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JOB CREATORS

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by trap72, Oct 18, 2012.

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  1. trap72

    trap72 Member

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    I ALWAYS HEAR REPUBLICANS IN CONGRESS SAY "Lowering taxes on the job creators creates jobs." In my 76 years, federal taxes are at a an all time low. So, where are all the jobs? In China and any place U.S. companies can get slave labor.
     
  2. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    Oh, Oh-no!
     
  3. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

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    Common sense says that the import/export tax is supposed equal the playing field when it comes to differences in wages paid, operating costs, etc. etc. between countries.............Special interest groups and Lobbyist have worked against our interest and worked in favor of foreign countries. This is one of the major problems that is hindering our workforce development in my opinion.

    Another problem is foreign ownership of more and more companies here in the US. We get the wages but the profits are taken back or the company is closed and moved to a country with lower operating costs to be shipped back here with little or no import tax paid.
     
  4. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    The average tax rate percentage paid in 2006 was about the same as paid in 1956, just over 5% for the medium family income. Click on the link I have provided and look at the center columns representing medium incomes.

    Where we are different from other countries is our corporate tax rate in the US is 35%. Canada just to the North is 15%

    We have more different types of taxes and hundreds of thousands of more regulations in the last 50 years, which make it difficult for business. Remember in 1956, we did not have so many business regulating government agencies. Their people must justify their jobs, by writing reams and reams of regulations. The fees, fines, assessments and compliance costs created by the regulations are a stealth tax that is not seen on the tax forms filed.

    Many businessess are relucant to hire or expand, because they do not know what the future brings, especially in regards to Affordable HealthCare.

    China is able to draw as much business as they do, because they keep the value of their currency depressed to keep prices of their products low.
     
  5. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    What where the tax rates during the Clinton years as President?

    What was the economy like during the Clinton years?

    Where people in general, happy with the direction of the country?
     
  6. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    Yes, the Clinton years when Republicans controlled the House and Senate and forced cuts in spending.


    Also during Clinton's time an industry fueled our economy IN SPITE of Clinton's terms and that was the home computer and dot com business that created more wealth in this country than another product or service likened to the train, plane and automobile industries.

    More people and businesses could afford computers, which made great changes in our lives, including the unemployment of many whose skills and trades were no longer needed, something that is really coming home to bare in this time period.

    If the home computer business had not happened when it did, the Clinton years would have just been another ho-hum 8 years.

    If you look at the tables I provided, the medium tax rates in the 90's were about the same as during the Reagan period.
     
  7. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    Oh and Clinton's time was also the seeding of the housing market collapse when Janet Reno threatened lending institutions with court action, if they did not offer home loans to people who could not otherwise afford them.
     
  8. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    What happened when Bush became President, and still had control of the Congress, and Senate for his first six years?
     
  9. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    September 11, 2001


    Fear and terror and of course the collapse of the housing market which took root under Clinton.

    Look, both parties are to blame.

    It's real simple, you want growth, unmuzzle businesses. Government Trickle Down does not work.

    If we want 100% percent protection, cradle to grave, be prepared to pay the cost to the government for that service, and it will not be cheap.......of course if you are lucky enough to make it to the cradle in the first place. Since the SCOTUS decision, that has been made more difficult.
     
  10. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    So you think that those loans where the reason for the collapse? Do you know what the percentage of those loans where, to the over all total of the financial obligation of those "Bad" loans? So you do not think that the housing bubble collapse had nothing to do with the average people's overindulgence of borrowing against their houses value increasing? The fact that greed from the lending institutions handing out money based on 120% value of their houses, had nothing to do with the collapse of the housing market, and the economy for that matter? How early before the demise of the housing market, had Greenspan been warning about this? How many times was it stated that the economy was based on these loans, and the overspending, would eventually lead to a collapse of the economy, when the housing bubble burst?

    You can't blame just the others political policies for the collapse. It just doesn't add up!

    How can you say that the housing collapse started under Clinton? The housing "bubble" did not start increasing at an unsustainable rate until Bush was in office.
     
  11. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    Okay Stl. It is all Bush's fault.

    Nobody else had anything to do with it.


    Am so happy we are now in the clear and the economy has been chugging along at great speed since Obama has been put in office and I am looking forward to his next 4 years in office.

    Hell, lets outlaw private lending institutions, since they have the ability to force people to get loans they cannot afford.

    Since high taxes equal prosperous times, lets raise the income tax to 95% on all payroll and business incomes, better yet, send it all to Washington and let the bureaucrats decide who gets what for their labors and a good time can be had by all.

    Happy now?
     
