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Fox news on WRSC

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by jrb, Jun 20, 2011.

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  1. jrb

    jrb Member

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    I will upload the video link when it gets put on website. Fox2 out of St. Louis has a segment called "You paid for it". They went to Sparta and Springfield harrasing them about all the taxpayer money spent on the complex.

    They are actually blaming Blagojevich for getting the complex built and losing $1 million a year they say. Hmmm---a Chicago Democrat building a shooting range?

    Of course they did not mention the economic boom Southern Illinois gets, or even St. Louis. What a bunch of idiots...especially Elliot Davis!!!

    Hopefully we can band together and keep this range...I know it's not Vandalia to many but it's still a part of us gun-owning trapshooters who have a voice.

    A Conservative Fox network is showing this---what's next!

    Thanks

    J.R. Brock
    ( Grew up in Illinois but live in Missouri now)
     
  2. Bisi

    Bisi TS Member

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    I've been to Sparta and love the complex, but should taxpayers really be paying for a trap range?
     
  3. Orange Irish

    Orange Irish TS Member

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    I saw the coverage also. What a crock! I believe the man from the "Illinois Policy Institute" slipped up when he stated that "they" do not believe that the State of Illinois should be in the business of running a shooting range. Bet the policy people are all from Chicago. Also they tried to drag Blaggo into it. This facility was planned before he came along. It just goes to show, the news only covers half the story.
     
  4. jrb

    jrb Member

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    Orange...it's generating money for an area that could use an economic boom. There's more people in Illinois than Chicago. The people in Southern Illinois could use some much needed influx of money. Therefore the tax money is helping these people of the area not being funneled to Chicago.
     
  5. Orange Irish

    Orange Irish TS Member

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    jrb

    I believe you misunderstood my comment. It seemed to me that the IPI has a political agenda. I believe that their representative on the news alluded to that when he made the statement that they did not think that the state should be in the business of running a shooting range. Seems to me that they got a problem with the shooting sports.
    As you pointed out the WSRC provides a much needed economic bost to the area. What was not pointed out in the story is the fact that the WSRC is a public facility. Virtually all public facilities lose money. They are not meant to make money, but to provide recreation, and increase the local tax base.
     
  6. jrb

    jrb Member

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    I understand Orange! Fox2 did not give all the information but just a sensationalized 2 minuts. Elliot Davis and his segment " You paid for it" is all about sensationalism. While some of his stories blow your mind--others just want me to tell him " get over yourself"

    You are right Rich...we finance sports arena...this is a sport arena that benefits others. We need to somehow make it easier for people to visit and shoot the Grand. Need more lodging and food but is tough for businesses to keep doors open when we are only there 2 weeks a year.
     
  7. colonel klink

    colonel klink Active Member

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    Here we go again. While it is true the WSRC was built to entice the Grand American & the ATA to come to Sparta it is not the only purpose of the facility. The facility is listed as a State Park & does have fishing & camping year round. It also holds pistol, SAS, Sporting Clays & Skeet events throughout the year. If you seen all the money the State of Illinois throws at E. St. Louis you wouldn't believe it. You could run Sparta for years on what that city costs us in one year. That town is & will always be a corrupt hole. I do understand views from every side but it does generate revenue for the area & that is important also. JMO
    Colonel
     
  8. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    It would be interesting to find out just how much actual generated revenue the area takes in compared to say Dayton and the general area when the Grand was in Vandalia ... The lesser amount of shooters and their familys cannot possibly generate as much as when the number of shooter were much higher in Ohio ... Its only a matter of time before some Political Genius wants to make a name for him of her self at the expense of the WSRC ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  9. 3200REM

    3200REM TS Member

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  10. Bluzman98

    Bluzman98 Member

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    If it is true that the complex is losing $1 MM per year, how is this generating money or an economic boom? That's like saying the only way to avoid bankruptcy is to keep spending money......oh wait a minute, that's our current administration's economic recovery plan. This must be some type of "Illinois Economic Theory".

    JMHO

    Jim C
     
  11. V10

    V10 Well-Known Member

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    Jim,

    The facility itself requires approximately $2.5 Million to operate, but it has income of approximately $1.5 Million. Thus a loss of $1 Million.

    However, the people who visit the facility spend money in the surrounding area which they would not do if the WSRC was not there, and that's the economic impact that amounts to approximately $25 Million for the area.

