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Doctors New Health Care Questions

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by KCDODSON, Mar 19, 2012.

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    KCDODSON TS Member

    Jul 5, 2010
    712 Ramblewood Ct
    I have a friend who went to a doctor this morning for his annual physical, he was given a questionnaire to fill out. The first three questions were:
    1. What is your sexual preference?
    2. Are you sexually active?
    3. Are you a gun owner?

    He went to the nurse and asked why is he being asked these types of questions, he had never been asked them before? He was told that it was due to the New Obama Health Care Laws. He refused to answer and was refused treatment. Has anyone had this happen to them? Or was this just one doctor who hates gun owners. Trying to find out the validity of this before I write my Senator and the NRA.
  2. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

    Jan 29, 1998
    In the Cabana
    I have heard that they are starting ask those questions

    Just do like I do when they ask me if I drink, lie
  3. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

    Oct 6, 2006
    Read the editers note.

    I'm not for Obama care but the AMA has brought these issues up before.
  4. bill1949

    bill1949 Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    If my doctor asked me those or any other out of line questions I would tell him to screw himself and find a new doctor!...Bill
  5. jmac_cope

    jmac_cope Active Member

    Apr 20, 2010
    This was a hot button issue in the Oregon Legislature this past session. It came up in Grant County Oregon where patients were being asked about gun ownership. State Senator Ted Ferioli took it to the Oregon State Legislature and they enacted a law prohibiting this question. I was determined to violate the Oregon Constitution and the 2nd amendment to the US Constitution.

    I am sure that Sen. Ferioli would be happy to share any information regarding this to others who are concerned.

  6. Setterman

    Setterman Well-Known Member

    Feb 12, 2007
    They should ask: Do you have a job? Do you have an I.D.?, Are you an illegal alien?
  7. bob easton

    bob easton TS Member

    Dec 11, 2011
    3. Hell Yes!!! Want me to show it to you?

    If Obamacare isn't repealed, and if these questions become universal, we will be well along the road to another civil war in this country.

    Bob Easton
  8. grntitan

    grntitan Well-Known Member

    Mar 25, 2009
    IL(The gun friendly Southern Part)
    Ha, I've hunted with my family Doc on several occasions. I'm pretty sure he knows I have guns as I know he does as well. I'll guarantee he won't be asking me or any of his patients such questions. If your Doc does, I'd find a new one.
  9. jim brown

    jim brown Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    Ya got to wonder who makes this crap up don't ya. Just don't let the facts stand in the way of your opinions.

    jim brown
  10. Ahab

    Ahab Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    @ of my doctors encourage me to shoot ... they consider it good excercise.

    Can I deduct the cost as a medical expense?
  11. bigdogtx

    bigdogtx Well-Known Member

    Aug 5, 2006
    Hey Jim,,,,I was asked this in San Diego 2 years ago when I got bronchitis visiting my,,,,the gun part,,,,,my answer was NOYB,,,,that is an answer,,,,they never asked the other 2,,,,,

    as for question #1,,,,,are they offering a sex change???? I am a man and like being a man,,,,especially with a woman,,,,,my doctor is a lady,,,is she flirting?????
  12. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

    Jan 29, 1998
    I am calling BS- I dont believe it happened

    Regards from Iowa

  13. HSLDS

    HSLDS Well-Known Member

    Nov 2, 2006
    S-E PA
    This is from 2004, when MD's were first asked to query about firearms ownership.

    It falls under Risk Management and anyone who asks outside of their area of expertise is setting themselves up for massive liability (e.g., a doctor asking about and providing advice on firearms), also, if they ask about a single risk issue, and not others (e.g., asking about guns but ignoring pools, garden tools, etc.)

    Risk Management Advice to Physicians and Malpractice Insurance Providers: Don't Borrow Trouble
    © 2000 by Joe Horn crowtalk@theriver.com

    One of the best games in town is litigation, and litigating against physicians is even more popular than suing gun manufacturers. Physicians and their malpractice insurance carriers are well aware that litigators are constantly looking for new opportunities to sue. Let's talk about one of those new areas of liability exposure.

    Nowadays, many physicians and other health care providers are engaging in the very risky, well intentioned, albeit naive and politically inspired business of asking their patients about ownership, maintenance and storage of firearms in the home, and even removal of those firearms from the home. Some could argue that this is a "boundary violation," and it probably is, but there is another very valid reason why these professionals should NOT engage in this practice -- MASSIVE LIABILITY.

