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Homeowners Association bans guns

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Brian in Oregon, Mar 23, 2007.

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  1. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I figured it would only be a matter of time before an HOA would ban guns.<br>
    <br>
    Community Suggests Gun Possession Is Illegal For Residents<br>
    <br>
    March 19, 2007 03:16 PM<br>
    <br>
    ANTIOCH, Tenn.- Some people in a Nashville neighborhood are furious over a new rule that makes it illegal to own a gun.<br>
    <br>
    Residents in Nashboro Village said it's unconstitutional and leaves them defenseless.<br>
    <br>
    Two weeks ago, residents received a letter from their homeowners' association indicating that guns are not allowed on the property.<br>
    <br>
    "It thought it was ironic that they say you can't have something when the United States government says you can," said resident Cristina Salajanu.<br>
    <br>
    Salajanu would like to give her neighborhood management company a history lesson.<br>
    <br>
    "I think it's unconstitutional," Salajanu said. "They can't tell you what to own or not to own in your own house."<br>
    <br>
    Salajanu is talking about the Bill of Rights, specifically the Second Amendment, which grants citizens the right to keep and bear arms. It's been an American freedom for 215 years but Salajanu and other residents said it's been taken away from them.<br>
    <br>
    "Something needs to be done," she said.<br>
    <br>
    Two weeks ago, the property management company at Nashboro Village told its residents no more guns on the property.<br>
    <br>
    "It incensed me that it was written the way it was," said a resident who asked not to be identified.<br>
    <br>
    She said there is a serious need to feel protected here and a firearm can do that.<br>
    <br>
    "We've got dark areas, the lighting is very definitely very dim," she said.<br>
    <br>
    Salajanu said that burglaries started to increase since late summer...<br>
    <br>
    She said she believes her neighborhood has changed since she moved in last year.<br>
    <br>
    "Three weeks ago someone was stopped at gunpoint," Salajanu said. "It seems the nature of those burglaries is becoming more dangerous."<br>
    <br>
    Some residents at Nashboro Village have campaigned for better lighting and more security but if they can't get either they at least want their Second Amendment rights upheld.<br>
    <br>
    "If I'm walking if I'm walking my dog or if I am outside walking and if I don't feel safe and I'm licensed then I'll carry a gun," said the resident who did not want her identity disclosed.<br>
    <br>
    Officials with Ghertner and Company, the property manager at Nashboro Village, would not make an on-camera comment about the gun policy but said they plan on changing the rule soon to allow firearms on the property.<br>
    <br>
    However, they would make it illegal to fire those guns, which residents say is still unconstitutional.<br>
    <br>
    Neighbors said they understand the gun rule is meant to keep criminals out of Nashboro Village but they don't believe that prohibiting firearms is the best way to do that.
     
  2. Texas Ton

    Texas Ton TS Member

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    #$%&^# Idiots, not that it matters where in the USA, but Davy is a spinnin in his grave.
     
  3. WarEagle2017

    WarEagle2017 Active Member

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    Sounds like a No Brainer for criminals that want to go into a neighibor hood, and Rob Steal and Harm, the occupants, thats like putting a sigh in you yard that says THERE IS NO GUNS IN THIS HOUSE.
     
  4. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    I would have the HOA in Federal Court and own them before that was over ... Thats a Civil Right and the HOA has no right to infringe upon them ... That just goes to show you what happens when you give some clowns some power who have never had it before ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  5. Big Heap

    Big Heap TS Member

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    How can they have a "HOME OWNERS ASSN." if the property is all a rental? Nashboro Village - check it on Google. Does the second amendment apply to renters as well as home owners?
     
  6. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Thats a battle you dont want to fight

    Move

    Gene
     
  7. superxjeff

    superxjeff Active Member

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    That just goes to show you what happens when you give some clowns some power who have never had it before ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
    BINGO..... A bunch of hand wringers and little old ladys in white tennis shoes that have nothing better to do with there time then come up with stupid stuff. This rule has more holes and loopholes then swiss cheeese but it should still be done away with. I thought this stuff only happened in Illinois. Some city in illinois banned all guns, so don't say that it is unconstitutional because they have done it already and got away with it. Jeff
     
  8. smartass

    smartass TS Member

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    Good rule to live by: never buy a home that's under the thumb of a homeowners association. Sooner or later, you'll be sorry.
     
