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How to tighten a pattern, powder or wad

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Fraz, Mar 11, 2010.

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  1. Fraz

    Fraz TS Member

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    I would like to tighten my pattern, the barrel and choke are matched to Light full, but the load I am using I feel the pattern could be improved.

    I have looked at it at 13yds, 25yds & 32, I would like to draw in the flyers
    the load is 1oz - 8s Have you found one powder or wad combo to produce a more uniform pattern. My load smokes targets but I feel it could be better,

    Or is there a point when you leave things alone short of some fancy gun/barrel work.
    thanks Fraz
     
  2. Bob Schultz

    Bob Schultz Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    Fraz,

    Almost every load will have a different effect on your pattern. I have found that lower pressure loads tend to pattern a bit better. Try 3 or 4 different powders with different wad combinations and pattern them for their effectiveness. Usually you'll find a couple that are better than the rest ... and there you have it.

    (Use only hard magnum shot for best patterns.)

    Good luck,

    Bob Schultz
     
  3. smifshot

    smifshot TS Member

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    use the hardest shot you can find with slower burning powders. Green dot is betteer than red dot speed powders. PB is good also..unigue..gut use data from the powder compaines. For wads use those of the big 3 makers. The fed. s3 is good bet
     
  4. HTSmith

    HTSmith Active Member

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    For 1.125 loads, I've found that green dot loaded to 1150 fps to be really tight in my guns. I've not seen that much difference in the wads. For 1 ounce I would use fast powder (red dot, clays, 700x, tightwad,etc) and keep the velocity under 1200 fps.
     
  5. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

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    Fraz, you can save yourself a lot of effort and expense if you try this first. Buy a box each of STS, Gold Medal and AA shells in 1oz. #8. Then see how they all pattern in your barrel/choke combination.

    If you like what you see, then you can certainly come up with a handload that equals that performance. If you don't like what you see, then don't bother trying to find that one special handload that beats the factory premiums and makes your choke sing. Been there; done that. It's a losing proposition.

    If you are not happy with the patterns premium factory ammo produces, you'll have to decide if you want to try some choke work, or barrel and choke work.
     
  6. mrskeet410

    mrskeet410 TS Member

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  7. wayneo

    wayneo Active Member

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    Tighten choke===Tighten pattern. Simple.............. Wayne
     
  8. Dr.Longshot

    Dr.Longshot Banned Banned

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    Use lighter wads, less shot, less powder and Remington Primers.

    That should do it.


    Gary Bryant
    Dr.longshot
     
  9. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Light full, at the distances you have tested, should be indistinguishable from full. Maybe all that's happening, Fraz, is you are seeing the difference between real patterns and the 'Perfectly even" ones reported here.

    What are you looking for? How does that differ from what you are getting, specifically? Light full, call it about 0.033 constriction, should both look and act like full for all but a few patterns in a string, with only a couple non-overlapping, on the downside for LF, upside for Full, or be virtually the same for all.

    That is, tightening the choke won't help because most of the time, everything will be about the same.

    Patterns look bad, in general. If yours do, you are just like the rest of us.

    Neil
     
  10. Fraz

    Fraz TS Member

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    Niel is right about it being almost indistguishable from a full pattern and not perfect as one might think it should be. I was hopeing for an answer in bringing in the fringe shot but everyone wants that. what I have is not bad I just wanted to improve it. Also a tighter choke ie. full offers the same result. I will check the speed, and then twique the powder a little to see if anything changes. This load has always been good to me but trap shooters can't ever leave anything alone.
     
  11. 1ounceload

    1ounceload TS Member

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    i shoot 1 ounce loads, nitro 100 on 16 grains will do it anywhere on the field. your chokes might not be what they say. i shoot the same load on bothe my guns. one will do the job with IM but i have to use a full in the other. Keep looking there is a comboo that will make you happy.
     
  12. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    The pursuit of perfection is also known as the road to insanity.
     
  13. Trap2

    Trap2 Well-Known Member

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    Fraz.....

    "This load has always been good to me but trap shooters can't ever leave anything alone."

    Which is precisely why a lot of us never get any better....... Dan Thome (Trap2)
     
  14. highflyer

    highflyer TS Member

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    I did see a perfect pattern once. It was a buffered copper plated load. It looked like someone had carefully punched every pellet hole on the board.
     
  15. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    Testing many chokes and different loads, I have observed that the outer diameter (fringe) of your patterns will usually be about the same. The differences in choke will move pellets in towards the center or away from the center, changing the density of the pattern center areas. If the center of the pattern is denser, when compared to the outer areas, then the choke did as it was intended to do. Tight chokes don't seem to give me even patterns. They tend to give me patterns that are denser near the center at the yardages you indicated. A full, light full, or even some Improved Modifieds don't really become that effective or noticable until you get out past 35 yards or more. If you want more shot in the outer areas, use a more open choke. If you want more shot near the center of the pattern, a tighter choke will probably do the trick. The problem is that when you move shot towards the center, it leaves the outer areas looking sparse. If the pattern center is dense and if it smokes targets when centered, it is doing as it was intended. Premium HARD shot may help the flyers a bit, as might a well constructed wad. I haven't noticed that much difference with various brands of quality magnum shot or between different premium wads.

    It takes a LOT of pattern work and comparisons to see a difference or trend. If a load patterns as I would expect, it's difficult to improve upon it. You can spend thousands of dollars on barrel and choke work and countless hours on pattern testing and load development. It may not improve what you already have, or at least not enough to make it worthwhile. You need to compare what you have with a "normal" set of statistics for a variety of combinations to see how good it actually is. Most good patterns don't look that great, until you do the counting and tally up the averages.

    There is an interesting article on patterns and chokes found here
     
  16. Bob_K

    Bob_K Well-Known Member

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    For loads of the same muzzle velocity, the one with the lower pressure tends to group tighter, all else being equal. For loads of the same pressure, the one with the lower velocity tends to group tighter, all else being equal. This bit of shotgun wisdom comes from Bob Brister's "Shotgun - the Art and the Science."
     
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