1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

Grand Slam Data

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Pocatello, Feb 4, 2009.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,547
    Yesterday I received my copy of the February Trap & Field. In the back is the list of all Grand Slams completed through October 2008. It makes fascinating reading for me, and perhaps others here. For those not in the know, a Grand Slam is a career accomplishment consisting of 200x200 registered singles in a race of that length, 100x100 registered doubles, and 100x100 registered handicap shot from 27 yards. On the list there are 401 names, from Dan Orlich (NV), the first, to Jennifer Wilburn (CA), the most recent. I've seen a couple of other threads here recently congratulating some others this year, so I'm sure the list will continue to grow.

    I've not come close to accomplishing any of the three feats. My best singles is 198x200, best doubles 96x100, and best from 27 is 95x100, so I have tremendous admiration for those who have completed a Grand Slam, many of them multiple times. I was surprised about how many of those people I know or have met, quite a few I'm on a first-name basis with, and even more than a few who are frequent contributors on this forum.

    I encourage you to look at this list, dig out your own nuggets of interesting information, and post them here. Here are a few I've found:

    From the first Grand Slam completed July 30, 1964, to the most recent completed October 3, 2008, the numbers completed by year were:

    1964 - 1

    1965 - 1

    1966 - 1

    1968 - 1

    1969 - 2

    1972 - 1

    1973 - 1

    1975 - 1

    1976 - 7

    1977 - 1

    1978 - 3

    1979 - 6

    1980 - 2

    1981 - 5

    1982 - 3

    1983 - 4

    1984 - 7

    1985 - 3

    1986 - 5

    1987 - 5

    1988 - 7

    1989 - 13

    1990 - 16

    1991 - 16

    1992 - 11

    1993 - 21

    1994 - 18

    1995 - 17

    1996 - 14

    1997 - 20

    1998 - 17

    1999 - 15

    2000 - 19

    2001 - 20

    2002 - 20

    2003 - 17

    2004 - 11

    2005 - 14

    2006 - 16

    2007 - 22

    2008 - 17

    Own own Jerry Hauser, who was the 13th to accomplish a Grand Slam back in 1976, will doubtless be able to add some interesting comments on the effect of the transition from three-hole to two-hole targets.

    As one might expect, the time of year has a great deal to do with one's ability to complete a Grand Slam. Of the 401 accomplished through 2008, 6 were completed in January, 11 each in February, March, and April, 43 in May, 74 in June, 99 in July, 82 in August, 41 in September, 13 in October, 6 in November, and 4 in December.

    Also there is a lot of grist in studying the State of residence of a shooter when completing the Grand Slam (as far as arguing whether western targets are easier, western shooters are better, etc.). Of those 401 Grand Slams, 47 were by California shooters, 31 from Utah, 29 from Texas, 24 from Colorado, 18 from Kansas, 17 from Ohio, 15 each from Arizona and Illinois, 13 each from Iowa, Kentucky, and Missouri, 12 each from Nebraska and Washington, 11 each from Idaho and Indiana, 10 each from Nevada and Wisconsin, 9 from Minnesota, 8 from New Mexico, 7 each from Oklahoma and Pennsylvania, 6 each from Maryland and Wyoming, 5 from Montana, 4 each from Alberta, Florida, New Jersey, New York, Oregon, South Dakota, and Tennessee, 3 each from Michigan, Ontario, and Virginia, 2 each from North Dakota, Vermont, and West Virginia, and 1 each from Alaska, Alabama, Delaware, Georgia, Manitoba, Massachusetts, Mississippi, New Hampshire, and South Carolina. The other States and Provinces have none. It could get really interesting if we factored in the number of ATA shooters or targets shot per State.

    Finally, 272 of the Grand Slams were completed in handicap, 95 in doubles, 31 in singles, two in handicap and doubles on the same day, and one by breaking 200 singles and 100 handicap on the same day.

    I urge you to examine the list and pitch in with your own observations. I find this much more interesting than endless discussions on chokes, shot size, or even politics.

    Enjoy.
     
  2. Dove Commander

    Dove Commander TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,364
    Very interesting. Thanks Pocatello
     
  3. Kent

    Kent TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    157
    It is a great achievement in our sport to complete the Grand Slam. How many of our past great shooters that could have made this list if the 27 yard line existed prior to 1964.

    I have had the privilege to know and occasionally be squaded with many that have made this list.

    The fact, that as you point out at the end of your post that not all Grand Slams were accomplished not from the 27 yard line but 95 in doubles and 31 in singles is very interesting. I keep trying every time I go to a shoot to get on that list but still as yet have fallen short. However, I did get two legs of the slam before I reached the 27 yard line.

    An interesting fact to know would be how many of the Grand Slams were completed at a Grand American tournement?
     
  4. otnot

    otnot Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,426
    What changed in 1989 to allow the numbers to double?
     
  5. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,547
    As I said, I too know a fair number on the list, have squadded with some, and even was the squad leader on the day Robert Green (UT) completed his by breaking 100 from 27 at Pocatello. I think he started on post 4.

    From the dates I'd guess that a few Slams were completed at the Grand. Perhaps someone who saves their copies of Trap & Field could research that. I take mine out to the club so others can read them.

