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HELP POST YOUR BEST CLAYDOT LOAD

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by A CHANCE, Jul 8, 2009.

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  1. A CHANCE

    A CHANCE TS Member

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    BEST CLAYDOT LOAD?
     
  2. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Well, to be honest, I use the real thing from Hodgdon, not the Alliant plagiarized version. But here it is, since the data should be the same.

    - Remington Hull

    - Downrange XL-1 Neon Green wad
    (you can substitute the pink WAA12SL, Green Duster, or the Claybuster or Downrange WAA12SL clone)

    - Winchester 209 primer

    - 1 ounce (actually measures out to 0.95 ounces) of number 8-1/2 shot

    - 17 grains of Hodgdon Clays (or ClayDot if you prefer)

    I had this load tested by Kevin Lewis at Downrange Wads on his pressure test gun.

    It tested out to about 1160 fps muzzle velocity and 8600 psi pressure.

    This is my day in, day out, singles and doubles load.
     
  3. Hauxfan

    Hauxfan Well-Known Member

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    I use 18.5 grains of Claydot in a STS hull. I use 1 1/8th ounce of 7 1/2s with a Remington primer. Good for around 1150-1170 or thereabouts.

    Good load.....Go for it!

    Hauxfan!
     
  4. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    <blockquote>"Well, to be honest, I use the real thing from Hodgdon, not the Alliant plagiarized version..."</blockquote>
    Alliant's product would only be a plagiarism if they had stolen Hodgdens's formula and marketed it as their own. The Alliant formula is completely different from the Hodgdon formula.

    My pet 1 oz. load:

    - AA hull<br>- Federal 209 primer<br>- 16.8 grn Claydot<br>- DownRange XL-1 or DRA-12 (pink) wad<br>- 1 oz. Lawrence shot

    Carol Lister
     
  5. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm.

    "The Alliant formula is completely different from the Hodgdon formula."

    And you know this how?

    Looks like Clays.

    Behaves like Clays.

    Alliant says you can use Clays data.

    They named it CLAY dot.


    Hodgdon Clays is a great product, and Alliant copied it, duplicated it, reverse engineered it, call it what you want.

    Plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery.
     
  6. jagrdawger

    jagrdawger TS Member

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    I use rem hull, w209, 17.2 grains, XL-1 Wad, 1 oz #8

    Look at the MSDS. This is how to determine compatibility/similarity of many products. One is single base and one is double base. They are not the same:

    Claydot
    Nitroglycerin: 4.0 - 40.0 (C) 2 mg/m3 (Skin) OSHA PEL 0.46 mg/m3 (Skin) ACGIH TLV
    Rosin: 1.0 - 4.0 Not established
    Diphenylamine: 1.0 10 mg/m3 ACGIH TLV

    Clays
    Nitrocellulose 9004-70-0 >85
    Nitroglycerin 55-63-0 10
    additives non-hazardous <10
     
  7. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    <blockquote>"Well, I doubt Alliant stole the formula from Hodgdon, but they did spend a lot of time trying to duplicate it. Most likely reverse-engineered."</blockquote>
    Alliant was trying to duplicate Clay's characteristics, not its components. It took a court decision and an appeal to finally rule that Alliant's use of the name "Clay Dot" was not a violation of Hodgdon's "Clays" trademark. Do you really imagine that Alliant would volunteer to get into a similar court fight over the formulation of the powder as well. You HAVE to know that Hodgdon was all over Claydot the day it hit the market looking for similarities to their Clays. There are many ways to duplicate characteristics without duplicating ingredients.

    Carol Lister
     
  8. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    16.0 gr claydot. 1 oz dxl-1 wad, sts or aa hull, RIO primer 1 oz 8's or 8 1/2's.
     
  9. Lead Man

    Lead Man TS Member

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    Thieves and their followers. I guess ruger didn't copy Keltec either.
     
  10. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    EE,

    All of Alliant's Reloder series are imported.
     
  11. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, I believe all extruded rifle powders are imports, regardless of who markets them.
     
  12. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Ball, I think.
     
  13. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against Alliant. They're a true American company. They have the Lake City facility here in the KC area, and I know at least one person who works there. They own Federal Cartridge Company.

    But I get a little sensitive about the Clays/Claydot issue, and the "don't buy from Hodgdon because their powder isn't made in the USA" issue though.

    I know some of the Hodgdon family members and some of their employees personally. Ron Reiber shoots at our club. I taught hunter education to Chris Hodgdon's son.

    Yes, Clays is made in Australia (by a company that, by the way, also makes ground support vehicles for the US Armed Forces.) Some of Hodgdon's products are made by other contractors in the USA, like Titewad and Titegroup (General Dynamics.) Some are made in Canada.

    Hodgdon makes some of their own products (Pyrodex) here in Herington, Kansas.

    Hodgdon is a 3rd generation (American) family owned business, and they probably employ 60 people here in Kansas. Their only product is canister powders. Hodgdon gives thousands and thousands of dollars and merchandise every year to the NRA, National Shooting Sports Foundation, SCI, 4-H, Boy Scouts of America, and many more organizations to help preserve our right to own a firearm. One of the Hodgdon family members served on the NRA BOD.

    Alliant is a multibillion dollar company, military contractor, and they employ thousands of people around the world. Their canister powder business is a VERY small portion of what they do.

    For Alliant to copy Hodgdon's product, and market it under a strikingly familiar name, to me, is like Goliath going after David. I think it kind of stinks.
     
  14. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    Much ado about nothing....
     
  15. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    Instead of pissing on someone else's leg, I'll agree with EE's first post. Go to Alliant themselves and look for a load that suits your needs. There are a lot of differences in the data between Clays and Clay Dot, so get your data from the same source as your powder. I also don't recommend Either powder for anything much heavier than 2 3/4 dram 1 1/8 ounce loads, except in straight walled hulls like the Federal Gold Medals. They are BOTH great powders for 7/8 and 1 ounce target loads, plus lighter 1 1/8 ounce in tapered hulls. Main reason for the limitations is higher pressures. I look for a load that stays in the four figures. Anything over 10,000 PSI or 9500 LUPs isn't needed and could be a potential hazard. Mash the link above or go to http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/index.aspx
     
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