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High rib for Intn'l Doubles

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Montagnana2, Sep 29, 2007.

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  1. Montagnana2

    Montagnana2 TS Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2006
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    Hello all,

    I've been watching international trap on the ISSF TV web site and am curious about something. Shooters in singles trap use guns with what appear to be standard ribs for trap shooting, some slightly higher than others, but standard looking just the same. However, most of the doubles trap shooters are using guns with ribs that appear to be 2-3 inches high, with some ribs full length and some just a few inches long at the muzzle end. I don't understand what there is about the doubles trap that requires that high of a rib. Obviously the sight picture is higher. Do they "sight" the target more than usual?

    I won't be shooting any international doubles, but it seemed odd, and I thought one of you more experienced shooters might be able to answer.

    Thanks,
    Larry
     
  2. jakearoo

    jakearoo Active Member

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    Larry,
    International bunker singles vary dramatically in height and angle. Doubles are fixed and actually quite a bit closer together and more straight out than ATA doubles but go much faster. Shooting singles, the shooter holds a very low gun (compared to ATA shooters) so as not to be beat by the low targets. Thus the target virtually always appears above the gun. A flat low rib is usually preferred.

    In international doubles, the first bird must be shot very fast to allow the shooter to swing a minimal distance to the second bird. Most good shooters "trap" the bird. That is, they set up their gun where the first bird will appear and shoot it with very little movement, if any. Thus, the bird first appears underneath the barrel and is sort of "spot shot." A high rib in that game allows the shooter to see the bird under the barrel and "lead" it with virtually no gun movement. (Ask Jimmy Heller sometime how he shoots the first bird in ATA doubles. He uses about the same technique.)

    By the way, where is this web site where you are watching the International shooting? Regards, Jake
     
  3. BMC

    BMC Member

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    Oct 12, 2006
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    In talking at length with Jeff Holguin after he won the Ca. State Doubles I asked Jeff about Int. Doubles since that is his basically his profession to try and glean some pointers. His Perazzi had a mid-height rib. He stressed several times to me that they are taught to pick a spot and pull the trigger on the flash of the target and to never let the target rise above the barrel. Obviously his gun shoots pretty high which probably corresponds with the higher rib among other things. I learned a lot from that conversation.
     
  4. Montagnana2

    Montagnana2 TS Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2006
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    Jakearoo,

    Thanks for the info. I understand more now.

    Just do a search for ISSI TV and you will find the website. Click on "competitions", then the year, and it will give you a list of events for that year. Select one (trap, skeet, rifle, pistol) and then go above there and hit "results". It will list the individual events. If it has three columns after it you can click on the event you want under the TV line and you can see the whole event, narrated in English, usually with a noted shooter as guest commentator. It will appear as a small screen but you can click on the button under the picture and you will get a full screen. Took me a while to learn all this. The competitions are an incredible study in concentration and intensity and I think anyone interested in the shotgun sports could benefit from watching them. Lots of great shooters from all over the world.

    Take care,
    Larry
     
  5. Montagnana2

    Montagnana2 TS Member

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    Jakearoo,

    I realized I made a mistake. It's ISSF TV.

    larry
     
  6. jakearoo

    jakearoo Active Member

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    Mike, A DB-81 might be a good ticket. And, for an pretty good description of doubles trap, check this out.

    http://trapandfield.com/trapshooting%20olympic%20way.htm

    Have a great time in Italy. I assume you will be in Bresha/Gardone? Have some risoto for me. Jake
     
  7. jakearoo

    jakearoo Active Member

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    Mike, Some very interesting stuff in Gardone. Aside from Perazzi, Beretta et. al. There are hundreds of little gunmakers and journeymen. With a little digging you can make some amazing deals. I have been told, though never confirmed, that there is at least one shotgun parts dealer who is a is like a central clearing house for many of these individual folks. You could probably get that Perazzi setup you are trying to build better and cheaper than you can have it done here. Regards, Jake
     
  8. Texas Crew'd

    Texas Crew'd Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
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    Location:
    Texas hill country
    Hello Gents,

    International doubles has 3 schemes...a copy and paste from american vs olympic

    In Double Trap, the same guns, targets, shells, field, bunker and shooting sequence are utilized, but targets are thrown only from the middle 3 traps. The center target is a straight away 3.5 meters high measured at 10 meters and the left and right targets are set 5 degrees out from the centerline and 3 meters high. All targets fly 55 meters (60.5 yards) as opposed to the 44-48 yards for US Doubles.

    There are 3 different schemes for setting the traps; left and center (A), right and center (B), and left and right (C). A match would be 50 targets from each setting and a final for the top 6 scores on the C setting. In American doubles, 40% of your first shots (stations 2 and 4) are straight aways. Target heights and speeds are the same and your angles are consistent because you are shooting from an arc. Each station being the same distance from the center of the trap. In double trap, only 6 to 13% of your first shots are straight and because the traps are set one meter apart and the shooting stations are on a straight line and there are three schemes, all the angles are different. As a result 50 straights are rare.

    Garry
     
  9. Baber

    Baber TS Member

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    Garry describes Double Trap accurately but leaves out one item. There was a problem with people trying to spot shoot the the first bird and shooting so quickly that trap house roofs were being shot so they instituted a 0-1 second delay in the voice call.

    Just remember that this is a game designed by a skeet shooter so you know its going to be a little screwy.

    TB
     
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