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Experiance buying a shotgun in Italy?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by mike-israel, Nov 15, 2009.

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  1. mike-israel

    mike-israel TS Member

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    Thinking of getting a new Bunker gun.

    My direction would be to fly to Brescia and get a shotgun there --the great plus would of course getting the gun fitted at the factory...with the posiability of getting nice wood and a proper fit at sourse. Also shooting with the shotgun a week or more at the great ranges there--i.e. Lonato ,and others.
    I know that at the Perazzi factory they have their own dedicated range for fitting.

    HAS ANYONE DONE THIS.....Lots of knowlegable people on trapshooters who may have done just this or know about the ins and outs as to paperwork involved.

    ALSO I had a number of years a go found a few gunshops in the Brescia area who work with selling towards export.. But for the love of Mike (hows that) can't find any shops --maybe someone can pass on to me addresses ,urls or ideas where to look.

    Any and all info appreciated --if you wish PM or email or the best would be a reply on this thread as am sure others would be inteested in any experiances had by others.

    Best to all-----MIKE
     
  2. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

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    Mike,

    Not to burst your bubble, but I believe your thinking is a bit off here - in Gardone/val Trompe (just north of Brescia) there are DOZENS of manufacturers.

    The big ones you know, but there are many others, as well as specialized shops (e.g., custom wood or barrels only).

    I would suggest you create a 'short list' before heading over - in addition you would be better off making appointments to be seen in each of those factories.

    FYI the cost you will pay for the gun will likely be HIGHER than what you could find it for in the USA (they don't discount guns in Italy). Add to that the shipping and handling costs of getting the gun to the USA - which will be several hundred dollars - and the cost may be more than you'd expect.

    That being said, the people of Brescia are wonderful - the city is spectacular and the factories typically offer some of the best hospitality in Italy.

    If you are serious about this venture please feel free to be in touch and I can give you some good contacts who should be able to help you.

    David Delacato (drop the X's)
     
  3. over the hill

    over the hill Active Member

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    Years ago while attending the Shot Show I talked with a person who bought the Chas. Daley name. I believe his name was Kassanar (sp?)

    He said you could walk in almost any shop in the Brescia area and get a shotgun made.

    If true Im sure the prices are up but worth a try if in the area.



    Regards....Gerald
     
  4. sptnclays

    sptnclays Member

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    Bsaltd.com is a int. Importer.
    They should be able to help u get the gun into the US.
     
  5. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    Nothing personal to anyone involved.. But if I knew what I wanted.. I'd order it here..and let them send it with the buttstock.. fitted at head only. Then go to someone like Dennis DeVault to fit you HERE... You'll save money in the long run.. AND if you don't speak Italian..get the stock that fits YOU.. and your style of shooting.. Not what they think you should shoot..

    If you can't order it here.. there is not enough backup in the area if anything needed to be done here.. and I would not buy that brand..
     
  6. kiwiG

    kiwiG Member

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    FWIW, The Perazzi factory is a gated secure facility and you need to make an appointment in advance...at least that was the case with the only guy I know who's been there. His funniest story about the whole thing was when he went into the bank in his home town at peak time and shouted out to a staff member a few desks back "Is my bankdraft for 6 million ready yet"...all conversations stopped and everyone looked over to see who the newest millionaire in town was...of course the 6M was 6million Lire...a couple of grand in 'real' money. Cheers-Graham.
     
  7. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    I think a couple of you are missing the boat here.

    Mike resides in Israel. A plane ride to Italy is only a 30 minute ride across the Med. He doesn't have access to the stock fitters here in the states.

    I'm thinking he's just looking for some insight on gunmakers and stock fitters that might be available in Italy. This site has become a lot more international over the last couple of years and it's great to see and hear from shooters with a different discipline not the norm here.

