1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

Is using the "correct" wad really that important

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by gspointer, Jul 10, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. gspointer

    gspointer TS Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2010
    Messages:
    40
    Is it really important to go by the book. Say i have some 1 1/8 oz windjammers leftover and start loading a 1 1/8oz recipe that calls for versalites can i finish off my windjammers?
     
  2. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,417
    Is using the

    I do it all the time. If the wad fits and the crimp depth looks good I'm happy. HMB
     
  3. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    Is using the

    I will only use a wad that is specifically designed for the hull I am loading. I realize that some Chevrolet parts will fit in a Ford, but not in my Ford. I guess I have grown fussy with age.

    Pat Ireland
     
  4. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,594
    Is using the

    Ditto Pat BUT I load light enough that I could fudge way more than I do. I did, once, use a Ford distributor on a 1924 Hudson Super 6 and that enabled some fun driving around town.....breakemall.....Bob Dodd
     
  5. gspointer

    gspointer TS Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2010
    Messages:
    40
    Is using the

    Thanks for some of your reloading wisdom guys, Im just getting started and have learned alot from you all.
     
  6. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    10,521
    Location:
    Idaho
    Is using the

    Been doing it for 40+ years
     
  7. Dave P

    Dave P TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,512
    Location:
    Canton, Il.
    Is using the

    Watch the barrel pressures just as with primers and powders.
     
  8. wayneo

    wayneo Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,002
    Is using the

    I started using a 1 ounce AA wad in a FGM hull for 1-1/8 ounce load years ago. It loads great, soft shooting, and its in Alliant and Hodgdons reloading manuals.

    Wayne
     
  9. Recoil Sissy

    Recoil Sissy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,641
    Is using the

    gspointer:

    It only matters if you're interested in safe and effective loads.

    It should go without saying but there's a reason why Powder companies and other component manufacturers publish TESTED data and warnings AGAINST component substitutions. If it didn't matter, they'd simply write, "It's ok to stuff your hulls with any horsesh!t combination of components you have on hand".

    Since your question is limited to wads, let's just say I'll randomly substitute wads when ballisticians at reputable firms like Alliant and Hodgdon say, "If the wad fits and the crimp depth looks good I'm happy."

    For the dopes who load and shoot untested home brewed recipes - against the advice and warnings of industry experts - have the decency to let the rest of us know what you're doing. Some of us don't want to stand next to you on the line.

    sissy
     
  10. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,538
    Location:
    Oxford MA
    Is using the

    gsp I am going out on a limb here and make two statements.

    1/ I agree with sissy if the manufacturers felt it didn't matter they would have given you a statement in the book that any wad will do.

    2/ If you don't know anyone on this board and you are engaging in a past time that has an element of danger by the nature that you are using an explosive. Why would you take anyones advice over the books advice?????

    Bob Lawless
     
  11. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2007
    Messages:
    810
    Is using the

    +1 for sissy's comments. Yes, some folks have swapped components in and out, some even for years and gotten away with it. On the other hand, the manufacturers test and publish certain loading data for a reason. Those loads have been tested and only loads within safe specs are published. Substituting a different primer, wad, or even hull can cause a significant change in pressure, and sometimes put that pressure over safe limits. And unless you hav pressure testing equipment, you really do not have any way to know what the change will do to that particular load. Every year, there are several gun blow ups, and almost invariably they involve reloads. Were some of them caused by component substitution. Maybe, maybe not. But those who do substitute their own recipes for the manufacturers, please let the rest of us know you are on the line, so we can move elsewhere.

    Jim R
     
  12. goatskin

    goatskin TS Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,781
    Is using the

    <blockquote> gsp: <i>"Is it really important to go by the book. Say i have some 1 1/8 oz windjammers leftover and start loading a 1 1/8oz recipe that calls for versalites can i finish off my windjammers? "</i></blockquote>

    With a few caveats, yes, it's OK. That's part of learning the reloading part of shooting.

    The main caveat is to don't ask for pressure problems: stay in the low or middle of your 3-4-5 loading recipe options is always a good place to start ANY reloading.

    Then, make sure the wads are ballistically similar and are designed for the same load. If it is a 1-1/8 wad for tapered hulls (IOW: remchester clone, including windjammer), sure, use all those broken bags for 'Practice Bullets'.

    Using Federal-type (or Italian wads) wads in Remington hulls without a SPECIFIC recipe is not a great idea.

    Switching primers willy-nilly will get you in more deep shit - and faster, too - than swapping one Remchester wad for another Remchester wad.


    Bob
     
  13. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,457
    Location:
    SE PA
    Is using the

    The powders we use to reload are propellants, not explosives. There is a HUGE difference between the two.

