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forcing cones lengthened yes or maybe

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by acss, Oct 12, 2009.

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  1. acss

    acss Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    on a factory bore bt99- having the forcing cone lengthened only- how much felt recoil is reduced? if any?
     
  2. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    There's no reason changing a forcing cone should change recoil unless shot-speed changes as a result of the cone modification.

    Neil
     
  3. Scoutman 06

    Scoutman 06 Member

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    I had the forcing cone lengthened on my BT-99 & I could not tell any difference in felt recoil. John
     
  4. Sigraph

    Sigraph TS Member

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    Don't know about the BT-99, but it made a heck of a difference on my 1100 trap gun. Stock, it shot NICE, after porting I think I could tell a difference, but after I lengthened the forcing cone, I could really tell a difference.
     
  5. TEXASZEPHYR

    TEXASZEPHYR Member

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    I lengthened forcing cones in my older bt and noticed better patterns than before. I didn't notice any difference in recoil. forcing cones longer = less shot deformation
    ymmv

    Bob
     
  6. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    I have had the forcing cones in all three of my K-80 barrels lengthened. I am absolutely convinced that I did not hurt anything by having this work done.

    Pat Ireland
     
  7. acss

    acss Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    i think you saved me $- but heck , i just blow it on something else!! thanks
     
  8. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    I think you need to be mindful of what you're trying to do.. Blindly doing modifications to a barrel in the quest for recoil reduction might very well be going in the wrong direction.. On Brownings.. I'd first spend time on the pattern board and see where you are..
    Forcing cones are no part of a recoil equasion..and I must say.. in my younger year I wasted money on that.. and porting..looking for recoil reduction.. The results left only my wallet with less of anything..
    While it could be argued what results are a millimicro second of longer duration..what has less perceived recoil... I would argue certain powders give the same results leaving the barrel intact..

    If the goal it to bring some of the fringe pellets inside the core resulting in a slightly increased pattern density inside a 26" circle.. I agree.. and a few barrels..that was over 4 percent..which to me was alot.. Many were 2 percent or less..which could easily fall in standard deviation..

    I will say this... and many may argue.. The Rhino ported choketube yielded a reduction I could feel.. Any thin choketube.. ported or not yielded nothing..

    This is my .02 cents for today.. I invite your reply.. "Be Nice" Mike
     
  9. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    Respectfully Ron.. What if you already have exactly the pattern you want??? Why change conditions???
     
  10. cmptrwz1

    cmptrwz1 TS Member

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    Frist how old is your Browning if your gun uses invictor plus chokes then the cone have been done already and the barrel has been back bored from the factory this is why thay change the chokes to the larger bore invictor plus choke tubes. In turn the factory has already done the work and there is no need the get the cone done.
     
  11. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    There will be up to a 20% reduction in felt recoil dependant on the load you are using. There will also be a pattern improvement, mainly from a reduction in the number of fliers. You will smoke more birds and you will be happy. HMB
     
  12. Tron

    Tron Supporting Vendor Banned Supporting Vendor

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    IT IMPROVES PATTERNS. Maybe not at 13 yards, but at the kill zone, no doubt that it does.
     
  13. sliverbulletexpress

    sliverbulletexpress TS Member

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    I don't think you can be correct making a blanket statement one way or the other. I believe it is an individual barrel thing. I've had two barrels that were helped by having the forcing cones done, one a mobil choked Beretta 303 that I was having trouble finding a load that patterned well with, and looked like it had lots of forcing cone in it. It shot about any of my regular loads well after the work.

    The other was a 1100 barrel that looked like the factory used a dull masonry bit to cut the factory cones. It would build plastic up way too quick and the patterns were very spotty. Had the same guy cut those cones and it started acting like a good Remington barrel should. No big magic and neither gun recoils enough to notice.
     
  14. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    I've tested before and after twice and found no effect on patterns. One link is above.

    Neil
     
  15. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    First, I know next to nothing about barrel boring. I don't understand the need for forcing cones if you have a choke.

    Am I wrong to compare a column of shot through a forcing cone or a choke to a stream of water traveling through a hose and then a necked down nozzle where the flow increases in speed? When you try to jam all that volume, suddenly, through the nozzle, the water increases in velocity and causes back pressure. Isn't that the same as recoil? In the case of shot through a forcing cone is there enough increase in back pressure or recoil to measure?

    Please educate me.
     
  16. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    I'll add my .02 into this discussion.

    I have had the forcing cones lengthened in a few of my Beretta's (mobile choked and fixed choke). The quality of the breaks did improve (my patterning board) from longer yardage (25yd +), but didn't notice any difference up close (a smoke ball is a smoke ball).

    I did feel a reduction in felt recoil, but it was in the sharpness of the recoil. It made it more like a shove than a kick.

    I have a couple of older Browning fixed choke guns that have shown the same benefits when I had the cones lengthened in them.

    I've not seen any advantages in the newer .740+ bore size guns.

    Just the observations of an ole hillbilly:)

    ss
     
  17. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    What was the original intent or need for a forcing cone in a shotguns barrel? Think of felt and cardboard pushing the mass of shot into the bore with minimal loss of pressure around the entire mass. That load required a short transition (cone) from hull to bore. All modern plastic wads seal the gas pressures much better than felt/cardboard could regardless of cone length.

    With the quality of harder shot in use today, cone length doesn't matter much at all. Modern plastic wads base coupled with load compression will seal all but the most overbored 10 ga. barrels in my view. A botched forcing cone job will create a total nightmare if not cut and polished correctly, I happen to know that first hand!

    Hap
     
  18. acss

    acss Well-Known Member Supporting Vendor

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    all i wanted was a "quick" fix on a lil less recoil? bt99 is a 1979 32" fixed full! it's funny how i can take a barrel cleaning brush and shove down it versus some of our other newer barrels and feel the resistance differance. pattern is in mind but my god , the way this thing smokes rocks , how cud i complain!!!!! thanks
     
  19. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Barry,

    You are right, it is similar to a garden hose. The choke is the nozzle, the forcing cone is a step down from a large hose to a smaller diameter hose(chamber to bore in a shotgun barrel).

    There is enough difference in recoil to measure. Some will say if the payload and velocity remain the same the recoil is the same. They are right, but, the felt recoil is less because of the time factor. HMB
     
  20. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Barry and HMB- Your analogy is not valid. You are looking at a continuous flow of water through the garden hose. Try it with a single column of water that weighs 1 1/8 oz and travels down the hose at a more or less constant speed.

    Pat Ireland
     
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