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"Dances With Stools" @ Elysburg

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Im1Hotshot, Jul 8, 2009.

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  1. Im1Hotshot

    Im1Hotshot TS Member

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    Can anyone confirm that during the Pa. State shoot, One of Elysburgs finest groundskeeper was summoned to the campgrounds for a sanitation issue.

    Where he was met by the "Mighty Poop" Tank of Elysburg. And the Mighty Poop was in no mood for this poor fool.
    He was Very, Very Angry that day, and grew ever madder with this poor unsuspecting public servant, and the Mighty Poop swallowed this poor sole up...

    If this is true ?

    Does anyone have an appropriate INDIAN Name for this Poor individual ?
     
  2. Gatguy

    Gatguy TS Member

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    "Many-Stools"
     
  3. joannl030

    joannl030 Member

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    I can only confirm this story with the picture of the shirt given to this individual during the PA Grand!!! Copy and paste the link below to see the shirt!

    http://i915.photobucket.com/albums/ac355/joannl030/CIMG1165.jpg
     
  4. Im1Hotshot

    Im1Hotshot TS Member

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    Hey Joannl030,

    Is ths the same guy Who Foul Mouthed "Harlan" and an All American Squad at the Grand a few years Ago ??

    And recently Spit/harrassed a Eastern Pa. shooter at the PSSA homegrounds during a sanctioned ATA Shoot.

    Both incidents resulting in ATA actions against him..
     
  5. aaastalker

    aaastalker TS Member

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    Yes it is...
     
  6. 007

    007 Member

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    OK,OK, quit teasing. We would all like to hear the full story on this.
     
  7. mcv

    mcv Member

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    i think "Dances with Stools" is the best indian name by far.

    to Im1Hotshot . . . apparently you know what happened with the "Mighty Poop." it was and still is hilarious and he gets a good laugh out of it every time he tells the story. at first you sounded like you are a friend of his . . . but did you think it was necessary to turn it around and slam the "finest groundskeeper" with a reminder of a couple of "incidents" that are over and done with? maybe you can go back and read the minutes. there were no "ATA actions against him." actions in the latter incident you are refering to were against the Eastern PA shooter and the other matter was closed and considered null and void. the end.

    we are all friends here in Elysburg. let's keep it that way. perhaps the "Mighty Poop" just may swallow you up.

    and to joann . . . nice shirt. it's perfect!
     
  8. aaastalker

    aaastalker TS Member

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    MCV,

    Looks Like Im1hotshot has your friends number..

    I cannot speak for "Harlan Campbell" and his Squad at the Grand..

    But your all Wrong on the take on the Eastern Pa Shooter..

    There was a primary complaint filed against your Elysburg official.

    Then He,
    this Elysburg Official, filed a knee jerk counterclaim, after the facts, in retaliation to this initial complaint.

    So,
    Unless your an ATA official with copies of the actual complaints filed in regards to this matter in front of you ?

    Your surely misinformed...
     
  9. TOOLMAKER 251

    TOOLMAKER 251 Active Member

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    3,398


    Are his initials CF?
     
  10. mcv

    mcv Member

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    as a matter of fact AAA, i do know more than you. i've read the complaints as well as the one against the Assoc. again as i stated above to Im1, go back and read the final status in the minutes. you, my friend, are misinformed. you had to actually be there to know the truth. one does not have to be an ATA official to have it in front of you.

    we are not getting in to a pissing match over this as the thread was started as a mere poke of fun.

    the end!
     
  11. Barry C. Roach

    Barry C. Roach Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Scottsdale, AZ


    Poop Shooter

    Party Pooper

    P-Trap

    Potty Mouth
     
  12. aaastalker

    aaastalker TS Member

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    MCV,

    I don't think so...

    But,
    It sure sounds like your got a Big Puddle on your end of your computer..

    Truth,
    You Can't Handle the Truth ..
     
  13. TjayE

    TjayE Member

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    Joann, I can not get the picture of the T-shirt that was posted on Photo bucket. I went to photo bucket and the message "this picture was deleted" is what was posted. Will the T-shirt be at the Eastern Zone shoot next week?

    I did not know there was a problem with the sanitation system at this year's (2009) State shoot. There was a problem last year.

    Please give this man a break. He works hard to keep the PSSA grounds in top shape.
     
  14. aaastalker

    aaastalker TS Member

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    TjayE,

    I am all for giving someone a break.
    And from what is told, "YES" he is a hard worker...

    But this Guy has a know ATA history of abusing the
    general public at these ATA shoots.

    This behaviour is not what any person, least not an Official at Elysburg,
    should exhibit and be allowed to conduct themselves in this manner..

