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Live Birds or Clay.. Which More Challenging??

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by gdbabin, Aug 3, 2007.

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  1. gdbabin

    gdbabin TS Member

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    In the evenings lately I've been reading Jimmy Robinson's book "The Grand 75 Years A History of Trapshooting" in a futile attempt to appease my anticipation of the coming shoot.

    While reading the chapters where he tells how they switched from live birds, to targets around the time of the Civil War due to pressure from early PETA zealots, I wondered which would be more challenging to shoot? I wonder how the scores of a top shooter today would compare after attempting each.

    I'd think the live birds would be more of a challenge as they could go in virtually any direction once released.

    I also wonder if they collected up all the dead ones and made a stew for the evening meal?

    Think of all the feathers flying around when a stiff breeze came up, or the fluttering of the 'crips in the field of view. The pioneers of our sport must have been much less persnickety than us modern-day types!

    Guy Babin
     
  2. Chase

    Chase TS Member

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    Birds are definitely more challenging. Trap, skeet and sporting don't really have much to do with shooting birds.
     
  3. Big Al 29

    Big Al 29 TS Member

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    uuuuhhhhh...... Live.

    Pigeons are where the real money it. But you have to have it to even get into it. I know guys that are recruited and all the fees and options for the event is paid because they can't win themselves. Shooter gets a cut of the winnings too.

    They rake them up and chuck them from what I have heard.
     
  4. dmarbell

    dmarbell Active Member

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    Guy,

    If you want to see what live bird shooting was like, as closely as possible with mechanical devices, find and shoot some ZZ Birds (Helice). They are released at random from "traps," and can go in pretty much any direction except back toward the shooter. With a little wind, they can even zig and zag a bit, and change direction.

    Danny
     
  5. gdbabin

    gdbabin TS Member

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    I've hunted upland game and ducks, so I know what that's like. Releasing a bird from a box, especially if you can see the box seems much less difficult than shooting wild birds in natural habitat.

    Guy
     
  6. jnoemanh

    jnoemanh TS Member

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    Live pigeons are much harder than any clay game. Not only do they fly in random ways, but you also have to kill them before they can get out of the ring. A hit with a few pellets which results in a "dead" clay would leave a pigeon able to fly some distance and be "lost".

    I've attended several pigeon shoots (observed, didn't shoot; it's way out of my league) and of a few hundred shooters, I've seen only one 50X50 - Wayne Mayes.

    Pigeon shoots are perfectly legal many places, but they are not publicized and they're by invitation only. The SPCA and PETA people would go nuts over 50 gallon drums of dead birds, and cripples sitting around, falling out of trees. Ask around at your gun club and you might find a pigeon shoot and invitation in your area. It's spectacular to watch...and even to shoot if you're very, very good.

    The only more difficult shotgunning is supposed to be shooting hand thrown birds - I think it's called Columbaire. A skilfull thrower can get some birds past almost any shooter. AFAIK, it's not done in tha USA, but is popular in Europe.
     
  7. Chase

    Chase TS Member

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    If that were truly the case Guy, you should pony up the $3-400 entry fee (that's not including any options) and you would be sure you will win the day's events.

    It just isn't as easy as shooting ducks or quail or doves. There is nothing like it.
     
  8. gdbabin

    gdbabin TS Member

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    I will have to try it--I'm sure I'd be humbled. So modern pigeon shoots are very similar to the first Trap shoots?

    Guy
     
  9. bigben

    bigben Active Member

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    Guy, I'm quite sure you will be pleasantly surprised, standing 32 yds away from the ring, 11 to 13 boxes in a row inside the ring, any one of from a which a computer controlled box is opened, then nail the bird dead before it gets out of the ring, it may even fall stone dead 1 in.outside the the ring, LOST! try it, all the best, incinerate em!
     
  10. waverider

    waverider Well-Known Member

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    Pigeon Shooting was the first trap shooting.

    That is why the trap is called a trap. The first traps were boxes with trap doors. A cord was attached to the door. That is why we call pull, the trapper would pull the cord to release the pigeon.

    Jason
     
  11. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    Live birds without question! Toughest shooting I've ever experienced was jump shooting ruffed grouse without the aid of a dog in the eastern coverts. Now, success on that kind of shooting is measured in how many shells you shot for harvesting a single bird. Hap
     
  12. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    Don't ever complain about trap shooting being expensive, if you can afford to go to live Bird shoot. Frankly, I think it's disgusting.
     
  13. tcr1146

    tcr1146 Well-Known Member

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    I find it interesting that both "guys" that object to this inhumane activity have ties to skeet?! Tom Rhoads
     
  14. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    Filthy is an understatement for barnyard pigeons! City dwellers too! Hap
     
  15. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Rats with wings and serve the same purpose!!
     
  16. darr

    darr Well-Known Member

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    I have been to a couple of low dollar shoots in Mexico being that I live 15 miles away.It was fun and different but the bigger shoots are very expensive.If you are good and want to make a living shooting shotguns it is really the only way to do it.All you need is a bankroll to get started.Just the birds alone will cost you between 3.00 nad 6.00 a piece.25 bird race usually 100.00 just for birds.

    Darr Wilson
     
  17. Don Steele

    Don Steele Well-Known Member

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    If money were NO OBJECT...I'd shoot flyers exclusively.
    As to difficulty...I've participated in large flyer shoots(200 shooters)where "big dogs" from every clay sport were there. Shooters from 7 countries participated,including Olympic shooters. There was something like $150,000 on the line (including the "special event") The Main race of 25 birds was won by two shooters who tied with 23 each.
    VERY challenging....As far as commentaries on it's sporting nature..those pigeons have a hell of a lot better chance than pen raised Quail shot over dogs on the high dollar "hunting plantations" so many folks enjoy without controversy.
     
  18. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

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    tcr1146:

    Don't get confused by the "shot410ga" I once broke 25 from the 16 with a "410." Ergo: the name. I have shot skeet about 10 times in 30 years of shooting. I am also a 27 yard, AA trap shooter. And I still think live bird shooting is for the "MIke Vicks" amoung us.
     
  19. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    shot410ga, I also suppose you never shot rats at the town dump with a .22 when you were a kid. If not, you'll never understand-"no difference"!!
     
  20. rumplestilskin

    rumplestilskin TS Member

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    Labor Day Pigeon Shoot is a good shoot to try shooting pigeons. It's a 3 day event held at the Valley View Gun Club in Pa. over the Labor Day Weekend. It is about 4 miles from the famous Fred Coleman Labor Day Pigeon Shoot held in Hegins Pa. They shoot a 25 bird double barrel and a 20 bird single barrel shoot all 3 days and it costs about $300 to shoot an event for one day.
     
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