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Do over/under trap barrels shoot to the same POI ?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Hammer1, Jan 16, 2011.

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  1. Hammer1

    Hammer1 Active Member

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    .

    Do over/under trap barrels shoot to the same Point-of-Impact ?

    I was told that by design they do not.

    I was told that the bottom barrel is intended to shoot higher than the top barrel.

    That the bottom barrel is intended for the rapidly rising short-range shot on the first clay in doubles.

    Whereas the top barrel is for the second clay target in doubles which has either peaked or may even be falling by the time it is shot. Therefore the top barrel is intended to shoot flatter.

    Any thoughts ?

    .
     
  2. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    I have seen them both ways. Remington 3200's, Kreighoff's, and Kolars have changeable hangers to fascilitate different POI's .

    Most fixed barrel O/U's shoot the same POI.

    ss
     
  3. Hammer1

    Hammer1 Active Member

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    How about Browning Citori XT, Beretta DT-10, and Perazzis ?

    .
     
  4. Rastoff

    Rastoff Active Member

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    Fixed O/Us are set to a point of convergence. That distance is usually 40 yards. This means that at 40 yards both barrels will hit exactly the same POI.

    Most guns aren't regulated that well. If they hit within two inches of the same point at 40 yards, the manufacturer will say it's good. The higher end guns will be better than the mass produced variety.

    Don't over think it. Just shoot both barrels the same way.
     
  5. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

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    My Beretta o/u barrel set is regulated for doubles. That is, the under barrel is supposed to shoot a little higher than the upper barrel to get that first rising bird, while the over barrel is set lower as the second target is flatter by the time you get to it. In actual testing of the POI, this seems to be pretty much accurate, as once I set the POI of the lower barrel via the adjustable comb, the POI of the upper barrel was consistently a bit lower. But it depends on make, manufacturer, when made, etc. The only way to know for sure how your barrels shoot is to try then at the pattern board using the 13 yard to establish the actual POI of each barrel.

    Jim R
     
  6. Unknown1

    Unknown1 Well-Known Member

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    Each of my XTs shoot to the same POI. The over and under barrels been checked with a in-chamber laser bore sighter over distances of up to 50 yards and they are a lot more accurate at that distance than I am.

    MK
     
  7. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    MK, just because the chambers are properly aligned with that doo dad in there doesn't mean the end of the barrels are.

    "The over and under barrels been checked with a in-chamber laser bore sighter over distances of up to 50 yards and they are a lot more accurate at that distance than I am.'

    Even how the chokes are bored may make a difference also in POI.

    Hap
     
  8. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Use Neil's 13 yard patterning method, and you'll know where your barrels shoot.
     
  9. TrapCrazy

    TrapCrazy TS Member

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    Can some one tell me where Neils 13 yard pattern instructions are posted?
     
  10. Tron

    Tron Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    I'm at the patterning board quite a bit and I'm sometimes shocked at how many and what brands of shotguns have 2 different points of impact and NOT by design. I've found, just from my experience that you can't beat Browning OU's as an inexpensive out-of-the-box performer. They are perhaps the most consistently good to very good manufacturers out there as far as POI goes. This is generally true with most of the Japanese built OU's. Why? Not sure.
     
  11. SMOKEIT

    SMOKEIT Well-Known Member

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    Unless you shoot the second bird fairly quick after the first bird you will have better results with a flatter shooting top barrel. At the time of the shot the second bird is not rising as quickly as the first bird....SMOKIT
     
  12. SMOKEIT

    SMOKEIT Well-Known Member

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    Unless you shoot the second bird fairly quick after the first bird you will have better results with a flatter shooting top barrel. At the time of the shot the second bird is not rising as quickly as the first bird....SMOKIT
     
  13. SMOKEIT

    SMOKEIT Well-Known Member

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    Unless you shoot the second bird fairly quick after the first bird you will have better results with a flatter shooting top barrel. At the time of the shot the second bird is not rising as quickly as the first bird....SMOKIT
     
  14. Unknown1

    Unknown1 Well-Known Member

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    <blockquote><I>"...just because the chambers are properly aligned with that doo dad in there doesn't mean the end of the barrels are."</i></blockquote>Hap... they're XTs shooting 50 yards not Barrett rifles shooting a mile. Ya gotta trust something sometime. You pick yours...I'll pick mine!

    MK
     
  15. tcr1146

    tcr1146 Well-Known Member

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    You definitey need to check! I bought a used gun that the top barrel shot 100% and the bottom was 70%!? I just reversed the sequence of firing and shot doubles well with that gun! Tom Rhoads
     
  16. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    Since the chamber end of the barrel is larger than the exit, everything depends on the way the midrib is made.

    Most O/U's will not shoot the same POI over a varying range of distances. However, unless there is a serious defect, ALL will have a spot out there where both barrels hit. Regulation of target guns for doubles is tricky, and some manufacturers get it right, some don't.

    A lot of older guns without screw chokes were somtines harder to shoot handicap with, since the tighter choked barrel shot flatter.

    YMMV

    HM
     
  17. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    "...since the tighter choked barrel shot flatter."

    How do you figure that?
     
  18. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    TrapCrazy

    Click the link.
     
  19. Tom Strunk

    Tom Strunk Well-Known Member

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    Smokeit thats quite a flinch.

    Every gun is different, as is every shooters desired POI. Do your homework, check it yourself, stop accepting other peoples opinions as truth. Go to the pattern board and find out for yourself, like all the top shooters do.

    I have had guns that shot POI from 15 inches high on the bottom barrel with a top barrel that shot flat on two different guns from the same maker. Had a friend sell those POS as I counldn't look someone in the eye and imply they are good.

    I believe, according to both Tom Seitz and Tom Wilkinson, that most top shooters will have the same POI for both barrels as do I. Years back Phil Kiner did an article on doubles and he had interviews with Ray Stafford, Harlan Campbell, Leo Harrison III, Bob and Eric Munson and Ricky Marshall. All of them other than Bob Munson shot guns with the same POI on both barrels. Bob's shotgun shot 4 inches high on the bottom and 2 inches high on the top.
    Ray's was 28 inches high, Leo's was 6 to 8 inches high, Harlan's was 21 to 22 inches high, Ricky's was 8 to 9 inches high, Eric's was 5 inches high.

    So you can see your POI is a personal thing, it's lead thru the barrel and check the best results afterward on the pattern board for future reference.

    This is why semi-auto's are so popular in Sporting clays, as every time you pull the trigger it has the same POI.

    Do your homework, you must start at the pattern board, and then go from there.


    Tom Strunk
     
  20. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    Adding to what Tron said, my Browning Citori Lightning Sporting Clays O/U barrels both shoot to the same POI. I would consider otherwise defective. I wouldn't want a gun that tried to compensate for where it thought my second shot should go.
     
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