    Physicians are licensed and certified in the practice of medicine, the treatment of illnesses and injuries, and in preventative activities. They may advise or answer questions about those issues. However, when physicians give advice about firearms safety in the home, without certification in that field, and without physically INSPECTING that particular home and those particular firearms, they are functioning outside the practice of medicine.

    Furthermore, if they fail to review the gamut of safety issues in the home, such as those relating to electricity, drains, disposals, compactors, garage doors, driveway safety, pool safety, pool fence codes and special locks for pool gates, auto safety, gas, broken glass, stored cleaning chemicals, buckets, toilets, sharp objects, garden tools, home tools, power tools, lawnmowers, lawn chemicals, scissors, needles, forks, knives, and on and on, well, you get the drift. A litigator could easily accuse that physician of being NEGLIGENT for not covering whichever one of those things that ultimately led to the death or injury of a child or any one in the family or even a visitor to the patient's home.

    To engage in Home Safety Counseling without certification, license or formal training in home safety and Risk Management and to concentrate on one small politically correct area, i.e., firearms to the neglect of ALL of the other safety issues in the modern home, is to invite a lawsuit because the safety counselor, (Physician) Knew, Could have known or Should have known that there were other dangers to the occupants of that house more immediate than firearms. Things like swimming pools, buckets of water, and chemicals in homes are involved in the death or injury of many more children than accidental firearms discharge [Source: CDC.] Firearms are a statistically small, nearly negligible fraction of the items involved in home injuries. Physicians SHOULD know that. So, why all of a sudden do some physicians consider themselves to be firearms and home safety experts? Where is their concern for all the other home safety issues that they DON'T cover with their patients?

    Once physicians start down this path of home safety counseling, they are completely on their own. A review of their medical malpractice insurance will reveal that if they engage in an activity for which they are not certified, the carrier will not cover them if (or when) they are sued.

    Consider a physician asking the following questions of his or her malpractice insurance carrier:

    • One of my patients is suing me for NOT warning them that furniture polish was poisonous and their child drank it and died. I only warned them about firearms, drugs and alcohol. Am I covered for counseling patients about firearms safety while not mentioning and giving preventative advice about all the other dangers in the home, and doing so without formal training or certification in any aspect of home safety risk management? You know their answer.

    • How much training and certification do I need to become a Home Safety Expert Doctor? They will tell you that you are either a pediatrician or you are the National Safety Council. But, you don't have certification to do the National Safety Council's job for them.

    Homeowners and parents are civilly or criminally responsible for the safety or lack thereof in their homes. My advice to physicians is to not borrow trouble by presuming to be able to dispense safety advice outside your area of expertise: the practice of medicine. Your insurance carrier will love you if you simply treat injuries and illnesses, dispense advice on how to care for sick or injured persons, manage sanitation problems and try to prevent disease, but stay out of the Risk Management business unless you are trained and certified to do it. For example, E.R. doctors do not tell accident victims how to drive safely.

    Now, let's discuss the very serious issues involving the lawful possession and use of firearms for self and home defense, and the danger and liabilities associated with advising patients to severely encumber the firearm(s) with locked storage, or advising the patient to remove them entirely. Patient X is told by Doctor Y to remove or lock up a firearm so it is not accessible. Patient X, does as counseled and has no firearm available at close at hand. Subsequently, patient is then the victim of a home invasion and calls 911, but the police are buried in calls and don't arrive for 20 minutes during which time Patient X is raped, robbed and murdered. Anyone can see the liability issue here, particularly Risk Management specialists and liability insurance carriers.

    It's just a matter of *when* and not *if* this will happen. Sooner or later, it will - if a home invasion takes place and Patient X takes Doctor Y's advice.

    Now, imagine what follows this horrendous event. Who is to blame? The perpetrator is long gone, and even so, the Plaintiff's litigator will state that the perpetrator could have been neutralized by the appropriate lawful defensive use of a firearm, which *had* been in the home, but was no longer available to the deceased/injured because he/she followed a Physician's *expert* advice to render him/herself and his/her home defenseless against violent crime.

    The Litigator will further argue that the Physician Knew, Could have known, Should have known that removing a firearm from use for home defense would result in harm to the patient if and when a crime was committed against the patient in the home, as any reasonable person would have surmised.

