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Eye Dominance Issue--Any Optometrists Online?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by BrowningGal, Mar 27, 2008.

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  1. BrowningGal

    BrowningGal TS Member

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    I was shooting sporting clays with my boyfriend this last Saturday, and something very alarming happened. I was shooting his Benelli, and as I was tracking the bird, my sight picture was of the side of the barrel. This hasn't happened in a while.

    Now, I am 100% left handed and left-eye dominant -- been tested many times. But on that day, I caught my right eye taking over (Phil Kiner calls it "crossfiring" in his DVD). This could explain my crappy scores lately.

    I tried the tape thing once back when I thought it was happening last year, and that was incredibly distracting. I also tried shutting the right eye, but it was very hard to pick up the bird and get to it.

    Phil mentions in his DVD trying to strengthen the dominant eye by covering the off-eye with a patch. I'm curious if anybody has tried this and how long it was before you saw results? Any other tricks that might help?
     
  2. Dickgshot

    Dickgshot Well-Known Member

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    If you're are shooting a gun that is stocked very low-like a sporting clays gun might- the rib sometimes disappears behind the back of the receiver. Now, the side of that barrel is the only thing you see out there, and it will attract your opposite eye.
    You should always see some of the rib. On my sporting clays gun I see a lot of the rib and keep the target above the barrel.
     
  3. Capt. Morgan

    Capt. Morgan TS Member

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    I'm not an eye doctor but I spent some time with mine this morning dealing with the issue of changing eye dominance and she made me aware of several things that might be relevant to your situation.

    Most women become cross-eye dominant during their lives, more than men.

    It is very possible for a person to have one eye dominant for things that are near while the other becomes dominant for things that are at a distance (this is the situation I now find myself dealing with now).

    Her assessment of exercises or physical aids to retrain eye dominance is that they don't work for most people (my second question to her) other than to strengthen the muscles of a lazy eye. When one eye is covered, there is no need for the brain to prefer one eye over the other so it does not need to retrain the remaining eye. With both eyes uncovered, the brain will select the eye it wishes to make dominant regardless of how long it was covered.

    Morgan
     
  4. KenC

    KenC Member

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    I'm left eyed and right handed so I shoot trap left-handed and keep both eyes open. Normally I don't have any problems but I have had my right eye take over on occasion and it was caused by trying to shoot the bird before I actually saw it. It also caused me to have a 'knee buckling' flinch.

    I had been shooting some real good handicap over the previous couple weeks. I was very confident but I must have sub-conscientiously started trying to break them sooner than I was used to. Before I knew it I was shooting 84s instead of 94's.

    My friend, Greg Kaup was watching me struggle. When I was done with that trap he told me that I was trying to break them much faster than I normally did. The next trap I slowed way down and didn't move the gun til I had the target path. I'd like to say that I ran that house but I only had a 24 but now I knew the cause of the problem.

    Try waiting til you see the flight path before moving the gun.
     
  5. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    Go to the tape. I tried the eye patch and it didn't help my shooting but my swashbuckling improved dramatically.
     
  6. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    BrowningGal- First, you stated that you are totally left handed 9= left side dominance). It is very rare to find a person who has one side that is completely dominant (hand, eye, foot, brain). Most left handed or right handed people would be something like a little less than 90% left/10% right dominance. Years ago, in a test, I scored 65% right handed and 35% left handed. I am sure with a little effort and a few books, you could come up with a better, or at least a more modern test, than I took in 1970. Try a Neuro-Psychology book or a basic Neurology book.

    Phil Kiner has studied this more, in relation to trapshooting, than others. His articles in Trap and Field are wort reviewing. I would not suggest putting tape over one of your lenses, as I do, unless the problem becomes more frequent.

    For a right handed shooter, the problem is most common on birds that go to the left. The opposite would be the case for you. If your left hand birds look good but just as you pull the trigger, they seem to disappear and all you see it your front sight, you are cross firing.

    Pat Ireland
     
  7. Joe O

    Joe O Member

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    BrowninGal; I use the Magic Dot very successfully. Actually I now use a piece of Scotch tape. In just the right spot it only blocks my vision of the bird as it is lined up to shoot. I shoot trap only in a league setting(Doubles and Hcps) my preferred game is Sporting and FITASC. Here we deal with every conceivable angle and speed and I don't find the dot the least bit distracting. I was a one eyed shooter until one evening shooting Doubles with Pat Laib (a better than average doubles shooter from MN) who uses the dot and he helped me set it up. Since that time I jumped from A class to Master and even managed a couple of spots on the Allstate team in Sporting. Make sure the dot is properly placed! Oh and taking lessons from Dan Schindler and Dan Carlisle I asked them their opinion and ther only response was if it gives me the clearist sight picture go ahead. They would all prefer we use two eyes( I have tried it numerous times) But eventually that left eye messes me up!
    Joe O
     
  8. BrowningGal

    BrowningGal TS Member

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    Dickgtax, yes, the stock is very low on Mario's Benelli. It's definitely a sporting gun. I do remember trying to stock the gun lower on my cheek to try to get some more height when I pressed down tight on the comb. It worked some of the time.

