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IRS HEARING TODAY

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by jimsw, May 17, 2013.

  1. jimsw

    jimsw Member

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    The "testimony" of the "former" IRS head was really appaling. What those guys did to ordinary citizens is beyond belief. If you ever wondered what living in Soviet Russia under Stalin or Nazi Germany under Hitler was like it was all there on the tv.

    Jim White
     
  2. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

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    and the republicrats will do nothing but bluster, as usual.
     
  3. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    and the Democrats will circle the wagon just like during slick willies impeachment.

    Will wonders never cease.
     
  4. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

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    Does anyone know why any of these political groups, Democratic or Republican should be tax free?
     
  5. beeper

    beeper Member

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    Traders - the answer to your question is- Ask the Supreme Court!

    beeper
     
  6. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

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    beeper,

    How would you suggest I do that? Just send an email to Justice Roberts.
     
  7. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

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    This might provide answers your questions about tax exempt organizations:

    http://tinyurl.com/a4arhlq
     
  8. jimsw

    jimsw Member

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    Many of the gun clubs we belong to are not for profit organizations, same as these "political" organizations.

    Nice if your gun club was targeted as a right wing gun loving organization and the club had to divulge the member list and the members political affiliation. How about that? It happened to some of these organizations.

    Jim White
     
  9. Bisi

    Bisi TS Member

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    You ever wonder how in the hell we got this far off? 503c3, 1040,1099,941,940,ss4,401k,.....................65 to 70 thousand pages of regulations and hoops to jump through.

    Do you think Washington, Adams, Franklin, Jefferson, Payne, Madison, etal had this envisioned???? We'll start a revolution and put EVERYTHING on the line for this?

    Would the Minuteman be a 503c organization or some other?

    Would George Washington submit to filing a written report every April 15, of every grain of wheat, corn, bottle of whiskey that Mount Vernon produced in the prior year?

    Why do we need this monstrosity called the tax code. Change it. Anything would be better than what we have now. The Fair Tax, The Flat Tax, Herman Cain's 9-9-9 all would be far superior! Now is the time!
     
  10. 548

    548 Guest

    The below text is a copy of the letter sent by a coalition of United States Senators in it's entirety:


    Printer-friendly Version

    FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: March 12, 2012

    SENATE DEMOCRATS URGE IRS TO IMPOSE STRICT CAP ON POLITICAL SPENDING BY NONPROFIT GROUPS—VOW LEGISLATION IF AGENCY DOESN’T ACT



    Senators Seek To End Tax Code Abuse By Political Groups Masquerading As ‘Social Welfare Organizations’

    In Letter to IRS, Lawmakers Say Firm Limit Should Be Set on Percentage of Nonprofits’ Spending That Can Be Devoted To Political Activities

    Reforms Also Urged To Prevent Political Donors From Claiming Tax Deduction For Their Contributions




    WASHINGTON, D.C. – A group of seven Senate Democrats urged the Internal Revenue Service on Monday to impose a strict cap on the amount of political spending by tax-exempt, nonprofit groups.



    The senators said the lack of clarity in the IRS rules has allowed political groups to improperly claim 501(c)4 status and may even be allowing donors to these groups to wrongly claim tax deductions for their contributions. The senators promised legislation if the IRS failed to act to fix these problems.



    “We urge the IRS to take these steps immediately to prevent abuse of the tax code by political groups focused on federal election activities. But if the IRS is unable to issue administrative guidance in this area then we plan to introduce legislation to accomplish these important changes,” the senators wrote.



    The letter was signed by Senators Charles E. Schumer, Michael Bennet, Sheldon Whitehouse, Jeff Merkley, Tom Udall, Jeanne Shaheen and Al Franken. It follows an earlier letter, sent to the IRS by the same of group of senators last month, that also urged the IRS to better enforce rules pertaining to 501(c)4 organizations.



    Federal law defines 501(c)4 groups as groups engaged exclusively in “social welfare” activities. The IRS, however, has allowed these 501(c)4 groups to venture into political activities as long as civic and charitable work remains their “primary purpose.” This loophole has caused a number of organizations heavily engaged in political work to organize themselves as 501(c)4 groups in order to gain tax-exempt status and shield their donors from the disclosure requirements that apply to more traditional political organizations.



