1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

instinctive shooting please explain

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by 6ft lead, Apr 10, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. 6ft lead

    6ft lead TS Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2008
    Messages:
    21
    i was recently reading an article on instintive shooting and the number one thing that was talked about was "never look at the gun" in my preshot routine i like to line up my rib and beads the same everytime,then i always say to myself, kill him, and then i call for the bird, is thre something wrong with looking at the gun in preshot? like some feed back. 6ft lead
     
  2. Mr Newbius©

    Mr Newbius© TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2008
    Messages:
    1,463
    There is nothing wrong in "checking" the beads and such.

    If you know who the gun is supposed to feel to you when properly mounted than nothing more than a quick glance at the beads and such is really needed. You should almost be able to mount the gun with your eyes closed and only open your eyes when the gun is mounted and ... a quick glance check of the beads before you look out over the house and call PULL and BLAM the target is shattered into a gagilzillion pieces.
     
  3. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    I check my beads quickly every time I mount the gun. I then concentrate on the front lip of the house (I hold a low gun) and no longer see the beads. I then call and if everything is right, I only see the target. My body will point the gun automatically where I am looking. I do not think about leads, I just see the bird and let the gun shoot itself.

    My major problem is that I can see the bird better if I lift my head just a little. I have to work on looking at the bird with my head on the stock. Some days this is easy, other days it is not.

    Pat Ireland
     
  4. Mr Newbius©

    Mr Newbius© TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2008
    Messages:
    1,463
    Pat ... try shooting from the low gun and you will not have to worry about lifting your head.
     
  5. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,594
    There was a fellow a few decades into the last century, Lucky McDaniel, that taught shooters, new and old, the ability to shoot by instinct. His beginning process was to take a simple BB gun, wrench the sights off with pliers, and then hand it to the shooter. He'd throw objects in the air and ask the shooter to shoot it with the BB gun. The BB is so slow that any normal person can see where the shot went at the moment of the attempt at hitting the thrown object. From then on he'd ask the student to totally ignore the barrel and focus only on the thrown object and let his instincts adjust the POA without conscious thought. He'd quite soon have the person hitting first tin cans, then charcoal, then 1/2 dollars, then quarters, and would normally get people hitting dimes and aspirins. Once this was pretty well mastered he'd move them to shotgunning and have them use the same process usually with good success.

    What Sir Ireland has basically described is not that much different than Lucky's thoughts and it would likely help us all if we could apply this type of training.....breakemall....Bob Dodd
     
  6. shot410ga

    shot410ga Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,777
    Never, never take your eyes off the bird, your head will figure out when to pull or release the trigger, in time. Then your finger will do the rest. I don't even know when I release the trigger, it's automatic and I always try to keep my cheek on the gun until I see the target break (follow through).

    Pat Ireland: that's why I went to a high comb and extra high rib. If my head's already up, I don't have to lift it any more to see the target. Works for me!!!!!
     
  7. ke4yyd

    ke4yyd Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2006
    Messages:
    323
    I got involved with the Lucky McDaniel thing in the early 60's. It was fun and an excellent way to teach folks that have never shot shotguns how to point. My favorite target was moth balls as they were large enough to hit regularly and shattered nicely. When showing off, we would use aspirin tablets and occasionally BB's. When I was on, I could hit a BB thrown in the air about 1/3 of the time.

    The book is no longer in print but many libraries have a copy.

    http://worldcat.org/oclc/1543332&tab=holdings&start_holding=21

    An interesting article...

    http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,899618,00.html

    Modern day methods.......

    http://www.shootwhereyoulook.com/
     
  8. IM390

    IM390 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    213
    No there is nothing wrong with what you do. I envy people who can shoot on auto pilot, but unfortunately, I'm not one of them. A friend shot at his last 50 at the Grand without a front bead. It fell off sometime before. We all knew it but didn't want to tell him, for fear it would freak him out. Another buddy shot very well and very poorly day to day. He finally made up his mind to find out how come. He came to the conclusion that he also was on autopilot when shooting but couldn't figure out his misses until he visually concentrated on how he was mounting and swinging on each shot. He went from a strong "B" shooter down to class D for a couple of years. Now he's shooting class B again and well on his way to class A. And he now knows how to correct his mistakes.
     
