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** Failure To Fire rules**

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Buster 25, Jun 7, 2010.

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  1. Buster 25

    Buster 25 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2006
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    A couple of question on "FAILURE TO FIRE RULE" came up this weekend.
    I have what I think is a current copy of the ATA rule book.
    However, I could not find anything on the subject
    I would like too find the COMPLETE CORRECT RULES for Singles, & Doubles.
    Thanks for any help rendered.
    Buster
     
  2. MTA Tom

    MTA Tom Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,301
    2010 ATA Rules, Section VII, D. FAILURE TO FIRE

    "The following procedure shall be followed in all tournaments:
    1. A contestant shall be allowed two (2) failures to fire in Singles and
    Handicap events, for any reason other than stated in Paragraph C.,2.
    ... during each sub-event regardless of the length of the sub-event.
    When the first or second allowable Failure to Fire in any sub-event
    occurs, the contestant shall be allowed to call for and fire at another
    target, and the result of the shot will be scored in accordance with
    these Official Rules. During shoot-offs for All Around and High Over All
    events shooters will be allowed 1 Failure to Fire in each of the three (3)
    disciplines (Singles, Handicap, Doubles).

    2. A contestant shall be allowed 2 failures to fire, for any reason other
    than stated in Paragraph C., 2., above, during each Doubles sub-event
    if the Failure to Fire occurs when the contestant attempts to shoot the
    first target of a Doubles pair, or when the contestant attempts to shoot
    the second target of a Doubles pair after the first target has been fired at
    and broken and would have been scored “DEAD”. When the first target
    of a Doubles pair is fired at and missed and that target would be scored
    “LOST”, there shall be no allowable Failure to Fire at the second target.
    (See exception in VII., E., 11., f.) When a pair is ruled lost there shall be
    no “Failure to Fire” charged. When the first or second allowable Failure
    to Fire occurs in any Doubles sub-event, the contestant shall be allowed
    to call for and fire at another pair of targets and the result of the shots at
    the new pair will be scored in accordance with these Official Rules."

    Paragraph C., 2:

    "C. LOST TARGET

    ....2. When a whole target appears promptly after a contestant’s
    recognizable command and is within the legal limits of flight and the
    contestant voluntarily does not fire;...."
     
  3. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Mesquite, Nevada
    Buster, the notion alluded to in the first section sentence rule one, (1) is what's doing the "confusion" most shooters think the rule means.

    1. "A contestant shall be allowed two (2) failures to fire in Singles and Handicap events, for any reason other than stated in Paragraph C.,2."

    The words; "for any reason other than" is whats confusing some without them looking further at the rule at C. 2.

    "C. LOST TARGET

    ....2. When a whole target appears promptly after a contestant’s recognizable command and is within the legal limits of flight and the contestant voluntarily does not fire;...."

    The sticker in this section is the word "voluntarily" does not fire. Score keepers should at this point question shooters as to the reason they didn't fire at a legal target!! Hardly any scorekeepers ask and automatically note the first failure to fire! Some times the shooter himself will make that declaration without an explanation and thats wrong also! I saw the shooter in question make that declaration when that happened yesterday too which led to your questioning this rule. When this was being discussed yesterday, I said you can't turn down a legal target unless theres a reason such as slow,fast, flinch or a broken target emerges! I only said that one time as I didn't want to argue the clear point. Without an appropriate explanation to the scorekeeper, it should be a LOST target!

    Hap
     
  4. Dickgshot

    Dickgshot Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    3,676
    Hap,
    While I agree 100% with your explanation of the rules, I also think it's difficult to give a complete explanation of the shooter's reason for invoking the FTF rule. In the past,( pre-release trigger) I always had one or two flinches and simply called out FTF to the scorer. To attempt a lengthy discussion in the middle of a round between two people 10 to 20 feet away from each other, wearing ear plugs, and most likely one at least partially
    hard of hearing would be very disruptive to the squad.
    If the scorer believes the FTF was incorrect, he can require further explanation.
     
  5. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
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    dickgtax, I agree that on the line isn't the place for shooters to discuss such rules. A heck of a lot of scorekeepers couldn't tell you what the day is let alone whats in the rulebook. (Most shooters can't either?) If I'm scoring the round and a shooter informes me it's a FTF, I will ask him WHY! To me "just because" isn't the correct answer I'm looking for! If the shooter can't explain why he turned down the legal target, he gets a loss for that one, next shooters turn.

    Hap
     
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