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Hodgdon Universal Powder + R209 Primer

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by undersluice, Dec 9, 2012.

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  1. undersluice

    undersluice Member

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    I am trying to get a soft shooting handicap load using Hodgdon's Universal powder with all Remington components.

    Hodgdon's website didn't have any loads listed with remington primer(R209), so I called up Hodgdon and asked them if I could substitute winchester primer (W209) with R209 for one of their listed loads. I was advised I can do so.

    I loaded up the following combination (from their website) and just swapped the W209 primer with R209 => Remington Gold Hull+R209 primer+Universal 22.5 grains powder+Remington Fig8 Wad + 1 1/8 oz shot. This should give me a 3 drams equivalent load (1200 ft/sec)as per the website reloading data.

    But I am getting very poor powder burn (lot of unburnt powder in the barell) and just around 1150 ft/sec muzzle velocity. My wad seating and crimps are perfect.

    Does anyone have experience with these components or faced a similar issue ? Would appreciate any pointers.

    Thanks,
    JB
     
  2. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

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    Universal Clays is a poor choice for 12ga loads. It is meant for 20ga.

    Your load is developing too low a pressure to get a complete burn, hence the unburnt powder. If you want to continue using that powder, you need to switch to a hotter primer (Fed 209A or CCI 209M), if you want to continue using those primers, you need to switch powders. I had a similar problem using International Clays w/ 1oz loads, had to switch to Fed primers to solve the problem, and bought different powder when I burned through what I had.
     
  3. cafowler

    cafowler Member

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    Try International, and either a 7/8 or 1 oz load at 1,300 fps. Light and will break them from any distance if you do your part.

    Good luck.
     
  4. ljuticsscentennialpro

    ljuticsscentennialpro Member

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    I prefer Hodgdon's International Clays over Universal for the speed you are looking for. Universal is a great powder for hotter sporting loads at about 1310fps and it replicates Remington's 12 gauge Nitro Sporting loads. It is not as clean burning as International. International seems to shoot softer than a hotter load of Hodgdon Clays for handicap speeds. By the way, a little trick I learned is that you can load Hodgdon Clays for singles, Hodgdon International for handicap, and Hodgdon Universal for sporting loads in 12 gauge, 1 1/8oz by using the same powder bushing, FOLLOWING THE LOADS LISTED IN THE HODGDON RELOADING TABLES FOR EACH OF THESE POWDERS. The VOLUME of the powder bushing happens to drop the correct weight of the powder charge for each of the powders, verified with a scale. Try some Hodgdon's International. Bob
     
  5. mike campbell

    mike campbell Active Member

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    Simply up your powder charge, per the website data. Apparently you are chronographing, so up the charge to 23.7, as they show it should give an incremental velocity increase of about 50 fps. The 1,000 psi increase will improve your burn as others suggested.

    Did you ask about substituting with that SPECIFIC powder charge, or for any of the 3 loads they show? I suspect it would be OK with even the heaviest one, but you may want to check with them again on that.
     
  6. illtrap1

    illtrap1 Member

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    Go to Solo 1000 has good chamber pressure gets great ingintion and does not have recoil I loaded international clays PB Solo 1000 burns clean,Clayborn Hunter loads it for 16's and doubles I load 18.2 rem sts hull pink AA wad RIO primer,Fed gold medal hull Fed 12S3 wad 20.2 grns 1145 great powder I chrono it with win primers fed and rio's win varied mor than fed and rio's,Dan
     
  7. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Green Dot. HMB
     
  8. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

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    I shoot the charge Mike Campbell suggested above with no issues. On any powder if you are near the lower end of the charts you will get poor powder burns.

    I had called Hodgdon and ask about different load weights and was told as long as you don't go over or under the posted weight you will be fine, and as mike suggested above you can calculate in between posted fps.
     
  9. undersluice

    undersluice Member

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    Thanks for all your reponses.

    I will get hold of a few W209 primers to burn through my keg of universal and will try International powder as my next "trial" powder !

    Regards,
    JB
     
  10. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    ljuticsscentennialpro wrote;

    "By the way, a little trick I learned is that you can load Hodgdon Clays for singles, Hodgdon International for handicap, and Hodgdon Universal for sporting loads in 12 gauge, 1 1/8oz by using the same powder bushing, using all loads within the Hodgdon loading tables."


    I don't think so. You need to revisit your wisdom.
     
  11. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    If you wish to use Universal, load to 1255 using win primers. There is no way I would use Rem primers.
     
  12. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    If you're not married to the idea of using Universal, try Titegroup for handicap loads.

    One of the best handicap powders out there.
     
  13. mike campbell

    mike campbell Active Member

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    ljuticsscentennialpro wrote;

    "By the way, a little trick I learned is that you can load Hodgdon Clays for singles, Hodgdon International for handicap, and Hodgdon Universal for sporting loads in 12 gauge, 1 1/8oz by using the same powder bushing, using all loads within the Hodgdon loading tables."

    "I don't think so. You need to revisit your wisdom."

    Sure you can. A #32 MEC will work just fine with all 3 powders. Also happens to be the bushing I use for my Green Dot loads.
     
  14. Ross

    Ross Well-Known Member

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    How many of you have ever had any problems (bloopers etc.) with any factory loads, target or field?? I never have and have sat in unheated duck blinds--deer stands--etc. in "0" & below temps for many hours & my shells always worked fine, also hunted (early season) with some target type reloads only thing I changed was shot size, the closest thing to a problem that I ever encountered was hunting loads that wouldn't cycle my pardners Browning A5, this would have been in the early 1960s he was using new WW Hi-brass field loads, 3&3\4--1&1\4, I was using the same load in Federal in my 870 we traded a few shells and no more trouble for either one of us.

    The reason I ask this is I have usually (until recently can't get any) used Rem. primers & products even way back when Rems were the old 57 size, yes I did use Fed. 209s in Fed hulls and never had any of the cold weather problems that some report here on TS. Just wondering?? Ross Puls
     
  15. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    You are correct about the factory loads working in very cold weater Ross. I think factory loads are generally loaded to higher pressure than a lot of us handloaders load to. That and the hulls are brand new with very srong crimps.

    I would think the last thing an ammo maker would want is complaints about how their shells ruined a bunch of otherwise good times in the field.
     
  16. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    Mike,

    Perhaps your 32 bushing will work for you, and many others, but not for myself. The first two loads will be too slow, and the Univ in my load will be too hot.

    Particular velocities are all important to my style of shooting, and one size fits all does not "fit".

    Best to you though, and all that subscribe.
     
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