    Pat, you're right in that I'm not 100% left-handed. In actuality, I'm quite ambidextrous. I can even write with either hand. However, with shotguns, I do test left eye dominant, and I've never shot any way other than left handed. The birds I'm missing are my wide angles, but I don't ever recall seeing the bead as I was shooting or having the bird disappear on me as I'm about to shoot. Mostly, I recall thinking I have a good sight picture, pulling the trigger, and then seeing the bird fly on its merry way. Maybe I'm not cross firing?

    Kenc, your post is hitting a note. Lately, I have indeed been working on trying to break the bird sooner. I'm going to the club after work today. I'll have Mario stand behind me and evaluate what I'm doing. In the meantime, I'll spend my lunch hour with my Terry Jordan wall chart and work on my swing.

    Thanks all! The breadth of knowledge on this board and the willingness to help another never ceases to amaze me. Hopefully I can work this out in time to post good scores at the SW Grand. If you see a tall redhead pushing a red Rugged Gear cart full of Brownings, stop and say "HI".

    --BrowningGal (Jeri Brock)
     
  9. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

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    BrowningGal,

    Yes, you can strengthen or change eye-dominance. There are two "simple" methods to do so. One uses filters (i.e., an optical 'trick') for reading and writing, while the other uses prisms to split the visual fields of the two eyes far enough apart that different information can be fed into them at the same time.

    Unlike patching this allows for continued visual input to both hemispheres of the brain (both eyes), thus the brain is 'forced' to rely on the eye providing the higher quality image/information. Repeated use of this essentially strengthens the reliance on the selected eye.

    I have WAY over-simplified this...

    If you'd like more information please feel free to be in touch.

    David D
     
  10. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    You need to retrain your brain. I found the easiest way to do this is on the trap field. The next time you shoot a round of trap shoot the first bird with your right eye closed. Shoot the next bird with both eyes open. Keep alternating til the round is done. It is best if you do this from station 3 with the machine lockked on straight aways. This drill helps clear the neural pathway from your brain to your left eye and helps maintain dominance. HMB
     
  11. Phil Kiner

    Phil Kiner Well-Known Member

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    BrowningGal (BG)- first and this is not meant to disrespect the optometric profession but very few of them will be able to give you any really good advice. They are not shooters and most don’t truly understand what happens when the ole shotgun is on the shoulder and your head is on the stock.

    My eye doc is past president of the AOA sports vision section and I have been trying for years to get them to do further analysis of what happens and why. She and some of her friends have a little better understanding than most but they still have not been able figure the why of what happens. One interesting piece of trivia – they have decided that about the only time dominance is an issue is for the shooting sports i.e. play golf or bball with no problem and then mount a shotgun and it shows up.

    Secondly there is no one answer to your problem, every one of us is different and will end up finding a different solution. Then there are those that in many cases end up ignoring the solution/problem and shooting bad and then eventually quitting.

    BG-- I would bet a crisp 100 dollar bill that you are in fact cross firing and I don’t care how dominate you test – since you are female the odds are against you.

    If you wish to talk to me send me an email pkinerATphilkinerDOTCOM and I will send you my cell number. phil
     
  12. idoc

    idoc Member

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    Browning Gal,

    Call me at the office..............860-668-0266. Rich
     
  13. corkey\rufus

    corkey\rufus TS Member

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  14. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    Phil,

    What is your opinion about shooters occasionally losing eye dominance because of eye fatigue? Is it more prevalent than people suspect? Also, if occasional loss of dominace is far more prevalent than people suspect, would it create less of a problem at 16 than at 27 and would a shooter get away with it if by luck it happened on particular target presentations as opposed to others?

    Thanks
     
  15. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    BrowningGal- I could offer some more advice, but you have an offer from Phil Kiner and eye-doc. Call them, pay attention and good luck. They will give you some of the very best advice available. Pay scant attention to the rest of us.

    Pat Ireland
     
  16. corkey\rufus

    corkey\rufus TS Member

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  17. corkey\rufus

    corkey\rufus TS Member

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  18. N. J. BOB

    N. J. BOB Active Member

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    Have you tried a sight blinder on the end of your barrel ??? It works for me.It is and $18.00 fix.
     
  19. corkey\rufus

    corkey\rufus TS Member

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  20. 682b

    682b Member

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    I posted this information on vinyl dots on another thread and thought it might have some value here . If you are looking for color dots made of vinyl here is you supplier at 7.00 per 1000 you cannot go wrong. Captain Morgan and any one else who needs a color dot Avery sells vinyl color dots. They are 3/4" and the ones I am looking at are called "See Through Color Dots - Rainbow Pack - Removable" The Avery # is 05473 The toll free phone number is 1-800-GO-AVERY The rainbow colors are red, green, blue and yellow. Good luck They work for me. JIM
     
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