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Marines buy Model 1911 Colts

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by SMOKEIT, Jul 29, 2012.

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  1. SMOKEIT

    SMOKEIT Well-Known Member

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    See the website above.

    This is interesting. John Browning's designs are hard to beat..over 100 years old and still competitive..amazing design...SMOKIT
     
  2. MDMike

    MDMike Well-Known Member

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    Is it any wonder. I was in the military when te M9 was tested and approved for issue. "You're making a big mistake" was what I told everyone. I was told that the 45 was inacurate, so I sent home for my Series 70 National Match pistol. That turned quite a few heads down at Bragg. I looked over one of the issue 45's and found the magazine was damaged and the barrel was shot out. I again sent home for a barrel, bushing, and some magazines. I replaced the worn parts and stoned the sear in an issue 45 and low and behold, it was quite a shooter. I'm sure a good pistolsmith could have done much better. However the "powers to be" at the Pentagon had their way. My final comment was "you can shoot the enemy once with a 45 (230 gr bullet) or twice with a 9 MM (115 gr. Bullet). But who listened. Seems things do go 180 degrees.
     
  3. SARGE75X

    SARGE75X Member

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    I totally agree with Mike, I'm a former Army MP so I know the 1911 quite well. That was a huge mistake switching to the M9. And I did the same thing bought my own 1911 and had my CO, and First Sgt all shooting it. Boy seems like yesterday but that was almost 40 years ago.
     
  4. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Can't get on to that website.


    When the military switched to the Beretta 9mm there was a story going around that the lease on our naval base in Italy was running out and the Italian Govt. would not renew it unless we bought the Beretta. At the point bidding for a new weapon was terminated and Beretta won the contract. We were strong armed into that weapon. Does anyone know that for sure??? Mike.
     
  5. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    Its not always what you shoot them with it's where you hit them that counts ... If you hit the enemy with a 9MM or a 45 and you hit them in flesh they will and can still kill you ... If you can't hit with it, it really don't matter what you carry ... First one in the chest, the next one goes in the head then notify the police and have them call the Ambulance for transport to the morgue ... This is the outcome with either a .45 or a 9MM, bet on it ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  6. SBray

    SBray Active Member

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    A friend of mine is a gunsmith that specializes in Colt 45 1911s. We have had many discussions about how the newer guns, like Sigs, are double action and have better technology. His main argument is that the 1911 action is simple and it's basic design makes it very dependable. Of course the 45 ACP is deadly accurate at close range.

    I have an 80 series Gold Cup and love to shoot it. I don't necessarily like cleaning it compared to my Glocks, but it usually goes to the range if I am going to shoot my handguns.

    My brother has a 9mm Beretta 92 and, even though it is well made, I just don't really like shooting it that much. I have several friends that really like the Beretta 92. I just would not want to go into combat with it.

    JMHO,

    Steve
     
  7. slic lee

    slic lee Active Member

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    Bulge-, Clinton made a deal with Beretta over the heads of the Pentagon that picked the 45. He demanded it, used pressure. The pentagon stated the M9 couldnt pass the longevity test, it failed at 20 or 25K rounds and Beretta refused to make it stronger. Clinton cared not. Once again,using the power of the purse strings got NATO to reduce the power of the 9MM round so the Beretta could pass.
    Not only did he do that,but also signed law that .308 bullets had to be made of a biodegradable material, only found in China. Then, a rule,on military bases no one can carry a loaded weapon, even if a side arm for police duty and when and if he came on any base all bolts of every rifle had to be removed, in other words totally incapable of being fired.
    The 1911 is the greatest, fastest shooting sidearm made in the WORLD. Lee
     
  8. quartering

    quartering Active Member

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    is it a $1,875.00 sidearm?
     
  9. Pull & Mark

    Pull & Mark Well-Known Member

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    Well, In the first episode of James Bond "M" took away his Beretta (because it jambed and almost killed him) and replaced it with a 7.62mm "You Remember the gun". break em all Jeff
     
  10. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Yes Pull and Mark they gave him a Walther PPK in 380. Mike.
     
  11. quartering

    quartering Active Member

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    ppk. $529.00. davidsons
     
  12. Sky Buster

    Sky Buster Sky Buster TS Supporters

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    Shortly after the M9 was adopted a friend of mine who was part
    of the Marine Corps Marksmanship Unit at Quanto remarked that
    "the Beretta 9mm is a good gun if you want to kill a cat!"
    Marine Special Operation troops have carried the 1911 for a
    good while.
     
  13. Oscar Ray

    Oscar Ray TS Member

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    The Marine Corp is only buying 1911's for the Special Operations units, it is not Corp wide.