  9. Colonel Reb

    Colonel Reb TS Member

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    I too am unsure whether or not this is a homeowners association or a rental management company. I guess when you are not actually the property owner, the management company can tell you whatever they want to. If it truly is a HOA, then the rule is unconstitutional and they can not enforce it, any more than they could say that all residents must attend the Church of Christ. The homeowners association has no sovereign authority to operate in defiance of both our state constitution's gun rights provisions and the federal constitution. As a general rule I detest homeowners' associations as an assault on private property rights. If you want your neighbors to keep their yards clean, have the city or county pass an ordinance for the whole town or county. HOA's seem to give legislative authority to non-governmental, non-elected groups.
     
  10. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    Kennesaw Mountain, Ga. has mandatory gun ownership. Their crime rate is practically nil.

    Media qon't give it a play.

    Mash the link.

    HM
     
  11. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    drhuner, quote: "Sounds like a No Brainer for criminals that want to go into a neighibor hood, and Rob Steal and Harm, the occupants, thats like putting a sigh in you yard that says THERE IS NO GUNS IN THIS HOUSE."<br>
    <br>
     
  12. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I'm told it's not enough that Ginny Burdick is trying to ban guns in Oregon. Apparently she's trying to get a "gunshow loophole" bill passed in WASHINGTON STATE prohibiting private transfers. Why she's sticking her nose into Washington State politics I dunno.
     
  13. The Rock

    The Rock Active Member

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    This would also mean that the leases could be broken. Any major change like this
    usually requires a waiver on the part of the tenant.

    Rock

    Jim
     
  14. Big Heap

    Big Heap TS Member

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    SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER


    Gun show check bill moves along
    Critics say there's no proof measure would reduce crime

    Monday, March 5, 2007

    By MELISSA SANTOS
    P-I REPORTER

    OLYMPIA -- Legislators are pushing forward with efforts to close the gun show loophole, but critics still say there's no loophole to close.

    A bill that would require all sellers at gun shows to conduct background checks passed out of committee Tuesday, but Senate Majority Leader Lisa Brown, D-Spokane, said it's uncertain whether it will reach the Senate floor.

    Gun control proponents say Washington law allows people to buy firearms at gun shows without going through a federally required background check, an oversight that could allow criminals to purchase guns.

    But opponents argue that gun show sales don't contribute to gun violence, and the proposed bill would only inconvenience law-abiding citizens who want to exercise their Second Amendment rights.

    Sen. Jim Clements, R-Selah, said targeting gun show sales is a knee-jerk reaction to last year's mass shootings on Capitol Hill and at the Jewish Federation Building in Seattle, and would be a symbolic move rather than a practical one.

    Clements, who voted against Senate Bill 5197 in committee, said it's unclear how many guns used in crimes in Washington are purchased by criminals at gun shows.

    "Rather than going into the world of supposition, I'm going to propose some legislation that goes on the facts," Clements said. "I would just as soon have some clarity to all this that allows people to look at these issues singularly and debate them."

    In Oregon, where voters approved an initiative to close the gun show loophole in 2000, the effect of the measure is less than clear. Lawmakers who supported it say it has made a huge difference, but Portland police are unsure the city's lower crime rates mean fewer criminals are getting their hands on guns.

    Before Oregon implemented its gun show loophole measure, which 62 percent of voters approved, Portland police spent three years tracing guns used in gang violence. Of those that could be traced, they found that 27 percent of them came from gun shows.

    "Gun shows were always two things: a fun thing for a family to do on a Saturday morning, and a place for criminals to get guns," said Sen. Ginny Burdick, D-Portland, who is chairwoman of Oregon's Senate Judiciary Committee. "Now it's only one of those things."

    Portland police spokesman Brian Schmautz said the city has seen reduced crime since the measure passed, but its criminals don't seem to have any more difficulty getting guns than before.

    "Our crime numbers are down, but gang cops are not all of a sudden saying that there are fewer guns in the gang community," he said.

    Sen. Janéa Holmquist, R-Moses Lake, said the situation is different in Washington.

    All gun shows in the greater Seattle area are put on by Washington Arms Collectors, a members-only organization that lets only those who have gone through a background check buy or sell firearms there. Elsewhere in the state, any licensed dealer who sells at a gun show is also required to conduct background checks on potential buyers, but private parties who wish to sell there are not.

    For private parties, the fees associated with conducting background checks would cut into their bottom line and could be passed on to customers in the form of higher prices, Holmquist said. She cited a federal study from 2002 that found that less than 1 percent of guns used in violent crimes came from gun shows.

    "The term 'gun show loophole' is a fabrication," Holmquist said. "It's clear the laws that apply elsewhere in the state also apply at gun shows. This bill is just going to impose dealer restrictions on private citizens who aren't dealers.

    "It's law-abiding folks who frequent gun shows, not criminals."

