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K80 bending 20 ga tube extractor - ideas?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Baron23, Sep 11, 2011.

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  1. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    Hi folks - while I will again contact Briley and also Krieghoff in Ottsville tomorrow, but I was wondering if any of you have experienced this problem or may have any insights to offer.

    Short of it is that my K80 is bending the extractor on my Briley top 20 ga tube with some regularity. It bends inward toward the bore.

    Longer story, I have had Berettas, Kolars, and K80s with tubes for a very long time and have never bent an extractor on a tube at all, ever. This barrel has been on this gun with these Briley ultralights for over four years without problems. Last April or so I noticed shells seeming to stick just a bit in the top tube...pulled the tube and the extractor was hard to move in its cut out. No dirt, no detritus, no terribly obvious bending but bent. Sent it back to Briley and they replaced the extractor (under warrant, they have been very good about this).

    About two months later I'm shooting some practice and getting sticking shells and then when I go to close the gun the extractor stuck and bent all to hell against the breach face. Barrel and tube back to Briley again. This time they replace the chamber. Briley has been generally slow this summer and my job was no exception....took at least 5 weeks, I think more like six weeks, in the middle of the season to get it back to me.

    This fix lasted about 5 weeks. Last week I had just a little sticking in the top tube and this weekend I notice as we went out to practice that the extractor is bent again.....exactly as before, about 5/8's from the breach end, bent inward toward the bore.

    And no, I don't hit it with the hammer when putting them in.

    I would expect, if anything, for the lower tube extractor to take the brunt of any force in closing the gun. All clearances look ok to our experienced, but not gunsmith, eyes. I have even released the top latch with the gun open to see if the extractor would catch in this situation, but it does not appear to do so and this would not really explain why it always bends toward the bore (i.e. inward).

    Any ideas?.

    Best Regards,
    Stephen
     
  2. sts1100

    sts1100 Member

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    Stephen,


    Try Aligning the leading edge of the tube extractor with the barrel extractor, I also close the barels to recock the ejectors before inserting a shell in the chamber. A habit I developed when I was shooting 3200s. I also keep my tube extractors lubed with a teflon oil.

    I went through a similiar problem with my 3200.

    Dave
     
  3. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    HI Dave - I almost always reset my ejectors prior to loading and I have for over a decade aligned the end of the extractor with the edge of the guns ejector as you suggested. After bending the first one, I asked Briley and they said center the extractor in the ejector...well, that didn't work out either.

    The telfon oil is a new one with me.

    What was the root issue with your 3200??
     
  4. sts1100

    sts1100 Member

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    With my 3200 the problem was with only with my 20ga tubes, I was loading green dot and cracking chambers on an annual basis. I switched powder and on my last set of tubes I put some polishing compound on the extractors and worked them by hand until they moved smoothly and with little resistance. Briley told me to center the extractor on the ejector which didn't work, Briley was good about sending me new extractors so I didn't have to send my tubes in.

    I have not had a problem with my K80 in the 20 years I have been shooting it, and I align the leading edge of the extractor with the barrel ejector.
     
  5. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    For the sake of arguement, is there any slack in the tube extractor with the barrel extractor fully extended? I know that Briley makes tubes for short and long travel extractors and it sounds as if you have a short travel extractor tube with a long travel extractor barrel (pardon my ignorance if a Krieghoff barrel is short travel). Thus causing a lot of pressure on the extractor when opened.

    Just food for thought and nothing else.

    ss
     
  6. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    Hi SS - Yes, there is a little slack and the barrel has been back to Briley with the tube twice. It is the very same type of extractor that has been on the gun for a very long time. I appreciat the input and help, but I think I'm still looking.

    Briley has been good about this, but I think I need to engage Ottsville. This is just too puzzling (beside extremely annoying).

    Cheers

    Stephen
     
  7. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    That's good. Sometimes the obvious is most overlooked.

    ss
     
  8. TRW369

    TRW369 TS Member

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    I actualy had this happen to me on several occasions over the past few years with Briley Tube extractors. There is no way possible to bend this back without pardon the expression, screwing up the extractor even more. Just send it back to Briley and have them send you another one. When I ordered the new extractor I actually had them send me an extra one just in case and I did have to use the extra one prior to selling my set. When you extract an empty shell just close the gun again and reseat the extractors in order for them not to bend again.