    That being said, if I don't have a written recipe from the powder manufacturer, or Lyman's manuals, etc., I am not going to substitute a wad. I consider myself to know just enough to be considered dangerous, so I'll not push my luck.

    If I found I had a stash of unused Windjammers, I'd find a suitable published recipe and have at it.
     
  14. bridgetoofar

    bridgetoofar TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    971
    Is using the

    There's a reason why many many people urge reloaders to stick with published recipes. Changing wads can change chamber pressure by 1000psi. While that might be OK based on what your original load was, it might not be. Assuming that your replacement wads are OK, what's next. Are you also going to use up those "other" primers you might have? That could be another 1000psi. Another assumption that too many reloaders fall prey to is powder weights. Powder bushings are often off by a 1/2 grain, sometimes more. That "could be" another pressure difference. Combine all of these sloppy reloading procedures and you could be in for a big surprise, and for what, just to use up $10 worth of wads?

    That said, go ahead and experiment with unpublished loads if you wish, but before you shoot them, send them off to be tested by Tom Armbrust at Ballistic Research. The cost is $5 a shell. Sending 5 shells will tell you your speed, pressure and deviations.
     
  15. dhip

    dhip Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,473
    Location:
    westgrove,Pa.
    Is using the

    Well,here I am again,new to sport and to reloading,when I had a combo that wasn't listed,I called Alliant and mentioned what I was using,and was told,no problem,in fact was told it would be a nice load.Another time I emailed them and got a similiar response. Also was told they QUOTE: " don't have the avenues or resources to publish all deviants,primers,wads,etc."But they will give you an answer and don't mind telling you if what you load is safe. Of course I tend to load soft anyways,and was told by experienced loaders that "usually" if your on the soft end and not at the "limit" of the reccommended charge you are safe.

    Doug H.
     
  16. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    4,771
    Location:
    Rapid City SD
    Is using the

    For straight-walled cases, such as Federals, Gun Clubs, etc, use the wad made for these kinds of hulls - their diameters are approximately 0.718".

    For a tapered-walled case, such as AA, STS, Nitro, etc. use the smaller diameter wad cup wads. These measure around 0.702" in diameter.

    So...... if you elect to use the smaller diameter wad-cups in a straight walled case, then you will definitely get blow-by, and you have severely hindered the fps of the load.

    You can do what you wish, but the above is the proper way to do it.

    Then, of course, you must use the appropriate wad for the ounces or lead.

    WW
     
  17. superxjeff

    superxjeff Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,781
    Is using the

    Look.... My approach to this topic comes from another angle. Why even screw with lots of components that will not produce the amount of ammo you desire in the first place?



    The simple fact of the matter is that you have made a post on this site tells me that you have access to the internet. Every powder manufacturer has a web site with tons of loading data on it. If you are unsure you can always wait until you can find some data.

    Sooner or later you will pick a load and buy only the components that you need, The issue of using up odds and ends is a short one! You only have so much extra MISC wads, primers, 1/2 pound lots of powder ETC ETC. Sooner or later they will all be gone.


    Make it easy for yourself. take all the odd lots stuff and just get rid of it instead of trying to be a frugal Phil. It is well worth your time NOT to screw with it. My opinion. Jeff

    .
     
  18. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    Is using the

    Many posters have cautioned against using a load that is not published in a quality reloading manual. That is wise advice. But it is also important to recognize that reloading manuals publish safe loads and safe loads are not always good loads. As Whiz pointed out, it is safe to use a tapered hull in a straight walled case, but it is not good to do that. I am interested in reloading safe loads that are also good.

    Pat Ireland
     
  19. Unknown1

    Unknown1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2009
    Messages:
    3,396
    Is using the

    From WW...

    <blockquote><I>"For straight-walled cases, such as Federals, Gun Clubs, etc, use the wad made for these kinds of hulls - their diameters are approximately 0.718.

    For a tapered-walled case, such as AA, STS, Nitro, etc. use the smaller diameter wad cup wads. These measure around 0.702" in diameter."</i></blockquote>

    Remington's "Gun Club" hulls are not straight-walled; they're tapered just like the "STS/Nitro 27" hulls.

    Federal's "Top Gun" are straight walled hulls.

    MK
     
  20. dhip

    dhip Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,473
    Location:
    westgrove,Pa.
    Is using the

    After reading another post,and following some reccomendations to a site that compared remington hulls,It seems that different wads do make a difference. I reload gun clubs,using tgt12 wads,same as nitro's I believe,i use a good shot,West Coast,and a decent powder ,greenDot,seems I have the insides of a nitro in a Gun club hull,except I use a ceddite primer,maybe that's why my reloads smoke the targets just a tad better than original gun clubs.But,that could just be mind tricks of a reloader....LMAO

    Doug H.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.