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Does anyone shoot trap w/ maintained lead?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Bruce Em, Feb 23, 2012.

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  1. Bruce Em

    Bruce Em Member

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    I don't but it is a serious question.

    I suspect it screws up skeet shooters

    If you hold on the house, isn't every bid a swing through?

    thanks
     
  2. Oregunner

    Oregunner Well-Known Member

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    Skeet low house 7 is just an easy trap target. Skeet shooters rarely miss it. I can successfully shoot either venue. In skeet they talk about three kinds of lead. Swing through, pull away, and sustained lead. I guess I use a form of sustained lead in trap, but only after I see where the bird is headed. I see the bird, get the gun ahead of the bird by the correctly judged lead, pull the trigger, and keep the gun moving. Mark
     
  3. crusha

    crusha TS Member

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    No. Nobody who's any good, anyway.
     
  4. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    Maintained lead means that you start in front of the target with your muzzle and you stay in front all the way. How are you going to start in front of a target if you don't know whether it's going to go to the left, to the right, or straight away?
     
  5. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    Maintained lead means that you start in front of the target with your muzzle and you stay in front all the way. How are you going to start in front of a target if you don't know whether it's going to go to the left, to the right, or straight away?
     
  6. sptnclays

    sptnclays Member

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    Kinda hard when you don't know which direction the target is going.
    I guess a form of maintained lead could be done if your gun is relatively flat shooting and you hold straight out, look under the barrel for the bird and move in front of the target.
     
  7. sport303

    sport303 Member

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    shot trap for 33yrs using maintained lead. still use it in sporting clays. 1990 trap all american. 11 time all american in sporting. jack concannon trap average 98.38 sporting 90.1 2011
     
  8. Gapper

    Gapper TS Member

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    One could argue most shooters use a "maintained lead" for a split second. For many, there isn't enough time to identify an unknown target flight angle, find an insertion point, build and hold a maintained lead, then fire and follow through.

    For the most part, successful trap is "spot-shooting" with a small "swing through" and very short duration "maintained lead".

    JMHO, GAP
     
  9. mette56

    mette56 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure what maintained lead is...but I'm not all that smart. Pull!... See target... Go to a spot...Release!..Smoke! (sometimes)...is my style. Less gun movement means less room for error.

    Learned it from Barnhart and Carmichael. Both great teachers to even a student with average ability.

    Tough question because not one style works for every shooter, even the greats.

    ...i.e....Ricky-low gun, Carmichael-high gun...Willoughby/Nora/-low gun/one eyed, Gravestock/Ohye-high gun/two eyed. Any departure from YOUR natural style...better get a good coach (Steve, Dennis, Leo III, Hoppe, Nora, Britt, Kay-Debroah, Ricky, Kiner, etc). Good luck w/any changes you contemplate, especially with anything other than what your natural ability dictates.

    PS: I'm not a teacher but love to learn from the greats! So JMO.

    milt
     
  10. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    I'm mostly swing through, but most of my trigger time is actually BEHIND the bird.
     
  11. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    "shot trap for 33yrs using maintained lead. still use it in sporting clays. 1990 trap all american. 11 time all american in sporting. jack concannon trap average 98.38 sporting 90.1 2011"

    --------------------------------------------------------------


    Would you mind explaining how you shoot maintained lead on trap targets?

    For example, what is your hold point on Post 5? If your hold point is far enough to the right of the house to always be in front of a hard right angle target, then you would be behind any target that went to the left until you swung past it, in which case you wouldn't be using maintained lead since your muzzle would start out behind the target.

    Perhaps we just have a different definition of what "maintained lead" means. If so, what is your definition?

    Thanks,

    Easystreet
     
  12. Oregunner

    Oregunner Well-Known Member

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    I consider a maintained lead, or "sustained lead", as moving the gun barrel at the same speed as the target while being a specific distance ahead of the target, when pulling the trigger. I don't start ahead of the bird, but swing to a location ahead of the bird, see the lead, and shoot. This only works on angle birds. (On straight aways, I follow the bird up and shoot.) The bird is always in sight, and I beat the bird to the lead that I want, and shoot. I never am actually pointing at the bird. It works for me. Mark
     
  13. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking it can only be done using a low mount insertion technique unsuited to trap.

    Jack Concannon excepted.
     
  14. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Maybe he shoots doubles. HMB
     
  15. 5141

    5141 Member

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    I wish ATA Hall of Fame member ,and sometime contributor on here, Neal Crausbay would weigh in on this.....
    I years ago heard him discussing his style of shooting and it seemed he did describe a system involving some form of maintained lead...
    Whatever his "style" was the records certainly speak well of his ability to apply it
     
  16. Neal Crausbay

    Neal Crausbay Member

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    I call it sustained lead instead of maintained lead. The final result is you sustain a lead with the target on its flight path just long enough to trip the latch. Doesn't matter if you have to come from below, behind or where ever to get to this lead as long as your front sight is holding the amount of lead you have learned from practice/experience that is needed to break that particular bird. You mentally know this amount of lead even before you get to where you catch the target and get the sight picture you want. If you shoot the rear end off a target you know to add a little more lead on the next one like it or take some off if you shot the nose off. Hard to do that using a swing-through style.

    You are far better equipped to handle bad pulls with this method than with a swing-through style where you pull the trigger as the front sight passes over the target. With this method the speed of your barrel movement affects the amount of actual lead. You don't see the target come out and you have to rush to the target then your barrel speed is faster than it would be if you picked it up as it came out and moved past it. Foul weather targets usually hurt shooters using this style. Typically this style of shooter has lots of up and down days with their scores and in the same conditions but has no idea why they had "a bad day".
     
  17. Gapper

    Gapper TS Member

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    Hey Mr. Crausbay, don't you realize by now you can't adjust your lead when "shooting the rear end off a target"? Shotgun patterns are all random. Breaks too.

    Sheeese - rookies.

    :) GAP
     
  18. kgun_shooter

    kgun_shooter Member

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    Has anyone watched the Leo Harrison tapes? He teaches that to be consistent you have to lead the target. He also stated that's whay most shooters aren't consistent.

    I went shooting last night at one of my favorite clubs. They are currently shooting bio degradable targets. When shooting these targets under the lights you can see a lot! Well I noticed that most of the missed targets were dusted, lots of white dust. So I started to watch carefully and noticed that 99% of the targets that the shooters were missing looked like that were shot behind. So on handicap, I made sure that I was in front of the birds and all of them were smoked. I also shot a few rounds of singles and made sure that I saw a lead when the gun was fired, all I can say is what a difference. I believe that most of the targets missed on the trap field are behind and low, that is my opinion. For a long time I have shot a high gun with great success but have never really thought about the horizontal lead needed. After last night that will never happen again.
     
  19. Twinbirds

    Twinbirds TS Member

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    so it is more aimed then pointed
     
  20. Shooting Jack

    Shooting Jack Active Member

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    I'm with Neal on this one. If you have ever shot skeet, especially stations 3, 4, and 5 you must use a sustained lead to be consistent or at least that is my thinking. For trap I have learned to adjust barrel speed for those long shots as well as lead. Jackie B.
     
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