    The senators said the IRS should close this loophole by imposing a strict, percentage-based cap on the amount of a nonprofit group’s spending that can go towards political activities. Legal experts have proposed a cutoff of 49 percent to ensure that political activities never command more than half of a group’s total spending. But the senators said even this threshold would be too high and would permit more political work than any nonprofit group should be able to perform.



    The senators also said that 501(c)4 groups should have to disclose upfront—on all written and online solicitations that get sent to potential donors—how much of their activities are political. The senators said this would make it clear to potential donors how much of a tax deduction, if any, they could claim on their tax returns. Currently, no such information is required to be disclosed and tax experts have expressed concern that many corporations contributing funds to these political groups may be counting those donations as a business expenses eligible for a full tax deduction.



    A copy of the senators’ letter to IRS Commissioner Douglas H. Shulman appears below.



    Hon. Douglas H. Shulman

    Commissioner

    Internal Revenue Service

    Room 3000 IR

    1111 Constitution Avenue, N.W.



    Dear Commissioner Shulman:



    We write to ask the Internal Revenue Service (“IRS”) to immediately change the administrative framework for enforcement of the tax code as it applies to groups designated as “social welfare” organizations. These groups receive tax and other advantages under section 501(c)(4) of the Internal Revenue Code (hereinafter, “IRC” or the “Code”), but some of them also are engaged in a substantial amount of political campaign activity. As you know, we sent a letter last month expressing concerns about the 501(c)(4) issue; an investigation this week by the New York Times has uncovered new, specific problems on how c)4)s conduct business. We wanted to address those new concerns in this letter.



    IRS regulations have long maintained that political campaign activity by a 501(c)(4) entity must not be the “primary purpose” of the organization. These regulations are intended to implement the statute, which requires that such organizations be operated exclusively for the public welfare. But we think the existing IRS regulations run afoul of the law since they only require social welfare activities to be the 'primary purpose' of a nonprofit when the Code says this must be its 'exclusive' purpose. In recent years, this daylight between the law and the IRS regulations has been exploited by groups devoted chiefly to political election activities who operate behind a facade of charity work.



    A related concern, raised in a March 7th New York Times article, concerns whether certain nonprofits may be soliciting corporate contributions that are then treated by the company as a business expense eligible for a tax deduction. The Times wrote: “Under current law, there is little to no way to tell whether contributions are being deducted, especially because many of the most political companies are privately held.” This potential abuse distorts the objectives of vital revenue mechanisms and undermines the faith that we ask citizens to place in their electoral system.



    We propose that the IRS make three administrative changes to curtail these questionable practices and bring IRS tax regulations back into alignment with the letter and spirit intended by those who crafted the Code:



    · First, we urge the IRS to adopt a bright line test in applying its “primary purpose” regulation that is consistent with the Code’s 501(c)(4) exclusivity language. The IRS currently only requires that the purpose of these non-profits be “primarily” related to social welfare activities, without defining what “primarily” means. This standard should be spelled out more fully by the IRS. Some have suggested 51 percent as an appropriate threshold for establishing that a nonprofit is adhering to its mission, but even this number would seem to allow for more political election activity than should be permitted under the law. In the absence of clarity in the administration of section 501(c)(4), organizations are tempted to abuse its vagueness, or worse, to organize under section 501(c)(4) so that they may avail themselves of its advantages even though they are not legitimate social welfare organizations. If the IRS does not adopt a bright line test, or if it adopts one that is inconsistent with the Code’s exclusivity language, then we plan to pursue legislation codifying such a test.



    · Second, such organizations should be further obligated to document in their 990 IRS form the exact percentage of their undertakings dedicated to “social welfare.” Organizations should be required to “show their math” to demonstrate that political election activities and other statutorily limited or prohibited activities do not violate the “primary purpose” regulation.



    · Third, 501(c)(4) organizations should be required to state forthrightly to potential donors what percentage of a donation, if any, may be taken as a business expense deduction. As the New York Times reported in its March 7tharticle, some of these organizations do not currently inform donors whether a contribution is tax deductible as a business expense at all.



    The IRS should already possess the authority to issue immediate guidance on this matter. We urge the IRS to take these steps immediately to prevent abuse of the tax code by political groups focused on federal election activities. But if the IRS is unable to issue administrative guidance in this area then we plan to introduce legislation to accomplish these important changes.