    What happen to "PROFESSIONALISM" ?

    AAA
     
  15. Im1Hotshot

    Im1Hotshot TS Member

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    Hey Mcv,

    It looks like the AAA Stalker put you in your place..

    It's about time for things to change up in Elysburg.

    Why is it that when you go to "The Grand" and ask for a Trap reset ?

    It's Yes. Sir/Mamm,

    Are those targets Ok now...

    But At Elysburg, you get a bunch of You Don't Know what a Good target looks like, plus a BAD ATTITUDE from the trap staff up there...

    Could it be that the Management is failing to remember It's about "Customer Service" and NOT the Pushum Through Mentality that Elysburg exhibits..

    IM1
     
  16. aaastalker

    aaastalker TS Member

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  17. wdr-NY

    wdr-NY TS Member

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    IM1Hotshot,
    Your description of Elysburg is completely foreign to me. In my experience, there is no better place in the country to shoot.

    Since this thread is full of people talking in code and beating around the proverbial bush, let me illustrate my point, using names and exact examples of my experience at Elysburg.

    During this years Colonial Classic Handicap at the PA State Shoot, I shot with a random squad on bank 11. The weather was beautiful but a little breezy. When we got to 11D, the targets came out a flyin... probably the highest targets I've ever seen. After we went through our first shots on the first station, I shot my second bird and then the guy on two just completely flipped out... yelling to the trap girl to get a mechanic and get the targets reset. I was squad leader so I asked him to calm down and go easy on her. I told her that I would flag down a supervisor and get a mechanic (Chris) to look at the trap. I apologized to her for his (this guy on two, whom I had never seen before) behavior.

    I saw Chris' son under the pavilion and asked him if he could radio his Dad. When Chris got there, the guy on two started in on him. Chris didn't respond, he just checked the targets (they looked perfect now because the head wind was gone). He said the targets looked good but that he would check the trap to make sure nothing was loose. He came back out of the traphouse and said everything looked good. We took the line and completed the 25 with Chris watching us until we were done.

    Of all the trap mechanics I deal with, I think Chris and Spears are the two best. They've never given me attitude, and I've never seen them give anyone else attitude (though Chris can be quite the wise ass at the bar). What I do know is that there are a lot of prima donna acting trapshooters who get condescending, rude and outright mean when they have an issue with the traps, the trap help, the weather or anything else (including just plain shooting bad). I can't even begin to imagine how difficult it must be to listen to people bitch and moan allllllll day about things that are often times out of the control of the trap mechanics' and officials hands. They have a tough job, and I think they do it very well and with a high level of skill and speed.

    So... in summation, I love Elysburg and I love the people there... I think they set the standard and my experiences there have only reinforced those beliefs.

    Walker

    My response isn't meant to be directed AT IM1, I just used their name to point out that the description of Elysburg is foreign to me.
     
  18. wdr-NY

    wdr-NY TS Member

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    So... I read the minutes... and here's the gist. John Kulesa filed two complaints against Spear and the PSSA... One for a safety issue related to the trap help throwing old targets and boxes out of an adjacent trap house while Kulesa was shooting, the second complaint for Spear allegedly stalking Kulesa after the incident. There was a third complaint filed by Spear against Kulesa for violating three rules, all of which pertained to disrupting the harmony of the shoot and berating trap personnel.

    In the end, the ATA exonerated Spear and the PSSA and reprimanded Kulesa for his actions towards Spear and the PSSA. Bill Anzaldi stated that he would like to suspend John Kulesa for his actions but, because he was a newer shooter, he recommended the ATA give him a written warning and reprimand for his actions.

    In short, the ATA found that nothing Spear nor the PSSA did was in violation of any ATA rules. Moreover, they found that Kulesa violated several rules and reprimanded him for that.

    I don't have a dog in the fight... I'm just writing what I got out of the published minutes.

    Walker
     
  19. Im1Hotshot

    Im1Hotshot TS Member

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    WD40-NY,

    There's always more to the story than your telling.

    As far as the reprimands go, you again blowing smoke up everybodys
    dark side...

    We can see what side of the fence you are on WD....

    Funny how Spear was again,
    as you call it "enorated" , but he was not asked back to the Grand since he foul mouthed Harlan Campell and the All American Squad regarding that complaint against him.
    Hmmmmm.......................

    As far as this new shooter "Kulesa"
    Decent guy caught in the crossfire politics of Elysburg,
    and there Poor Management Skills..

    The ATA asked Elysburg to investigate itself...
    So, sure the results are in favor of them...
    Daa...