    Mike-Israel,

    I sent you a pm about a gun that I sampled over the weekend.

    ss
     
  8. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    I was not only speaking about a Perazzi... While my experience is limited there.. They seem to think.. unless you are an Olympic shooter..you don't have a clue to what fits/feels/and in correct.. They will let you go so far.. and then give you what THEY want.. A look at the Kolar Twisted Sister stock is a prime example.. I kinow many that shoot it FANTASTIC...In Italy.. it would probably be laughed at.. Everyone laughted at me with my PFS stock.. yet 8 out of 10 experienced bunker shooter.. not only shot it well.. but liked it and shot fantastic scores..

    Most of the stock makers in Italy are just that.. stockmakers... They shoot a little bit..do excellent work.. but fall vastly short of the expertise of many of our good stockmakers here that are both AA shooters and stockmakers..

    I'm not saying your "IDEAL" stock could not be made there.. It can..But.. the correct TEAM to produce it might not be avaiable.. If just a regular..straight forward stock is all you require.. YES.. they'd do a fine job.. BUT..To 90% of us.. I think someone like Dennis would yield an extra 2% or more to your average..

    All Good.. Mike
     
  9. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    Mike: There is a 20% government tax on Italian stuff. The tax is not included on items sold outside of Italy, such as in the US.

    If Chris Potter guns in the UK is still in operation, email them.

    I never could get anyone to respond back to me regarding guns to the US, so I'm thinking they may not be in operation any longer.

    I did get a call from Chris himself a couple of years ago wanting to go prairie dog shooting here, but he never got back to me - kinda pissed me off as I spent some time and phone calls doin some research for him.

    Good luck.

    WHiz
     
  10. mike-israel

    mike-israel TS Member

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    Guys;

    Lots of good info comming back. Short Shuker has got it right. My problem or better yet problems here in Israel is a) no dealers B) no stockmakers so any experiance is with the guns that members have here some Berettas (mostly 680s ,682s a few Brownings superposed, Xt's , one Perazzi MX8 , a Merkal (nice but old) and a smattering of others.

    Now you guys are a differant catagory all together with dozens and thats literaly of good makes and models to chose from. Shot Shucker mentioned in a PM that he shot a 320 Rissini this weekend--I have there catalogue and price list- also FAIR (I.Rissini} has a new model bunker called Racing which looks good. So for me would be to go over ,3hr flight to Milan or Bergamo --to Brescia/Val De Trompe and with appointements to CG ,Perrazzi and any others I can get into (been emailing to a number and all have extended invites--so thats a given) and see what can be done. Seen the Zoli Konos advertized for 4k in US anyone have some feedback on it.

    PerazziBigBor---Mike all good on your comments but I am going for a bunker gun not ATA so american stocks are not want I would be needing.

    What I do have is some experiance (45yrs shooting) and know what I need re.LOP 14 1/8"- 1'4" cast off barrel lenght 32" Full/top maybe chokes bottom . I think 60/40 Bottom 50/50 Top --that sound right to you all. I like to patern a bit higher --most bunker guns are all 50/50s but if you notice even the Italians are going somewhat higher patterns.

    Keep em commin open mind to all good advice.....MIKE
     
  11. decimamas 54

    decimamas 54 Active Member

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    Mike, if you want buy a gun and use it for any sport reasons in Italy you must have a permit from the Italian Police.
    To get it you must be:
    1)an Italian resident
    2)you must present to the Police a phisycal and mental exam certificate
    3)the prove that you join in a shooting club
    otherwise you can buy a shootgun and have fit it to you but they have to ship it directly to your country; this way you will save 20% tax if you live out of Union Europe.
    In Gardone VT is not like it was long time ago. A lot of small gunbuilder they are not longer there and some of the big manifactures they will not directly deal with you if you are not a gundealer.
     
  12. ffwildcat

    ffwildcat TS Member

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    What I do have is some experiance (45yrs shooting) and know what I need re.LOP 14 1/8"- 1'4" cast off barrel lenght 32" Full/top maybe chokes bottom . I think 60/40 Bottom 50/50 Top --that sound right to you all. I like to patern a bit higher --most bunker guns are all 50/50s but if you notice even the Italians are going somewhat higher patterns


    Mike - I cannot provide any insight into your venture so I apologize for that but I was intrigued by your barrel specs. That is the EXACT same barrel my son shoots. He is getting some stick over the length and several folks would prefer to see him shoot 30" barrels but he really swings the 32" set well and they pattern fantastic. Why your preference for 32" barrels?

