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Duplicating a Fiochi Golden Pheasant Shell

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by macrae3454, Dec 11, 2009.

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  1. macrae3454

    macrae3454 TS Member

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    I found a box of Fiocchi Golden Pheasant GPX shells in a gas station on the way back from S. Dakota last year and wanted to give them a try. They are 1-3/8 oz, size 5 plated shot, and listed at a blistering 1485 FPS. They have been working real well for me this year on Colorado pheasants but I'm running out and they don't sell them around here. Plus they were expensive. I'm trying to duplicate the load on my MEC9000. I've looked through all my reloading books and checked the Hogdon and Alliant reloading data sites. The closest I can come to the alleged speed is 1310 using a Rem STS, Win 209, RP12 wad and Alliant Blue Dot (35.5 gr). Has anyone come across data for a load more closely matching the reported 1485 speed of the factory Fiocchi?
    Thanks-Macrae3454-Tom Saunders
     
  2. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    Hodgdon shows some 1 3/8 oz 1350 fps loads with the Gold Medal hull and Longshot. (ouch)
     
  3. Jawhawker

    Jawhawker TS Member

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    In my view that Blue Dot load will be darn uncomfortable.

    Go to Ballistic Products website. They have wads and data for loadings available to duplicate top speed in a 2.75 shell.
     
  4. School Teacher

    School Teacher Well-Known Member

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    You all must have some really tough pheasants!

    It is painful to me even to think about a 1 3/8 oz load at 1485 fps. I guess that extra cold weather clothing and "the thrill of the moment" must deaden the recoil.

    Why would you need more than 1 1/4 oz at 1330 fps?

    Ed Ward
     
  5. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    Martin,

    35 grains of Bluedot is a porch shooters best friend. Lol.

    school teacher,

    Those 1330 1 1/4 Federals work pretty darn well for those birds. I even use them during turkey season and they do the job just fine.

    ss
     
  6. Jawhawker

    Jawhawker TS Member

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    Ed, yes they can be painful, atleast to me too and even more so when shot in a gun that is not properly. Yes [heasants are tough. I have and have seen then actually pushed sideways and not fall.

    I do not now although I have in the past when I was twice my present size used 1 3/8 ozs. The load I favored was at 1340 fps.

    I shoot 1.25 oz at 1275 fps in 12 ga. and 1.125 at the same in 16 ga.
     
  7. Taxidermy

    Taxidermy Active Member

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    I like those old Winchester XX MAG in 1 1/2 oz #4 copper plated. Pure death on pheasants, why not use the best shell when that is the cheapest part of the trip. Thanks Ronnie
     
  8. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

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    Tom, I am a fan of Fiocchi shotshells, but not of their Golden Pheasant shells. If you run a couple across a chronograph, you'll find that 1485fps is a figment of some marketing person's imagination. A very large figment. Maybe it is 1485 at the muzzle instead of at 3' which is where most American ammo is measured.

    As it turns out, a shell with a 1486fps muzzle velocity has dropped to 1330fps at 3' from the muzzle. So if you buy any loads marked 1330fps or reload from a US manual to 1330fps, you will be duplicating the velocity of the Golden Pheasant load.

    If you want to reload, you can buy the Nickel plated shot Fiocchi uses at Ballistic Products, or for more money at Cabela's. It is Nickel plated, 2% Antimonial shot.

    If you decide not to reload, consider buying nNickel plated loads from B&P. http://www.bandpusa.com/ Here is the link. Click on Nickel plated loads on the left. They use nickel plated, 3% Antimonial shot.

    I am a HUGE fan of Nickel plating, because it penetrates farther and draws fewer feathers. I use it for reloads. I'll also suggest you take a look at Winchester's ammo catalog. Their Supreme loads are, well, supreme. The best have copper plated shot, (copper over 5% Antimonial lead shot) and it is buffered. It is not waxed like the drek Lawrence sells. I use the 1 1/8oz load in my 20b for late winter Pheasant's. Use a more open choke than full. If you center a bird with a full choke and this load at 40 yards, you will not want to eat the results, except in a stew.
     
  9. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    You can buy those fiocchi's at any Cabelas and you were probably close to the one in Mitchell SD. I use them buy I use 4's.
     
  10. dverna

    dverna Active Member

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    TMi

    I hope you are correct. I have decided I do not want to be punished by heavy 12 ga loads or carry s heavy gun. I will be shooting over dogs at a game farm so I do not face the tougher birds real pheasant hunters deal with.

    I like my 28 ga XS Feather and intend to reload hunting shells for it. BPI makes 7/8 and 1 oz wads that I will stuff with copper 5's and 6's. I will shoot whatever patterns best.