  9. Big Jack

    Big Jack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,735
    Location:
    Erie, Pa
    I watched a military instructor demonstrate instinct shooting where his final demo was shooting a flat washer with celophane tape over the center hole..he would put a hole thru the tape. They wanted the lead men on patrols to be able to fire instinctivly. This was a 180 degree change from the aim & fire they were tought.

    Big Jack
     
  10. 6ft lead

    6ft lead TS Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2008
    Messages:
    21
    WONDERFUL GUYS KEEP IT COMING !!!!!6FT LEAD
     
  11. Mr Newbius©

    Mr Newbius© TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2008
    Messages:
    1,463
    ALRIGHT, I'M SURE THEY WILL ... why are we shouting?
     
  12. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,228
    Location:
    Mesquite, Nevada
    Fred Bear shot a bow without sights, he shot "instinctively" according to what he explained.

    Learning to shoot anything, rifle, shotgun, handgun or a bow in such a manner is learning to use your feel and your peripheral vision. Hap
     
  13. otnot

    otnot Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,426
    Let the force be with you! I too learned to use the force with a BB gun as a kid. I never used the sights as half the time I had to raise my POA well above what I wanted to hit. I would stand in the yard for hours throwing tin cans in the air and shooting them only looking at the can. This is also how I'm teaching my 7 year old to shoot since he isn't big enough to handle shotgun yet. I have to admit it's still fun to shoot a BB gun. LOL
     
  14. BRGII

    BRGII TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2008
    Messages:
    740
    Mr Newbius©
    Have you delegated yourself as the TS.COM expert? You have only been on here for a small amount of time, but make yourself present in 90 percent of the threads. You must be running for Moderator. JMHO BRGII
     
  15. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    10,521
    Location:
    Idaho
    I was taught to point the gun and not aim it. My hunting mentor was the fastes shot I ever saw and he said if you see the barrel or sights, you will never get to be a good and fast shot. I follow his rule and it works ( as long as I dont try to get too fast)Before you can master that, you have to know where the gun shoots. You have to practice with that gun to get that feel. Thats why I shoot the same gun and try not to change, because when I change, I have to learn the gun all over again. When I hear people talking about how do you stack the beads?? I kind of laugh inside because I know they dont know what instinctive shooting is. It may not work for everyone but does for me.
     
  16. Mr Newbius©

    Mr Newbius© TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2008
    Messages:
    1,463
    BRGII - 90% of the threads, now that is funny and I thank you for the hilarity of your comment. I would also like to thank you for not actually degrading what I said while at the same time not even taking about the topic at hand but instead just attacking.

    BTW - it looks as if today so far there has been approximately 150 active topics so if I were to be doing as you think (which we all know is accurate and correct) that would mean I would have made at least 1 single post on at least 135 different threads and I have only made about 17 (18 including this one) posts on 11 threads and with those numbers they are far and I mean real far below what you state but you've been around longer so you must be more knowledgeable so we'll go with your figures. Thanks for the chuckles.
     
  17. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,434
    Instinctive shooting = using the subconscious part of the brain to do all the calculations. HMB
     
  18. mercedesman1981

    mercedesman1981 TS Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2007
    Messages:
    323
    Milt -mp3006, bullseye pistol shooters focus on the front sight exclusively, slow fire, timed fire or rapid fire, it is all the same.

    I can't speak for the other competitive pistol disciplines and what works for them but my first instinct would be to focus on the front sight.

    Mike
     
  19. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    Mike- You are correct about shooting a pistol accurately in bullseye shooting(front sight aligned with rear sight, never look at the target). But, shotgun shooting is the opposite. I have shot quite a bit of both.

    Pat Ireland
     
  20. BBMAX

    BBMAX TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    40
    Good Morning "6ft lead" - Many of the folks above have very correctly described "instinctive shooting" Let me add that (1) when shooting a moving target (approximately 40MPH to 45 MPH) your eyes are your "radar" and should be totally focused on the target and not your gun or the beads, and (2) we have timed how long it takes from when the shooter calls for the target, sees and tracks it, and finally shoots it - between 1/4 and 1 1/4 of a second (that is all). Trapshooting is a trained reaction - no thinking just lock on the target and let your eyes and brain do their work (again no thinking). As said above the Subconscious part of your brain can hit every target. Let it do its job.

    Good shooting -

    Bruce Maxwell
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.