    Oscar
     
  14. postmastertim

    postmastertim Wheels are falling off.... TS Supporters

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    Slic Lee

    Sorry but the M9 was adopted under Reagan in 1985. I was carrying mine as an MP well before Clinton.

    Persoanlly I preferred the 1911, but we were able to phase out the old .38 revolvers and issue the M9 to women and dog handlers.

    Local law enforcement officers have always carried their weapons loaded on every duty station I have been. I called a buddy at Fort Benning who is a DOD officer there and they still do today.


    Tim
     
  15. Terry_Maiden

    Terry_Maiden TS Member

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    Please be aware the U.S. Military went thru this whole business once before, in 1899. After the U.S. took the Philippines from Spain the natives there thought the U.S. would treat them the same way as we did with Cuba and leave them with their own democratically elected government. The U.S. didn't though, declaring the Philippines a Territory instead. The natives rebelled against the U.S Army that came in to replace the Spanish soldiers. At that time the standard side arm was a Colt made .38 double action revolver. The cartridge was the .38 Long. It was found that this cartridge lacked stopping power even when an attacker was shot several times in vital areas. The result was many U.S. soldiers with their heads chopped off. The Military in the Philippines issued a call for all the .45 revolvers, single or double action that could be gotten out to them ASAP. Anything that could use the .45 Colt cartridge. Worked much better when an attacker with a machete suddenly jumped up in the bushes.
     
  16. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    The special forces units found the M9 lacking in killing power and never liked it. They have been using the 1911 for awhile now. They also liked the M-14 in 7.62 much over the M-16 with it's 5.56 rounnd and aquired several 7.62 Nato weapons. The M-16 has a limited effective combat range while the 7.62 Nato is far superior at any long range engagment. Speed may kill but only to a point. Big Holes and more energy kill better! I once got into an argument with a guy about that. I told him we would go Bear hunting. He could used a .223 and I would take a .308 with Nosler bullets--He didn't take me up on that!
     
  17. MDMike

    MDMike Well-Known Member

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    WPT, in the thick of a fight it's a little hard to call where your bullets are going to hit an opponent. The agency I work for today has a standing order. "Under no condition and at no time will a warning shot be fired." I was explaining this to someone one day and his question was "Are you to shoot to wound or shoot to kill." I was at the Army AMU for 18 months, and while not a world class shooter, I think I can probably hold my own with a lot of shooters. At 150 yards with open sights it's a little hard to either pick out a knee cap or the center of a human head. Another different story is when the target you are attempting to shoot is shooting at you and your first instinct is survival. However, I have experenced this. "Center of mass" is the rule of thumb. What happens after the trigger is squeezed is another story. To sum it up, I can't call where a bullet will impact. However, I would like the bullets that I'm able to get off to do some good.
     
  18. Steve-CT

    Steve-CT TS Member

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    Notice the pendulum is swinging to large bore again even for police departments. Many departments that used to carry .38/.357 revolvers first went to 9mm, for a decade, then to .40, for a decade and are now switching over to .45 ACP

    Examples include: Connecticut State Police - adopted the Beretta 92 four years before it became the issue (M9) service pistol. (They had the old 92SB before the "92-SBF/92-F" came out. Then about mid 1990s, upgraded to the Sig P-229 in .40, and just a few months ago announced swapping out the Sig P-229s for Sig P-220s in .45 ACP.

    Bridgeport PD has done a similar move: 92's in the 90s. P-229s in 2000 and S&W M&P in .45 ACP just now. Woodbridge, CT PD just switched to P-220s in .45 ACP.
    West Haven and Ansonia CT PD have been carrying .45s all along ever since they switched from revolvers.

    New York State Police a hundred years ago used to issue Colt New Service in .45 Long Colt (not a bad holster arm even today!)downgraded to .38s in the 1950s, upgraded to .357s in the 1980s, 9mm in the 1990s, .40s ten years ago and .45 today. Pendulum swung full circle to relearn something they knew a century ago about handguns

    Should tell you something...

    .45 Works

    .40 is really "9"

    9 and .38 fail too often, .357 is just a .38 that is louder and recoils more.

    No handgun is ideal or "powerful" enough to be a true "manstopper". Even with the whiz bang dollar per shot crap ammo being hyped today.(which the military cannot use) Shot placement, a big hole and penetration through human beings is what counts and .45s do that the best of any handgun round that is reasonably powerful enough and still controllable for general issue to a military or police force.

    Period.
     
  19. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    MDMike,

    Most confrontations in civilian life are less than 30 foot away, and if you can't make the call at 30 foot or less under most conditions you are in trouble ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
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