    Winchester makes a 1 oz load for the 28 but Gander charges $25/box for 6's. I used that load for Chuckers and it crumpled them.

    Don Verna
     
  11. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Be very careful using load data from BP. Not all of it is pressure tested, some, and I don't know how much or which, is/may be computer generated but not actually tested in a pressure gun. To load at the top end of velocity and pressure and not know what the load really produces is too scary for my blood. They are good folks who sell good products, it's just that we differ philosophically on what is safe and prudent.
     
  12. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

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    Don, I'd shoot the lighter load and go with smaller pellets. I use 15/16oz Nickel plated #7 (not 7 1/2) for the first shot and #6 Nickel for the second in my 20b. That's plenty. The only reason I don't use 7/8oz is no one makes a hunting load that small. If you are using lead shot, you'll have to bump that to #6 and #5, because lead shot doesn't penetrate nearly as well.
     
  13. whiz white

    whiz white Strong Supporter of Trapshooting Banned

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    Our hunting group uses the Remington Nitro Mags, but they are about $1.00 a shell now, wholesale.

    My trapshooting buddy of 30 years has been using, and I am now reloading a similar load: He is using 36 grains of Blue Dot, 1 3/8 shot (we like 4's and 6's) and the red AA wad.

    His load is a lot to stuff into a AA hull, so I switched to 800X and the rest of the load is the same. I use 25-26 grains of the 800X.

    I have to tell you that I chronographed the Remington Nitros and they varied well over 100 fps from high-to-low. We chronographed my biddies load and it have a high-to-low differential of 55 fps. Go figure...

    My buddy shot them and thought they were about the same as his. I have yet to chronograph these, but they are damn quick.

    Whiz
     
  14. dverna

    dverna Active Member

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    omgb
    Thanks for the warning. I cannot believe they would publish loads that have not been pressure tested. That is damn stupid on their part if you are right.

    Fortunately, there are loads on the Hodgdon site that look good so I will use them if BPI confirms their loads have not been tested when I call them Monday.

    I know there is at least one private lab that will test loads so that may be an option for checking the BPI load data.

    Don Verna
     
  15. omgb

    omgb Well-Known Member

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    Don, my source for that concern is the Low Pressure group at 16GA.com. Several individuals have issued the same warning. As to it's validity, as I said, I don't know which if any are not pressure tested and which are virtually generated. I'd just be careful JIC.
     
  16. macrae3454

    macrae3454 TS Member

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    Wow, thanks for all the responses--lot's of info. I was a little suspect of Fiocchi's claim of 1485 FPS. And yes, they do kick, but who's to notice when the bird flushes and you're wearing 6 layers and ski goggles because it's -10 like it was here last Wednesday. My theory is that we don't have that many birds in Colorado and I want every advantage when I get a shot. Sure, I could carry my light 28 GA and hope that I was a better shooter than what I am but I hate wounding birds and not getting them in the bag. On the other hand, my labs really like chasing those wounded runners. Prior to trying out these Fiocchi shells I was loading 1-1/2 oz 2-3/4" with Winchester 571 and #5 shot, rated at 1260 fps but never chrono-d. They worked well but I thought faster might be better. I like the plated shot but have never found any locally, and I've still got a bag of regular #5 left. I've been out 6 days this year, all in Eastern CO and range from 0 birds and 0 shots to 3 birds with 4 shots like last Wednesday when we started at -10. I've got a total of 6 birds after 6 days-should have had some more if I had shot better---not the shell's fault. I do have some Longshot powder sitting on the bench, and still some 571, so I'll probably try out a few with the Longshot-now that I know that the 1485 FPS was not tested consistently with American shell makers.
    Thanks again.
    Tom Saunders
    [​IMG]
     
  17. Jawhawker

    Jawhawker TS Member

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    Tom, check out the old loading with 571 using 1 3/8 oz shot. I used it quite a bit in long ago years as well. I think I remember the powder drop but verify in a manual. It too used the WAA12R.

    You ole boys that use that Blue Dot are a darn sure lot tougher than I ever was!
     
  18. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    There is something missing in every Pheasant load I have used. A Pheasant can flush, be hit solidly, fold up in the air obviously dead and hit the ground hard. But as soon as the dead bird hits the ground hard, it becomes resurrected. The resurrected bird then runs very fast and far. We need a shell that will keep the dead birds from coming back to life as they hit the ground.

    Pat Ireland
     
  19. fssberson

    fssberson Active Member

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    Tom: You have a personal message. I have a case of Golden Pheasant 12 ga. #5's that I am willing to part with. Fred
     
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