    TRW369
     
  9. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    Hi TRW - I do already set the ejectors prior to loading.

    You are right, once bent they are hosed. There is no recovering it.

    I'm just concerned that this is three in one season and never one in about 15 years of clays shooting.

    Guess its call Don Baughman at Ottsville and Briley tomorrow. Three in one season is not acceptable.

    Thanks for taking the time to reply.
     
  10. DB Bill

    DB Bill Active Member

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    And the answer is ----- KOLAR!
     
  11. kfbagt

    kfbagt Member

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    The only thing left to consider would be the timing ofthe ejector. If it's extending fully before the gun is fully open it could cause this problem I would think. Just a thought.

    Paul
     
  12. high 2

    high 2 Member

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    Have you checked the the ejector(extrator) on the 12ga barrel? Mkae sure it fairly snug in its` groove. It might be best to remove it and make sure it looks good. Is this an older K80? Been shot a bunch? I`ve work on a lot of Krieghoffs over the years and as stated above, sometimes it`s so obvious you over look the real problem. Larry
     
  13. sts1100

    sts1100 Member

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    I just checked my K 80 and if the leading edge of the tube extractor is aligned with the leading edge of the barrel ejector the tube ejector would be orientated from 7 to 2 on a clock face and not possible to be bent into the chamber area.

    I have had tubesets daing back to Skeetmaster then on to Briley and Kolar before they offer screw in chokes. I have had customer service interaction with all and Briley was unquestionably the best in resolving issues.
     
  14. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    The ejector timing seems fine, the two of them are timed together and the ejector on the gun is also in very good shape. This gun has not been fired that much.

    Thanks for the input, still searching for an answer.
     
  15. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

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    Is the extractor lined up just right to catch on the edge of the firing pin hole when you close the gun?
     
  16. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Could be a lot of things but normally it is a problem with the ejector fit- once bent- it is done for

    Usually one bends it when it doesnt get pushed back in before you shut the gun

    Sometimes it deforms the groove of that that tube also- impossible to see the small bend with your eye but it is there- causing play

    Regards with the barrel to Briley

    Gene
     
  17. mrskeet410

    mrskeet410 TS Member

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    I've seen what Skeet_man describes. Resetting the extractors may make it harder on the tube extractor than catching it with a shell in the tube. On 3200 the owner bent a tube extractor or two but can't say for sure whether it was the top or bottom. On 68x is was the bottom extractor that was catching on the firing pin hole. Briley recognized the problem as soon as it was described to him.

    On the Beretta, the firing pin hole or the tube extractor wore smooth enough through use that the problem shortly went away.
     
  18. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    Ian - I will look at this, but I have been shooting this barrel and gun for at least four years without problems, now its three extractors in a season. We did look at the breach face insert within which is the firing pin hole and it seems very smooth and level with the breach face. My friend and I fitted a spare extractor that he had to the tube to get me through a tournament this coming weekend. In carefully looking durin closure and opening, we did not notice any hanging up on the firing pin holes, but we will look again.

    Gene - last time (second extractor bent), they replaced the entire chamber on the top tube. This should eliminate any issues of wear in the ejector cutout. We agree that once bent, an ejector is hosed. My issue is why the heck am I bending the ejector on this one tube out of a set.

    I did talk to Briley this morning and they are a bit baffled. They will gladly see to the issue, but want the entire gun next time I send it in.

    I also talked to Ottsville, and Don was not aware of any smoking gun issues that would express themselves in chronic bent ejectors on one tube.

    Spoke with Ernest Marlette and he recommended that I pull the gun extractor and make sure there isn't any dirt, etc inhibiting it setting on closure. Good idea although I have not noticed any increase in force needed to close the gun. He also suggested I look for burrs or roughness on the outward face of the gun ejector where it meets the receiver and, if rough, take a flat diamond hone to it (might leave that to others who are more confident in their use of tools).

    Thanks everybody for their input
     
  19. mrskeet410

    mrskeet410 TS Member

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    Are they bending when you are resetting the ejectors or when closing after dropping loaded shells in the tube chambers?
     
  20. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    Hard to tell....they get a little tight (open gun and notice that upper shell is not coming out cleanly) and if you pull the tube you will see that it has a bend to to the legs of the extractor.

    If you leave it in the gun and shoot it, eventually it will not retract on closing and you will crush the extractor...but the problem started before that.
     
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