    Thanks
    Jim
     
  13. Baber

    Baber TS Member

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    Guys....

    Thought I would chime in here. Mike is a bunker shooter... Denis DeVault is a ATA shooter. Very little in common. True an Italian might not know much about ATA but US stock makers know nothing about bunker. Mike.... go to Perazzi and don't fool with any of the lesser brands. Make an appointment with them and get fitted properly. You might consider working with the Perazzi Importer and then the gun will come back through him and save some of the Italian taxes.

    Tom

    p.s. suggest you avoid the CG....
     
  14. mike-israel

    mike-israel TS Member

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    Jim ;

    For me the 32" gives me a smoother movement to target especially second shot as the heavier front wieght in motion for me seems to move better. So also had a PM from Eric shot shuker --saying exact same specs he had ---interesting as thats what I would want and doen't seem that far off from others. Others may need the longer LOP BUT THATS MORE OF A physical thing i.e. I am 5ft 7" and shorter arms other staller ??

    As the other MIKE says all good!..MIKE
     
  15. PerazziBigBore

    PerazziBigBore TS Member

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    While I'll conceed we shoot ATA over here.. we also shoot Sporting Clays.. that the stocks are very much the same.. While I perfer Perazzi shotguns..there are many great ones out there.. and I don't want to seem one sided... true.. I'm a nobody in bunker shooting.. still way down on the learning curve.. I fully understand how stock fit and grip position have everything to do with shooting.. Most ever stockmaker I've talked to over there wants my hand reaching for the trigger.. i have a small hand.. and they just don't get it.. Now.. I speak no Italian.. and most of there stockmakers speak very little English.. Mike.. for you personally.. I'd get a junk stock or two.. and work with bondo getting it perfect.. If you go to Perazzi..just tell them to COPY your stock..OR.. at the very least.. bring it as a starting point for them to tweek for you..

    The biggest difference between ATA and Bunker.. other than the shear speed of the target..is not all the bunker targets are high.. There are 5 flat targets in every round..some flatter than others.. I require a parallel comb for that.. which is easily done with a PFS stock..

    Personally..i have no ties to Dennis..or any stockmaker.. But.. I will say..the Twisted sister my friend Charlie Boggs has..fit me beautifully..and it wasn't even my gun.. I've seen nothing like that in Europe.. and see no reason why it would not work on Bunker..

    I think..in Bunker.. it's important for you and the gun to be one..not hard to do..but finding someone who will do it correctly for you is the hard part..

    Let me know if I can help.. Mike BTW.. if you've never shot a PFS stock..I'll let you know when I go back to Italy.. You're welcome to shoot my MX8B 29.5" 1.52 KG Perazzi with PFS stock.. AND I agree.. I wish it were a 31.5"/32".. but am learning to shoot the shorter barrel..
     
  16. mike-israel

    mike-israel TS Member

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    Just to get the Kreighoff owners mad at me. Don't see any being used at Bunker.

    I'm sure there are but hav'nt seen any.....MIKE
     
  17. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    I have been there( I lived in Rome for a year)--- and yes you can schedule a visit and fitting--- now one thing not discussed here is that they used to also adjust the "balance" of a gun to an individual shooter- using different wood- different barrels - adjusting those weights- etc---

    The balance adjustment was one of the major functions to "fit" that they made.

    Here P guns are only parts--- over there with an individual fitting- they truly would become an extension of the shooter.

    You cant just walk in and "buy" a gun in Europe- its a complicated procedure, make sure you know what you are getting into-- research this issue

    I wouldnt use any other maker than Perazzi or possibly Beretta for a number of reasons to include future repair and maintenance
     
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