    I spend approximately $3,000 in the area when I go to the Grand. Only about $70 of that goes to the IDNR.
     
  12. perga1

    perga1 Active Member

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    All it takes to close the facility is a vote by the state legislature and a signature by the Gov. The ATA just extended the lease by 10 years but it could all end tomorrow if that is the whim of the legislature. It is never good to get in bed with the government. After all it was a government entity that drove the ATA out of Ohio. Just sayin. JRM
     
  13. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    V10,

    If 5,000 people go there and each one spends as much as you do ($3,000), which probably isn't going to happen that would add up to a hell of a lot less than $25 million dollars ... They have yet to have 5,000 entries on an one event in Sparta so I would have to say the numbers you present are grossly over inflated at best ... It is also spread out over a broader area than it was in Vandalia so to compile the numbers over all would be some what difficult if not vertually impossible ...
    The attendance keeps dropping so the revenue cannot increase based solely on the shooters ... The State of Illinois was mislead into believeing inflated numbers (100,000 entries) which is probably why they took on the task of building the WSRC in the first place ... The State was anticipating a Gold Mine and all they got was a continuation of the Peabody Coal Mine instead ... If you look at the entire schedule for the year they do not use it 1/2 the time but pay for it all the time which makes it a loser at that rate ... If you spend more than you take in you cannot turn a profit and sooner or later that can only have a negative impact on a business and its existance ... The fact is the bottom line does matter and its not there ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  14. slick50

    slick50 Member

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    Be careful what you believe when the State reports operational losses. There is probabaly a ton of state accounting rules and practices in that figure. i would like to see the expense sheet. That would explain all expenses. I would predict the state is also using the facility revenues to fund services from other state departments that may be related to the facility at Sparta. This does not even account for depreciation of the facility and equipment. When the State owns and runs a facility you may be suprised how the accounting works and how it is calculated. I'm woundering how many other State of Illinois facilities make a profit over expenses???? Profit in any government run operation is extremely rare.....
     
  15. V10

    V10 Well-Known Member

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    Actually, Bill, the IDNR indicated that they have approximately 220 shoot days on their schedule.

    I never said that the Grand provided the $25 Million to the surrounding community. That money comes from all of the shoots and activities that they have at the WSRC through out the year.
     
  16. Bluzman98

    Bluzman98 Member

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    V10

    Are you saying you spend $3,000 locally (exclusive of shooting expenses) or for your total out of pocket expense to attend the Grand? If the latter is the case, less than half of your spending would benefit the area.

    Seeing that I grew up in St. Louis and am familiar with the Sparta area, I would find it difficult to spend $3,000 on hotel, food, and incidentals in Sparta even if I attended the entire Grand. Also, most participants do not attend every day of the Grand.

    Also, other than a few "major" events shot there, what is the average daily attendance for the remaining shoot days?

    I don't care how anyone views it, you can't lose money and cause an economic boom. In this case it simply is robbing Peter to pay Paul (tax others outside the area to make up for the shortfall). A loss is a loss no matter what.

    Like I said before, it's like the belief that one can spend their way out of bankruptcy....not going to happen.

    JMHO

    Jim C
     
  17. mollyone

    mollyone TS Member

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    Some of you people make good Monday morning quarter backs



    park
     
  18. daddiooo

    daddiooo TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    EVERY baseball and football stadium in the US is funded in part by taxpayers money. ALL state parks are funded in part by taxpayers money. ALL national parks are funded in part by taxpayers money. I attend NONE of these sites yet MY money goes into the pot to support these. Ever consider that maybe the reason the WRSC is losing money is because politicians are diverting money to their pet projects. It's real easy to report operating losses after everybody has had their hand in the cookie jar and you tally up whats left.

    Liars, cheats and theives won't let you get an honest answer. This is different how??
     
  19. V10

    V10 Well-Known Member

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    Jim,

    The $3,000 includes shoot fees, lodging, gas, and food expenses at the Grand. Could be a little more, or less, but it's right around that number. I spend about $1,400 just for the hotel in Fairview Heights.
     
  20. edgarmcmr

    edgarmcmr TS Member

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    If you want to see a real financial government disaster just take a look at the Mid-America Airport at the junction of Illinois Route 4 and Interstate 64. That disaster was featured on the TV program Fleecing of America. There is no airline service there. It was built with the idea of releaving the St.Louis Lambert Airport. It never happened.
     
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