years, we just didn't know it yet. It happened to Europe first, and now is has caught up with us, too.


    For decades, other countries were way behind us. They lived in unimaginable (for us) squalor. Now they are getting a taste of the lifestyle we've had for generations, they like it - and they want more of it. You can't expect them to stay behind us forever. The rest of the world is simply catching up, that's all.


    It sucks and I hate it, but that's the way it is. Obama thinks we're ripe for takeover - to take the last wailing, hopeless step into despair and socialism. Finally, the Democrats think, after years of denying the obvious, after years of suburban Republican white voters neglecting our "own self-interest," we're finally ready to accept what they're offering and construct a massive safety-net of government regulation of everything, to protect us from our own desolation.


    10 more months will tell if they are right.
     
  10. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    buzzy, a lot of Milwaukeeans are "entitled". entitled to food stamps, Badgercare, Housing allowance, and a host of other things. The amount of people who have their hands out has swelled the population.

    The ethnic makeup of the city has changed greatly too. The flight to the suburbs is over a long time ago. Many have emigrated from Chicago to Milwaukee because Wisconsin welfare is much better.

    And Wisconsin fell to Obama in the election because of Madison(puke city) and Milwaukee. The rest of the state is mostly conservative.

    So did the decay cause the jobs to leave? Partly.

    Or did job loss cause decay? I dunno.

    When I was younger i used to like to go down to Milwaukee for a night out on the town, going to blues clubs and having a great time. I wouldn't go there on a bet now.

    HM
     
  11. senior smoke

    senior smoke Well-Known Member

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    if you agree with me or not, you all seem to have some interesting opinions.
    steve
     
  12. spitter

    spitter Well-Known Member TS Supporters

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    Hey, I'm 49... as a self-employed insurance broker hustling my tush out there, its all on me - always has been... never have known a paid holiday, paid vacation, paid healthcare, paid retirement or contributions... not saying I'm resentful.

    I just understand that I can spend when I've money in the checkbook and can't when there isn't. As a distraction, I work p/t for an Orvis outside of Chicago - doesn't pay much, but the perks are great (clothing and equipment discounts, sent me to fishing school and I've got an upcoming shooting school... in return they get great sales/service - always a salesman). I also work for my parks department to run my shooting range... these extras pay for my vice...

    I feel for friends who don't have one job, yet I've got three... would anyone else be doing them - I don't know... hard to find good people. My wife's on disability, but there are folks much worse off than we are... you just have to keep hustling and promoting yourself... the glass is always half full...

    regards to all,

    Jay
     
  13. bigdogtx

    bigdogtx Well-Known Member

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    Steve, et. al,,,,what you are trying to find is a "reason" to define the downturn of our GREAT country,,,,

    A wise fellow once said to me that the demise of all great societies was three fold, promiscuity, pornography and the straw that broke the camel's back was homosexuality. I am not going to anyone's morality nor am I to judge, but it seems a little to me to hold some water.

    Look at the 50's, Dad made the living, mom nurtured the kids, kept the house and all the other 99 chores she did. Then along came the 60's and your 'FREE LOVE'. Drug usage was common place and along came the promiscuity. The "family unit" broke down. It was now becoming common place for men to start cheating on their wives. She was working at home and he was out messing around. NOW starts saying to not put up with it, burn your bras, stand up for your rights. Oh, boy,,,,now women into the workplace and the "temptation" to step out once in a while and we come back to the family unit falling apart. The men, not wanting to get involved with another marriage and then divorce again, just started getting some and now kids don't have a "father" figure in their lives. Mom has to work and they become "latch key" kids. Their ideas of family were gotten off of television. Remember the gasps about Peyton Place. Now we have prime time television promoting pre-marital sex as well as homosexuality in plain view.

