1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

Do you compromise safety?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by ffwildcat, Oct 25, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. ffwildcat

    ffwildcat TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    845
    Saw something unbelievable today at the range. A group of newbies were shooting trap. Range was fairly quiet - they were the only ones on the fields and I was two fields down taking a break. I was watching them shoot and one guy loads his pump after he had shot, pumped it and put the gun over his shoulder pointing behind him. Two members were sitting back there playing dominoes and this guy had a loaded gun pointed right at them. I watched for a minute and he did it again! I just about came unglued. I walked up to their field and told them to stop shooting and asked the shooter in question if had a round in his gun - he did. I told him to keep his gun pointed downrange and not pump it until it was his turn to shoot.

    He and his friends were indignant and the one guy walked off the field and racked his gun.

    A couple of minutes passed and I reported the incident to range management. As I was walking back I passed them and explained what had happened and why I challenged them over a blatant abuse of range safety - they didn't get it and bitched at me for ruining their day.

    Guns in the hands of the ignorant and stupid - now there's a case for gun control.

    Unbelievable.
     
  2. hoggy

    hoggy TS Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    1,261
    You did right. I hope you approached them in a nice manner and not going up to them angry. It's better to have someone leave annoyed than let them continue in a manner VERY unsafe act which of course it was.
     
  3. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    ffwildcat- Based only on the words you used in your post, you did the right thing, but you may have done it in the wrong manner.

    Teaching safety to new shooters is very important. Sometimes a lesson can be delivered in a manner where the content of the lesson is forgotten and only the way the lesson was delivered is remembered.

    Pat Ireland
     
  4. grnberetcj

    grnberetcj Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    5,680
    Pat...great idea...but

    A military DI has the best method on how to keep the muzzle downrange. Any other method can be taught in kindergarten.

    Curt
     
  5. School Teacher

    School Teacher Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,052
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    ffwildcat:

    The shooter who loaded his pump gun after he had shot and put it over his shoulder was acting in an unsafe manner. You were correct in bringing this to range management's attention.

    Over the years, I have seen several unsafe acts, such as walking around, off of a trap field, with a round in the chamber of a pump gun but with the slide open a fraction. In each case, since I was either in charge of trap, or a club officer, I immediately corrected the individual, in a gentle but firm way, without incident. I have also had to confront shooters drinking beer and determining that they were finished shooting for the day.


    As Pat points out, the manner in which the lesson is taught is very important. Tact is critical.


    Also, when I was a DI, I did not give a hoot in hell about tact but I am not in the Army anymore.


    Our club still has several "Open or Out" signs posted, along with other range rules and I would reference a sign where applicable.

    New shooters are often experienced hunters who are comfortable with walking around with loaded shotguns. However, in my experience, they quickly and agreeably comply with range rules when informed of proper range safety.

    Years ago, when pumps and automatics were the rule, and break open guns were rare, the "Open or Out" rule was common. Today, some shooters load a round and close the action before it is their time to shoot but they keep the shotgun pointing downrange and do not leave the firing line. I can live with this but I still prefer the old rule, "Open of Out" rule.

    At our club, a member or guest who openly complained to a member about having to comply with a range safety rule, could be brought before the board of directors and be made to explain why they should still enjoy membership or the ability to shoot on our ranges.

    Ed Ward
     
  6. AJ100

    AJ100 TS Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,575
    NOPE, not this time, not going to even go near the "open or out" sign and when to close the gun stuff. Not again.

    Not gonna do it!

    Tom(AJ100)
     
  7. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    8,371
    There is no compromise for safety, you did the right thing ... PERIOD ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  8. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,357
    Location:
    Nashville Tn
    About two weeks ago, a young shooter stepped on the line by himself, loaded his pump gun, and called for a target. The Canterbury was off, so he did not get a target.

    He dismounted the gun, held it to his side, turned around and looked at the back of the field.

    His gun was still loaded, safety off, and was pointing in my general direction.

    I simply asked him in a loud enough voice so he could hear me, but was not yelling, "Young man, do you know where your gun is pointed?". He then noticed it was pointed at me, and said "Yes" as he pointed it down range and apologized.

    I then walked up to him, and said, "I wanted to remind you that gun was loaded when you turned around. I know you will never do that again". He said, "No Sir, I won't".

    We turned on the Canterbury, he went back on the line, and I resumed shooting bull chips with the guys (after taking a deep breath).

    I do not know how he shot. He did not leave mad. I left uninjured. I do not think yelling or disarming him would have made a bigger impact on him. He did not have his finger on or near the trigger. (whew)
     
  9. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,254
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    Why didn't range management get involved? Why weren't they on top of those morons before you had to intervene? I think club management and staff at many clubs are becoming too complacent about what is going on around them. They need to be more observant.
     
  10. Tom Strunk

    Tom Strunk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,311
    Location:
    Payson, Arizona
    I see these types of dorks out hunting quail here in Arizona. Opening weekend you will always see some idiots riding around in the back of a pick-up (usually three or four)with loaded shotguns, ready to shot at anything that flys or moves, disgusting. Never seems to be a game warden around when one is needed.

    My hunting partner and I ALWAYS wear some orange above our waist and alway a orange hat. Last season I came upon two guys hunting quail that were in full camo gear. It just to easy to shoot someone while you are looking at the bird. Please be safe out there, leave the camo gear for deer, elk, or javelina hunts.

    Tom Strunk
     
  11. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    25,254
    Location:
    Deplorable Bitter Clinger in Liberal La La Land
    The most shot hunters in Oregon are upland bird hunters. And the majority of the ones getting shot are not wearing blaze orange.<br>
    <br>
    I prefer camo for most of my hunting, but for upland I wear blaze orange.
     
  12. ffwildcat

    ffwildcat TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    845
    Do we put too much onus on range management to manage range safety? In my case I believe the right balance is members and management working together to ensure a safe environment for all shooters.

    In the instance I cited above range management was off taking care of one of the many tasks they have to deal with in the course of running a large, multi-discipline facility. I do not fault them in fact I applaud them for the manner in which the range is managed.

    I was the one that compromised safety.

    I watched it happen and then stood there for a full minute before I decided to act on the 2nd violation.

    My bad.
     
  13. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,357
    Location:
    Nashville Tn
    At the club or o the range, EVERYONE is responsible for safe firearms handling.

    The typical Gun Club is understaffed. One at the register, maybe two taking care of the machines, trash, hulls, etc.
     
  14. Chango2

    Chango2 Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    3,518
    I saw a case where the new shooters were so dangerous, I felt unsafe to approach them and tell them to stop doing what they were doing. So bad, that we took for cover. The range owner finally grabbed a gun away from the worst offender. Very, very, scary.
     
  15. deercreek

    deercreek Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,131
    Location:
    Indiana
    Good job, I would have attemtped politely at first and tried to explain why that is unsafe. If they copped an attitude right away we would have immediate removal of that person, even if it was forcibly with law enforcement assistance. All clubs in general had better watch closer, have you noticed all the accidental club/range shootings just this year?
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.