    In Seattle, where aggravated assaults with guns rose 19 percent last year, Mayor Greg Nickels and police Chief Gil Kerlikowske are both strong supporters of the bill.

    Eighteen other states have enacted legislation to require background checks on all purchasers at gun shows.

    Kerlikowske said that because sales at gun shows by non-dealers aren't carefully documented, the absence of statistical evidence that they supply shooters in Washington is a moot point.

    "If there is no record of the sale and no background check, then there is little evidence of the number of sales that were denied or of the number of crime guns that come from gun shows," he said.

    "This legislation will fix that."

    Even if the bill makes it to the Senate floor and passes, House Speaker Frank Chopp, D-Seattle, said last month that it doesn't have enough support to pass the House.

    He said gun control issues are divisive even among Democrats, who have a large majority in both houses this year.

    But Burdick said politicians struggle with gun control measures more than the public. A telephone survey conducted in November found that 81 percent of Washington voters supported criminal checks on all gun show buyers, and that rural voters were as likely to support such measures as city dwellers.

    "Most gun owners are reasonable people, and they favor reasonable laws," Burdick said. "If you agree with background checks in order to prevent criminals from getting guns, and then you go to a gun show and see these really high-caliber weapons being sold to people, no questions asked -- for most people, it's a no-brainer."

    Sponsor Sen. Rodney Tom, D-Medina, said the bill's only intention is to make sure standard background checks -- which prevented sales of 2,400 firearms to convicted felons and people with mental illness in Washington last year -- happen with every sale.

    "This is not an expansion of any gun restrictions," he said.

    Sen. Ed Murray, D-Seattle, said anything the Legislature can do to control who gets their hands on firearms in Washington is worth pursuing.

    "It's one of the measures people in my district have felt they needed in a real way," Murray said. "This is one small step toward telling people who lost their loved ones on Capitol Hill that we are finally doing something."
     
  15. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Ironic that liberals even say it is not reasonable to restrict a right.<br>
    <br>
    Just ask any liberal if it's reasonable to restrict abortion rights.<br>
    <br>
    But when asked if it's reasonable to restrict Second Amendment rights, they'll say yes.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    As for a gunshow loophole law in Washington, check the fine print. Ours was a vehicle to authorize the state police to keep a registry of all firearms transfers going through an FFL.
     
  16. Jennifer

    Jennifer Member

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    The old saying "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" is especially appropriate for the world's emotional, knee-jerk, "feel-good legislation" liberals. And you can bet they will lead us to hell if we let them.
     
  17. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    The problem we face is that we're going to hell at 60 mph with the Democrats, and 40 mph with RINO's (Republicans In Name Only) and the Jim Zumbo Fudds.
     
  18. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    AS posted above NEVER NEVER buy a house that can be even REMOTELY controlled by a bunch of HOA AHs! If they tried that with me I would put their names out in EVERY avenue possible to let it be known WHERE they lived, they were against gun ownership, were UNARMED, and had NO WAY to protect themselves!
     
  19. Jennifer

    Jennifer Member

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    Yeah Brian, exactly. Just look at Mitt Romney. Totally anti-gun, anti-assault-weapons, signed all kinds of anti-gun legislation into law in MA, then at the last minute (last August) joins the NRA and starts parading himself around as a Life member of the NRA, gun-toting Republican.......NOT! I trust him less than McCain, and I don't trust McCain. I think I'm going to unplug the TV for the next election - I don't see any candidates on our side and I'm scared.

    slide action you're right. The property we purchased is agricultural, not in a subdivision, out in the county. We harvest a deer a piece during season just a few hundred paces from the house. We have ham radio antennas up and nobody cares or can do anything about it anyway. But, that doesn't mean that we're immune from eminent domain. A silicon-valley investor bought 9 square miles of raw land behind us and needs access to it. It probably won't be long before we get an ugly surprise in the mailbox. It's sad when you really don't own your land.

    Keep up the vigilance guys - seems like 75% of the people who frequent this site have their heads in the sand these days. NOT GOOD.

    Jennifer
     
  20. SoftCraft

    SoftCraft TS Member

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    Well lets see:

    Federal constitution applies to federal lands and buildings

    State constitution applies to state lands and buildings unless home rule restrictions are inacted.

    County consitution applies to county lands and buildings unless....

    And so on....so how does the fed get the states to follow fed rules...money, money and more money. As long as federal money is involved in a project, federal rules must apply. Same for other layers of government.

    With an HOA, the people who live there have signed a contract to abide with the HOA rules. Their option is not to live in the HOA.

    Do I like livng in an HOA? Mostly no. But they do have their uses. If you don't like HOAs then don't buy a house in one. Simple.

    Rich
     
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