    He said the second problem as he points out is pornography. Playboy started it (I know there were others) and tried to promote nudity, but it degraded and DEVALUED the female again. Men, more and more just looked at a woman for a few sexual gratifications and he was on to the next bar for his next conquest. If he impregnated the woman, too bad. Now that there was NO father, big government steps in and PAYS the woman for the child and she can now make more money in many instances than working at a job and paying for daycare. If she needs housing, government steps in. If she needs food, government is there again. She now figures, why not use my body to make me some money and you have little girls seeing mother have food and shelter for just using you body. Degredation of ladies and the guys figure, why not just be a booty call. What the pornography started, abortion comes in and DEVALUES the human again. It is not a baby, it is just a bunch of cells and is really worth nothing. This carries over to childhood now as teens have no value system. We used to get into a fight, get done and shake hands and now be best buds.

    Finally he points to homosexuality as "the straw that breaks the bank". There is now no need for a man and a woman to fall in love and get married. You can just "buy" a child through invetrio (sp?) or if you have enough money, hire a good attorney. Television is now "promoting" this lifestyle as "normal" and you have no need at all for Mother and Dad. Now you have to get God out of the way also so people will "accept" this lifestyle. Finally getting rid of the need for family. Now we have "Gay Marriage".

    Now this has also spilled over into the workplace. Years ago, Paul Harvey every year had studies on how the American worker was MORE, by quite a bit, efficient than any other industrialized nation. What happened to that? Remember when "American Made" was the "BEST" product? What happened to this? I think we became complacent in the workforce and tried to do TOO MUCH "Keeping up with the Jones'". Now to do so, mom has to work to "make ends meet" and the family falls again. Pride in work fell as we saw goods manufacturing leave the USA and the pressure brought upon the corporation from unions and shareholders, each pulling for their interests. Many times the only option became to move the factory. Now the "high" paying jobs were lost and we had to buy those "foreign" made goods because we couldn't afford the costs. A LARGE part of the profit pressure also comes from the litigousness of our society. Cost rose so much from insurance and a benefits standpoint, i.e. Family Leave, that profits were being bombarded. Now get the governement on the bandwagon that profits are bad, and what would you expect the corporation to do?

    I could go on and on and we could all come up with "reasons" as they are infinite. I trully miss some of the earlier times of this country. I won't say the "good ole days", because some days today are great. I do think this country is evolving, but WHERE it evolves to, is disconcerting and I am VERY CONCERNED.
     
  14. copper

    copper Member

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    Well we can,t all be doctors or lawyers nor do a lot of people want to, lots of people want to work with the hands and heads ,that market has to many people at the moment. Pushing paper not for everyone. As far as money goes the big items house and car and insurance, property taxes look at what percentage of your pay goes to those compaired to years ago. A lot of sucessfull people will not admit to they had a head start, father had company family owned property left or money nothing wrong with that but be fair, and luck helps also.
     
  15. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    You guys are really on to something. Just moved out of one of these so called gated communities with a POA. Well the entire community is controlled by these ex-corporate middle managers who do nothing but follow the TEAM concept. You can be an individual anymore & live in a place like that. If you don't belong to a club and move to the beat of the same drummer you don't belong. Where is a real third party & a real candidate with the money & drive to change this country for the better. Too bad Perot didn't win back in 92. Would really love to know the real reason he dropped out of the race back then. Looks like bi sucking sound he talked about has taken all the breath out our industry.

    Phil Berkowitz
     
  16. Tripod

    Tripod Well-Known Member

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    You also can not get anyone to work on an older home around here. They are all so used to building new construction that they won't "do remodeling". I have a friend who asked me when I retired if I would like to take over some of his lawn mowing business as he could not keep up. He said he makes 40K just mowing yards seasonally. There are always ways to make a living if you are willing to work. I believe the the biggest problem is that people can now make a decent living doing nothing but collecting welfare. It's sometimes become a way of life for entire families.
     
  17. senior smoke

    senior smoke Well-Known Member

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    alot of truth in your responses.
    steve
     
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