  12. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    I said it is everybody's fault, that lived beyond their means. Who caused them to do this is up to you to decide. I know nobody was forced to do this. The problem is, they all where allowed to do it! The reasoning was, that was the reason for the economy increasing, or staying afloat. The fact is individuals, along with Government, where enjoying the good times, caused by borrowed money, they couldn't pay back.
     
  13. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    Isn't that what I said in the end?

    No matter, I give up.

    Instead of offering solutions to the mess, I will just join in the chorus and sing "it's all George Bush's fault,"

    You will have to excuse me now, I just found out in spite of my circumstance, I may be eligible for food stamps

    I am headed down to the Welfare office now.
     
  14. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    Excellent! Have a steak on me, or yourself, for that matter! LOL. Get some of that money back.
     
  15. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

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    trap72, I'm a small business owner (Constuction). We currently have 4 projects ready to go, but the clients are waiting for the election. They want to know what their long term tax situation is going to be, how National Health Care will affect their business cost, and what other "surprises" this administration may have in mind.

    In short, they don't trust him, and neither do I.

    What has this administration done to help small business grow and hire more people? We don't hire people for the hell of it.

    Instead, they spent 2 years getting Obamacare passed when we don't have the money to fund it anyway....especially during a recession!
     
  16. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    Unemployment figures : just the facts, no cooked books ...

    What they do not tell you :

    Isn't it amazing that the Labor Dept put out an unemployment number of 7.8 percent on Oct 5, 2012 just a month away from the election ..? What they didn't tell you is people that are underemployed and unemployed (23.2 million) is 14.7 perecnt ... Tell me that the main stream media are not biased ... As you saw in the Presidential debate, Mitt Romney had answers and solutions and Obama did not ...

    The main stream media is not held accountable for the BS they print and distribute to the American people and thats how they misled into thinking one thing when its not close to being the truth ...

    I got this out of the Sun City Independent newspaper, Oct 17,2012 issue ...


    Obama created 4.5 million jobs, problem is none of them are in the United States and the economy contiues to get even worst ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  17. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    If the whole plan from the start was on schedule, I think things may be different today. Problem is the fragile economy hindered those plans, and progress to meet each step of the plan. If momentum of the recession could have been turned around faster, and not reached so deep, things would be allot different. Who is to blame, will always be two sided. How often is a Presidents plan carried out, let alone on schedule.
     
  18. R.Kipling

    R.Kipling Well-Known Member

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    I know that this is going to be very difficult for some of you to comprehend, but I'll try again.

    Corporations don't 'pay' taxes. Every expense, and I do mean EVERY expense is calculated into the cost-of-goods-sold. All taxes, tariff's, government fees, surcharges - whatever- are paid by the consumer.

    Raise taxes on business, and it gets passed through in price hikes. The only variable is 'when' it gets passed through. Of course, if there are no profits....businesses still pay taxes. That's when people loose their jobs, and business go offshore, or close up.

    Tax laws most definitely need to change, but not in the manner many of you think. Personally, I'm very much in favor of an excess tax on any business owner/executive that takes or accepts disproportionate salary and benefits. But most businesses are not in that category, and the revenue from such a tax would be small.

    This situation is not just an 'R' phenomena. Take a look at what Obummer's failed Green Industry exec's took from our money and you'll see huge salaries and monster DNC contributions.

    It's a complicated issue, only because many of our pet premises are wrong. I believe that one way of 'fixing' it is this: make all Corps Sub-S, all profits pass thru to the owners and are taxes at the personal level. With a no-holes graduated personal tax there would be more incentive to keep productive employees and maybe even train the slow one's.? Peter Drucker suggested this 30 years ago. I believe that he was a man before his time.

    Get the government out of the business of picking winners and loosers, and let the market place finally have a read say.

    Kip
     
  19. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    Kip

    Just like product lawsuits as well.

    Award someone hundreds of millions of dollars and the cost of that award get added to the price of the product from that day forward.
     
  20. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    Kip,

    I agree with everything you said except, "This situation is not just an 'R' phenomena. Take a look at what Obummer's failed Green Industry exec's took from our money and you'll see huge salaries and monster DNC contributions."

    The thing I see in your post though that I think needs to be looked at is this. How much money was paid out to executives of the failed institutions in bonuses and salary, that was YOUR money in the form of bailouts. Investment firms, including Goldman Sachs, and most of all, AIG, who insured those investment firms and banks, that paid out YOUR tax dollars to these firms, which paid out many times more money by far, to their failed executives, then what was lost in those "Green" companies. Why only focus on those tax dollars. Keep the references in perspective.
     
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