    Sincerely,



    Senators Charles E. Schumer, Michael Bennet, Sheldon Whitehouse, Jeff Merkley, Tom Udall, Jeanne Shaheen and Al Franken
     
  11. 548

    548 Guest

    If you have a problem with what you read in the letter drafted by the Senators, please point out what you didn't like. I don't see any party, group, or political affiliation being targeted as is widely reported. Thank you Senator Franken for doing your part to insert integrity in the system.


    548_2008_030386.jpg
     
  12. 548

    548 Guest

    <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MUW0RHv1aP8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
  13. 548

    548 Guest

    <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/-aLFwHWe9lc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
  14. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

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    Jeff Stearns(548), you are a "Forum Troll". You are nothing but a provocateur who serves no other purpose than disrupting discourse by posting your Left Wing Liberal garbage in the political section of this forum.

    Why don't you use the forum for which it was designed instead of spreading your Liberal anti-gun BS or get lost.


    This web site is devoted to informing the public about the sport of trapshooting.
     
  15. Traders

    Traders Well-Known Member

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    Rick,

    "Most of the polictical organazations, like the Tea Party operate under a 503(c)4, which can be political. They should be tax exempt as it is a political expressive, non profit as you cannot tax free speech under the 1st Amendment."

    When you say "They should be tax exempt", are you suggesting that they are not at this time, andt that the law should be changed.

    grntitan,

    If TS was intended to be solely "devoted to informing the public about the sport of trapshooting, the site sponsors would not have included "Off Topic Threads" and "Politics, Elections & Legislation". My guess is that they have done so because it makes the site a more interesting read.

    Since you have often posted in the non-shooting topic sections, I suggest that what you are saying is "I don't want people posting ideas that disagree with what I believe". You might consider that it is difficult to disagree with someone if you don't listen/read what they have to say. They might even change your thinking.

    I have noticed and commented before, that on this site, the label "Troll" is reserved for posters that done follow the majority line. I would bet that a poster starting a thread labeled "Obama is a Scum", would not be labeled a troll.
     
  16. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    The two faced, hypocrite Libtards on here who are so in favor of the IRS harrasing those who might use free speech to oppose their god Obama, would be screaming bloody murder if the same IRS did so with any leftist organization!! The IRS in this case OFTEN attacked faith groups, who while not condoning any party candidate, publish voting guides which allow those of their faith to see how candidates vote. Since they felt this would hurt the, God Hating, baby murdering, sodomite pushing, anti christian Liberal candidates, they engaged in a policy of harassment of those groups using their office and postition! You liberals are ALL hypocrits and LIARS!!! grntitan is dead on! Liberals on here have no purpose,except posting their left wing socialist, marxist drivel! After all the hearings and the obvious harassment time and time again of Christian or Conservative groups,there is simply NO WAY that ANYBODY can't see this, But, then ALL liberals are either in denial or BOLD FACED LIARS!!!
     
  17. stokinpls

    stokinpls Well-Known Member

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    Rachel Madcow, one of the all-time looney left.

    Bob Falfa
     
  18. 548

    548 Guest

    Well, there was a couple intelligent posts. ^ At this point we have to believe that the improper IRS targetting of conservative political groups was in response to the letter from the group of Senators, a copy of which I posted in it's entirety.

    So the questions are this:

    What did you read in the letter that suggested to you only right leaning political groups be targetted?

    What makes you think the Obamma administration has anything to do with this?

    Should political action groups, oh I'm sorry, should social welfare groups be allowed to contribute to political parties unchecked while enjoying tax free status.

    The IRS clearly is guilty of misconduct, but the conduct rests squarely on their own shoulders until someone can produce information otherwise. So far that hasn't happened.

    I ask the question again, read the letter to the IRS from the group of Senators that I posted above, what in that letter is improper?

    Remember, the ousted IRS chief was appointed by Bush, not Obamma! It is kind of hard to put this on Obamma's shoulders, don't you think?
     
  19. 548

    548 Guest

    Good questions Rick.

    I personally question why political action committees, oops, I mean social welfare organizations should enjoy tax exempt status at all, regardless of the percentage of their "business" is associated with political contributions.

    And let's be honest. Democrats get support from "the people" in the form of ten and twenty dollar bills. Republicans do the same on a much smaller scale, but they enjoys millions and millions in huge unchecked contributions from corporations disguised through these "social welfare" political action committees.
     
  20. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    I can't believe how some people are so blind, and no matter how crooked the person they voted for is, they will give 110% backing to them