    What changed in 1989? I hope Jerry Hauser will see fit to weigh in. I think I know what his view is, but he should give it.
     
  6. The Kissable Wanker

    The Kissable Wanker TS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2007
    Messages:
    61
    Is that the year that the majority of clubs, and major shoots, stopped following the rules? Such a significant, at least significant to me, change in one year, nearly double, says that something changed that year or a few years earlier. It's been pretty well constant, a few higher and some lower, since then.
     
  7. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,209
    Location:
    Scottsdale, AZ
    The reasons.

    1. The bar got raised. With the advent of 2 hole targets coming out of the west and shooters like Ray Stafford, Dan Bonillas and the like to shoot them, the bar was raised. It happened before '89 and took a while for the 2 holer to creep eastward. It became a "mind-set" that it could be done and would have to be done to be competetive. Happens in all sports. Look at track and the old four minute mile barrier.

    2. Since the bar was raised and the targets got easier there were and are many great shooters across the membership that are more than capable of doing it just did.

    3. Technology. Easier targets, better guns, better target presentation, eyewear and instruction availability. But most of all. Electronic target release. Mike Jordan said, "we all just got one step closer to Leo." I believe this and 2 holers are the biggest reasons for the increase in Grand Slams.

    4. Natural human need to reach the highest bar. Again, happens in all sports.
     
  8. Hauser

    Hauser Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    860
    The principal reason for the increase in the number of Grand Slams was the un-official transition to the 2-hole target that took place beginning in the late 70s and ending with the official change to the 2-hole target in the mid 90s.


    Over lay handicap averages, the number of non-27 yard shooters making the high handicap average list, or the Grand Slam list by year as Pocatello did and the answer is the same, the ATA changed the game by making the targets easier to hit.


    Jerry Hauser
     
  9. Kent

    Kent TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    157
    Hello Barry, you are on my list of Grand Slammers' that I have shot with.. I was at Brittany when you shot yours at The Illinois State Shoot. I was very envious of the gold Illinois pin you got that day. Yes maybe 3 hole versus 2 hole has an effect but still, why hasn't everyone got their grand slam with 2 hole? Hope your enjoyiin Arizona, and will see you in the sprin.
     
  10. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,209
    Location:
    Scottsdale, AZ
    See you soon, Kent.
     
  11. KENENT1

    KENENT1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,393
    Location:
    Beloit, WI
    How many were shot with #8's and how many with #7.5's????????



    tony
     
  12. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,209
    Location:
    Scottsdale, AZ
    All of them.
     
  13. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,226
    Location:
    Mesquite, Nevada
    Killian's Red, FWIW, the max of 27 yards came to be in 1955. The AA one piece wad came to be around 1965 and changed loading drastically also coupled with harder shot at about the same time frame!

    1976 was a magical beginning of great scores shot by great shooters. Very interesting stats which happened to be the first thing I read as my copy flopped open to that page when I picked it up!!

    Hap
     
  14. racer

    racer TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    541
    Pocatello- this is very interesting data, nice work. I'm especially excited because the data suggests I'm 3 times more likely to shoot the grand slam living in Utah(31) than Wisconsin(10). See you this summer,Dan
     
  15. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,547
    Dan, if I remember correctly, you are moving to the Ogden area. Some of the locals around there seem to dislike Spanish Fork - maybe it is because Spanish Fork seems to have a monopoly on the Utah State Shoot. Whatever. Be sure to take the opportunity to shoot there - great targets, great people, and an incredible blue sky background that must be seen to be believed. If you can't break a good score at Spanish Fork, there's no hope for you. But be aware a lot of other people will be breaking good scores there too.

    Be sure to come up to Pocatello and introduce yourself when you get to Utah. We can break some scores here too.

    Larry
     
  16. racer

    racer TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    541
    Pocatello- looks like I won't transfer your way until after the Idaho State Shoot. So you guys got one more year.....!!! Dan
     
  17. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,547
    Just in the interest of keeping the thread going, how about TS.com participants who have accomplished the slam? I'm sure I'm missing some, mainly because many use handles and don't use their real names, others because my memory is faulty, but I see:

    #13 Jerry Hauser

    #16 Steve Carmichael (LV Gun Club?)

    #17 Brad Dysinger

    #41 Neal Crausby (I'm not sure about this one - faulty memory)

    #43 Phil Kiner

    #52 Jimmy Borum

    #86 Frank Hoppe (Quickshot)

    #221 Richard Marshall Jr

    #252 Greg Hissem (Stockguy)

    #281 Barry Kemper

    #309 Alex Ragulsky

    #310 Derek Stringer

    #390 Martin Wilbur (Pheasantmaster)

    #393 Steve Taylor (SteveT)

    How about corrections/additions?
     
  18. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,226
    Location:
    Mesquite, Nevada
    Larry, Tom Strunk, AZ-#50 on the list and completed his in 85. He posts here often.

    Hap
     
  19. wanderer

    wanderer Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    523
    # 137 Gary E.Gasaway
     
  20. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    # to be determined- Pat Ireland (all I need is the 100 doubles and handicap)

    Pat Ireland
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.