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Doubles with a Beretta, A little help, please

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by johnjohn91387, Feb 17, 2008.

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  1. johnjohn91387

    johnjohn91387 TS Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    I shoot a Beretta O/U for doubles, and use the single barrel for everything else.

    I understand that Beretta has permanently "adjusted" the barrels to pattern their way.

    So, to get along, I have gone along with the program.....what other choice do I really have? (That's a rhetorical question!) A new gun is not in the cards.

    I'm off to the pattern board, where I will shoot and attempt to pattern the bottom barrel first, which I know shoots "high".

    I normally try to shoot the first bird of doubles pretty fast, almost to the point of "spotshooting". I call for the bird, and as soon as I see it leave the house (two eyed shooter) I pull the trigger. The bird normally turns to dust. (unless I flinch, that is....) 1oz of #8 works really well.

    What distance should I pattern the bottom barrel from, if I shoot the first bird that fast? Since I am at the 16 yard line, maybe add 10 yards or so?

    Same question for the top barrel, which seems to shoot flat. From what distance should I pattern this barrel? (shooting 1 1/8 oz. of #8, 1145fps)

    Seems kind of silly to ask this now, but what the heck; there are a lot of people (hopefully) reading this who have shot a heck of lot more doubles than me!

    Thanks in advance....

  2. manyspuds

    manyspuds Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    if you are breaking targets . who cares if it shoot high or right on?
  3. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    The POI of the second barrel is very important for success in the doubles game. You have to find what works for you. To give you an example I trap the first bird and pull the trigger while the bird is still under the gun. I use a skeet choke. I had to add a new front sight with a 3 inch long piece of rib to the front of my gun. This made the gun shoot the second shot lower, It's what I needed to smoke the second bird. You have to experiment and find what works inorder hit the second bird hard and not just chip it. I use .023 (IM) for the second shot. HMB
  4. chiefjon

    chiefjon Active Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    El Dorado Hills, CA

    I am not much of a doubles shooter, but I read the books and watched the movies. First, if you are going to throw that DT 10 away...throw me the stock.
    I am a big believer in the post 3, trap set on straight away, rather than the pattern board. Play with the gun. Shoot only top barrel and let the targets get away from you a little. Frankly, I believe an imp. mod is fine for 2nd shots. I do shoot 1 1/8 oz for second shot. It is more about timing and pratice than any thing else. Hold a little higher gun...bang the first shot quick and then horizontal move to second bird. I alternate between an IC and MOD for first shot...but I believe in imp. mod for second shot. Hope to get to So. Cal and shoot with you before too long.

    I have also toyed with getting an extra set of doubles barrels and having an adj. rib put on it...man would I like to be a good doubles shooter.

  5. chatbrat

    chatbrat TS Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    John, I think ChiefJohn apppraisal is the right one, It isn't that important how quickly you shoot the first bird, it is more important that you get to the second bird as long as it is in the same relative plane as the first bird---take a glance at Harlan Campbell's video on the Sunrise Production's website---his explanation & demo can explain better than I ever could---it is only a few seconds long---Phil
  6. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    John- I would pattern both barrels at 30 yards. I would check the point of impact of both barrels at 13 yards. You should do this to see where the gun shoots. But, I suspect your problem with the second bird is more related to where you shoot the gun rather than where the gun shoots.

    I am willing to bet a Coke that your face is coming off the gun after you shoot the first bird. If this is true, than the POI of the barrel makes no difference. If my first guess is wrong, then my second guess is that you are moving the gun to the second bird with your arms and not your lower body.

    Pat Ireland
  7. zzt

    zzt Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    SE PA
    John, I owned a 682 Gold E combo that I sold after a year, because I never could get used to the way Beretta "helped" with their barrel regulation.

    You should do some POI testing ASAP. You should also do some POI testing on your choke tubes.

    I'll tell you what I found with my combo, as you can take it from there.

    I had huge problems scoring with my combo, so I finally decided to test the choke tubes for POI. Of the six Beretta supplied with the gun, only one was correct. One was pretty close, and the other four were so far off it was pathetic. The one that was correct was a full choke, and I could run them with that one. One of the IMs was within an 1" of being correct. I also noticed the skirt of the choke was so large, ID, that the wad was hitting halfway up the taper. I finally just ordered chokes from Briley to replace them and had no problems after that. All of them shot to the same POI, and all patterned ell.

    So the chokes were taken care of, which was a huge help. The remaining problem was the "help" Beretta gives you. In my case, shooting from the bench, sighting flat down the rib, the U barrel printed 2" high @ 20 yards. The O barrel printed 4" high and the top single printed 5" high.

    Now, those numbers are what Beretta says they do on purpose. I've also see 682 barrels where the bottom shot low and the top shot high. I just think Beretta does a lousy job with regulation. maybe not as bad as Browning, but plenty bad none the less.

    Also, those numbers are misleading. The TS barrel printed way higher than from the bench, because the rib was closer to the barrel, so you saw more rib than you did with the O/U barrels unless you adjusted your comb. Therefore your POI was higher.

    The net result was three barrels that shot to significantly different POIs. Also, they swung differently, so another problem as introduced.

    So I'll tell you again, check your choke tubes for consistent POI, the using known good choke tubes, check your barrels for POI. Once you know for certain what you have, you can make some informed decisions.

    If I still had my combo, and I had no choice but to use it, here is what I would do. I would sell the top single barrel, or put it in a closet somewhere, never to be used again. Then I would use the O barrel for singles with a Briley or Wrights IM choke. I'd use the U barrel for handicap, because you want a slightly higher shooting gun for caps. For doubles I'd follow convention.

    Now, If you find your barrels shoot the opposite, U barrel prints lower than than O, reverse what I said above.

    If you cannot get used to barrels that shoot to different POIs for doubles, Pick the one that shoots where you like, and have Briley make you an eccentric choke to match for the other.
  8. maclellan1911

    maclellan1911 TS Member

    Dec 9, 2006
    How about foot position? I do not shoot a lot of doubles but when I do I set me feet more inline with 2 shot. then turn to set up the gun for the 1st shot. One tip thats always helped me in the claytarget games. Get your eyes on the clay!!! 1st.
  9. Frank C

    Frank C Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    I have a similar issue with my 687, but I have release/ pull triggers, top barrel release, so that is what I shoot first, I can usually run a 48-50 on the first birds, but drop 8-10 on the second. When I patterned the bottom barrel I found that it shoots a little lower than flat, but I am used to shooting with the bird floating on the barrel.....not sure what I can do short of going to Dub release and reversing the order that I shot them....any ideas?

    DODGEMAN Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    I agree with Stubs, I also have a 682 O/U and couldnt hit the second bird I then tried shooting top barrel first and it worked doing it since. ever
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beretta barrel regulation is terrible