    So, Sure Spear their "TOp POOP Detective" gets the investigators and investigation to go in his favor..

    From what is told, witness statements taken by ATA appointed investigators were taken from individuals that were not even witness to this incident.

    Let's just call it "Elysgate"...

    The ATA and Elysburg are just another politically not correct machine...

    Get Real WD40-NY...
     
  20. wdr-NY

    wdr-NY TS Member

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    I copied and pasted the minutes here... This is the ATA's official findings. People can judge how they see fit. All I'm asking is to avoid speculation and refer only to the facts...

    ...there's anecdote and there's empiricism...

    Walker


    “Complaint #08-06 373
    After a thorough and timely investigation into the claim of Mr. Kulesa that the PSSA was committing safety violations 374
    in complaint #08-06, I find there to be no such violations. During my investigation, I talked to all of the squad members 375
    shooting on the squad with Mr. Kulesa, to which, none of them observed any safety violations or concerns. Also, Mr. 376
    Kulesa alleges that targets were being thrown out of an adjacent trap house. All other members of the squad stated 377
    that they did not see this event take place. 378
    The matters in which Mr. Kulesa complained about were brought to the PSSA's Board of Directors during their meeting 379
    the following morning .... [Subsequently] The board adopted a new policy to not clean a trap field while shooters are 380
    firing on an adjacent trap field. This was done out of courtesy to shooters to limit the possibilities of distractions but 381
    not for safety reasons such as Mr. Kulesa has stated. I will also state that the employees (trap help) of the PSSA go 382
    through a very detailed training, where safety is the key issue. 383
    It is my recommendation that this complaint be dismissed by the ATA Executive Board due to its lack of validity. 384
    385
    Complaint #08-07 386
    After a thorough investigation into this complaint, I feel that it stemmed from previous interactions between Mr. Kulesa 387
    and Mr. Proukou. Mr. Kulesa's unwillingness to cooperate made the investigation into this complaint very difficult as 388
    he refused to answer any questions during a phone conversation. 389
    Mr. Proukou has been employed by the PSSA for 12 years with the title of Head of Maintenance. Although his title is 390
    Head of Maintenance, Mr. Proukou is called on by the shoot management of the PSSA to attend to several other 391
    disciplines needed on the grounds to ensure the PSSA hosts safe, uninterrupted shoots. Mr. Proukou, although a long 392
    time member of the ATA, did not participate at the shoot and was only there as an employee of the PSSA. Mr. Kulesa 393
    alleges that Mr. Proukou was stalking him during an event later in the week during the shoot after their altercation. Mr. 394
    Proukou was in fact assigned by shoot management to oversee bank 9 for the event, which happened to be where 395
    Mr. Kulesa was shooting. 396
    It is my recommendation that since Mr. Proukou was acting in the capacity of an employee of the PSSA and not as 397
    an ATA shooter, the complaint be dismissed by the ATA and turned over to the PSSA for any additional actions, if any 398
    are necessary over what has already been done by the PSSA board of directors. 399
    8
    Complaint #08-09 400
    After a thorough and timely investigation, it is my opinion that Mr. Kulesa did clearly violate ATA rules IV.I.3, IV.1.6. 401
    XII.B.l.a. XII.B.Lf, and XII.B.l.g as stated in the complaint from Mr. Proukou. All letters from witnesses and notes from 402
    my conversations with witnesses are attached to document [and support] my opinion. Statements from members of 403
    the squad shooting with Mr. Kulesa and letters from volunteers clearly reinforce my opinion. 404
    Because of Mr. Kulesa's actions at the PSSA home grounds and his attitude toward me during this investigation I am 405
    tempted to recommend suspension from the ATA but reluctant to do so. Mr. Kulesa is a fairly new shooter to our sport 406
    (less than 2 years) and I feel he should be given a second chance to adjust his attitude. It is my recommendation, that 407
    instead of suspension, that the ATA send Mr. Kulesa a letter informing him that this type of behavior will not be 408
    tolerated at any ATA shoot or event.” 409
    410
    Subsequent to receipt of the complaint summary of ATA/Pennsylvania Delegate Frank Pascoe, Eastern Zone 411
    Vice President Wm. M. (Bill) Anzaldi, Jr., reviewed the entire file and concluded by publishing his response to 412
    Executive Director Jim L. Thompson on November 25, 2008. Eastern Zone Vice President Anzaldi stated: 413
    “... It is my feeling that Delegate Pascoe has conducted a thorough, in depth investigation of this 414
    matter as evidenced by the supporting documents, and I support the method in which he has chosen 415
    to handle the situation.”
     
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