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HELP--- 366 buckeling AA hulls---

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by BigM-Perazzi, May 13, 2008.

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  1. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    need more info. Wad, powder and chg, shot weight. For starters make sure the star crimp is smaller than a pencil eraser before final crimp.
     
  2. WarEagle2017

    WarEagle2017 Active Member

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    The new AA cases have a differant base wad than the old AA's and the 366 has a primer removal ram ( at the resizing station ) that is slightly fatter than the hole that is in that base wad,,, so now with that said when you deprime the case, on the way back up it sometimes pulls the wad loose and upward ( I had one come completly out on the ram ) and then it does not seat right when you put the components in it and it buckles, My solution was to stop using the AA's in my 366, I also have a Mec Grabber and they seem to load better in the Grabber although I did have one out of maybe 2000 buckle, the old AA's did not have a seperate base wad and they worked real good, they were made with the base wad as part of the case, I have been letting My new AA's FLY.
     
  3. Tony Jones

    Tony Jones TS Member

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    Actually it has to do with a change in the thickness of the plastic that Winchester uses in its new hulls. Spoke with Hornady shortly after Winchester changed AA hulls and I was having same problems. They have designed a new crimp station die to address this issue. Call Hornady and explain problem to them and they will send you the correct crimp die. Completely solved my problems with crushing...can now even reload hulls that were previously crushed without problems...Just like anything, a small change from a manufacturer can impact all processes that utilize their product. Took Hornady a short time to make the changes required to allow these hulls to be reloaded properly.

    Tony J
     
  4. esoxhunter

    esoxhunter Well-Known Member

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    I experienced the same problem on a 366, a P/W 900 and a MEC Grabber. I solved the problem by throwing all the AA hulls in the dump. In the last 3 years I have used nothing but STS and Gun Club hulls. Have never had a problem since. Ed
     
  5. 682Fan

    682Fan TS Member

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    Tony J is correct.
    I had precisely same experience with my 366, except I didn't think to call the factory. I switched to STS and gun club hulls.
    Arnie
     
  6. 682b

    682b Member

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    The new crimp die is the final answer to that problem. You should also consider a spring loaded primer seater. This will allow you to prime any case without having to reset the primer seating tube. This was the best 24.95 I have spent.
    http://www.basicdesignmachine.com/products.asp
     
  7. WarEagle2017

    WarEagle2017 Active Member

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    Well My final answer is not to reload AA's If I have to buy something else to make their Hulls work they can keep their AA,s I will do as the other guys above stated Use STS, Nitros, or evem Gun clubs
     
  8. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    There are several things you might do to fix the problem. Here are some things you could try.

    1. Use a powder that is less bulky or use less of current powder.

    2. Reduce the shot charge by about 18 to 20 grains.

    3. Try a different wad, perhaps one with a larger shot cup and shorter legs.

    4. Increase the wad seating pressure.

    5. Decrease the depth of the crimp.

    I've loaded all kinds of AA hulls with my 366 and never had a problem.
     
  9. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Easy's got it right. The basic problem is a case head that is not enclosed by a die. The best, most expensive alternative, is to buy a Spolar. They load anything!!
     
  10. Jeff P

    Jeff P Well-Known Member

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    The new crimp die, without the .005" taper, will solve your problem. You will have to adjust your start crimp a bit - you want an opening about the size of a pencil.

    I load them without any problem.
     
  11. Jeff P

    Jeff P Well-Known Member

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    I should add that when the hulls get old - say 5 or 6 loadings on them - I find they'll buckle there anyway. I watch them coming off the press and when i get a wrinkled one I set it aside. When I get 25 or 50 of those, I shoot them for a practice round and toss the hulls.

    if you put a wrinkled hull in the gun, it will shoot the wrinkles out, but if you don't toss it, it will wrinkle again next time you load it. So I decide BEFORE I put the shell in the gun if I'm tossing it or not.

    And hornady service is great, isn't it? They updated a 25 year old press I bought used for free - I called to order all the parts, expecting to pay. Nope. Warranty upgrade.

    I have 3 of them now (12,20,28) and I'll never buy another press - these will never wear out, LOL.
     
  12. todd farris

    todd farris TS Member

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    I bought the crimper and still had some probs. I found by changing from the Claybuster wads to a PC wad solved my problem. Not to say anything wrong with Claybuster, it is just what worked for me.

    Todd
     
  13. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Use the orange Winchester wad. It is slippery and slides past the lip on the inside of the new AA hulls. Also use Win. powder, it has the correct volume for the hull. HMB
     
  14. AveragEd

    AveragEd Well-Known Member

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    I've received a LOT of reader mail about this problem. I have absolutely no first-hand experience with AAs but the majority of those who wrote me about hull buckling with new-style AAs solved the problem by either seating the wad with greater pressure to get it past the upper edge of the base wad (which is a Winchester recommendation but doesn't sound like a good solution because doing so can cause other problems) or just using another brand of hull (which really doesn't correct the problem).

    You'd think that Winchester would want to fix this problem themselves because they have to have received a bunch of mail and telephone calls about it. Of course, they may respond to those requests for assistance in the same manner as the ones they are receiving about their poorly made rifle brass.

    Ed
     
  15. esoxhunter

    esoxhunter Well-Known Member

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    Again, the only sure fire solution to this annoying problem is to avoid reloading AA hulls. It's a very simple remedy. Many years ago, I used AA hulls for reloading and they were great. Todays AA hulls fail miserably when it comes to reloading. Ed
     
  16. Magnumshot16

    Magnumshot16 TS Member

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    I was wondering who you talked to.I called today and was told there was no new die
    for the 366.

    Mike
     
  17. wolfee

    wolfee TS Member

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    I have the same problem with my Pacific. I am going to do two things:
    1) Start using a MEC 9000
    2) Stop reloading AA's
    The second is due to all that I have read here, and it isn't worth hurting myself or others, and also not blowing up my new Guerini.
    wolfee
     
  18. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    atraphead,

    According to my reloading guide, you are loading ABOVE recommended pressures in your load. If you are using Win AA hulls, Win 209 primers, 18.1 grains 700X, a WAA12 wad, and 1 1/8 ounce of shot, then that's too much. The max amount of 700X powder to use with that load is 17.5 grains of powder.

    I'm referring to a Handloaders Guide from IMR dated January 1997. You might want to double check that load you are using.

    Easystreet
     
  19. Bvr Tail

    Bvr Tail Well-Known Member

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    I also had lots of super-handicap hulls, and was having the same problems on my 366. About three years ago, I spoke to Hornaday rep. at the grand. He also gave me a free new-style final crimp die, so I bought the new primer drop, but when I asked what wad they were using on their test machines they had set up, he said Remington figure-8. He said these would seat better into the AA's, and eliminate the kink in the hull.

    He was right! But, I still sold all of them and now only load Remington hulls.

    Danny
     
  20. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    Atraphead,

    Any reply to my comment about your recipe being an "overload"? Do you have a reputable reloading source saying that your load is safe, or do you just not care?

    Easystreet
     
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