    If one acknowledges the already dangerous general liability of home safety counseling and then adds the very risky practice of advising patients to disarm themselves in the face of the reality of violent crime daily perpetrated against home owners, condo and apartment tenants, it is apparent that the Physician is placing him/herself in a very risky position for suit.

    It is my strong recommendation to Malpractice Carriers and those Physicians they insure to strictly avoid this high risk practice and reserve counseling for the area of expertise in which they are certified: Medicine. In my professional opinion, this is an emotionally charged political issue that Physicians and their Carriers should not be manipulated for whatever well-intentioned reason into taking the risk, which is considerable...

    Physicians in doubt of the veracity of what I've said are encouraged to call their carriers and ask them what they currently cover, and to ask if this new counseling policy is covered under the existing policy. We already know what they will say: Don't borrow trouble.
    Since retiring from the LA County Sheriff's Department, Mr. Horn has provided Risk Management and related issue Human Resource consulting. Among other firms, he has consulted to IBM, Gates Learjet, National Semiconductor, and Pinkerton International Protection Services.


    Part One: Qualifications

    I affirm that I am certified to offer (Name of Patient: ), [hereinafter referred to as "the Patient"], qualified advice about firearms safety in the home, having received:

    Specify Course(s) of Study: ___________________________________________________________________

    From: Specify Institution(s) __________________________________________________________________

    Specify Course Completion Date(s): _____________________________________________________________

    Resulting in: Specify Accreditation(s), Certification(s), License(s) etc.:__________________________________


    Check one, as appropriate:
    ___ I represent that I have reviewed applicable scientific literature pertaining to defensive gun use and beneficial results of private firearms ownership. I further represent that I have reviewed all other relevant home safety issues with the Patient, including those relating to electricity, drains, disposals, compactors, garage doors, driveway safety, pool safety, pool fence codes and special locks for pool gates, auto safety, gas, broken glass, stored cleaning chemicals, buckets, toilets, sharp objects, garden tools, home tools, power tools, lawnmowers, lawn chemicals, scissors, needles, forks, knives, etc. I also acknowledge, by receiving this document, I have been made aware that, in his inaugural address before the American Medical Association on June 20, 2001, new president Richard Corlin, MD, admitted "What we don't know about violence and guns is literally killing us...researchers do not have the data to tell how kids get guns, if trigger locks work, what the warning signs of violence in schools and at the workplace are and other critical questions due to lack of research funding." (UPI). In spite of this admission, I represent that I have sufficient data and expertise to provide expert and clinically sound advice to patients regarding firearms in the home.
    ___ I am knowingly engaging in Home/Firearms Safety Counseling without certification, license or formal training in Risk Management, and; I have not reviewed applicable scientific literature pertaining to defensive gun use and beneficial results of private firearms ownership.

    Part Two: Liability

    I have determined, from a review of my medical malpractice insurance, that if I engage in an activity for which I am not certified, such as Firearms Safety Counseling, the carrier (check one, as appropriate):
    ___ will ___ will not cover lawsuits resulting from neglect, lack of qualification, etc.

    Insurance Carrier name, address and policy number insuring me for firearms safety expertise:


    I further warrant that, should the Patient follow my firearm safety counseling and remove from the home and/or disable firearms with trigger locks or other mechanisms, and if the patient or a family member, friend or visitor is subsequently injured or killed as a result of said removal or disabling, that my malpractice insurance and/or personal assets will cover all actual and punitive damages resulting from a lawsuit initiated by the patient, the patient's legal representative, or the patient's survivors.

    Signature of attesting physician and date: ___________________________________________________

    Name of attesting physician (please print): __________________________________________________

    Signature of patient and date: ____________________________________________________________

    Name of patient (please print): ____________________________________________________________

    Note to patient: Indicate if physician "REFUSED TO SIGN." Ask physician to place copy in chart/medical record.
  14. OldGoat

    OldGoat Well-Known Member

    Nov 17, 2008
    Overland Park KS
    Reminds me of the scene in the movie "Stripes" when the Army recruiter asks Bill Murray and his buddy if either one of them is homosexual and Murray replies: "No, but we are willing to learn..." While some may think it is BS and didn't happen, very little surprises me in this crazy world anymore. Regards, Ed
  15. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 1998
    Shawnee, Kansas, USA
    I've never had any doctor ask me about firearms, except once, my brother, an orthopedic surgeon, asked me about what kind of gun he should get.
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