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Cost of RV hook-ups at shoots

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by VNVET, Apr 20, 2010.

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  1. VNVET

    VNVET Member

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    I'm curious what other clubs are charging for RV hook-ups during a shoot. We have 6, 50 amp and 12, 30 amp sites all with water but no sewer. In the past we have charged $15 per night 30 or 50 amp. I see some of these RV that cost $250,000 with three air conditioners and all electric appliances running night and day. I know our electric bill is thru the roof after one of these shoots and I would like to know what is the "going rate" for other clubs.

    Jim
     
  2. Joe Woods

    Joe Woods Well-Known Member

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    " The Big Rigs Are Not that Common "
    Next time you are at the Spring Grand at the Tucson Trap & Skeet Club, Tucson,AZ. LOOK IN THE PARKING LOT !!!!
    They have approximately 210 hook ups.
    If I had known someone was going to make a comment I would have taken a picture. There is always next year.

    Joe Woods/Ontario
     
  3. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    FYI. the Great Lakes Grand at Mason, Michigan is charging $25 for water/electric sites.

    Per the program..
     
  4. Tatanka Donk

    Tatanka Donk Active Member

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    Jacksonville Skeet and Trap and Gator Skeet and Trap Clubs,(in Florida) the camping was FREE if you shoot the complete program in the Chain Shoots. Granted, they only have Electric and Water but both are nice clubs to shoot at in the Florida Chain. Let me add that all the Clubs in the Florida Chain are nice Clubs to shoot at but I don't know there rates. Don Kerce
     
  5. Bob Hawkes

    Bob Hawkes Well-Known Member

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    Jim. You have made a great observation. We have limited hook-ups electric and water only installed by donations from members/some users to the tune of 6 to 7,000. There are people who think it's a money maker. When I checked our electric bills after a 3 day shoot it's a break even at best, now throw in some water and trash pick-up and see where you're at. The plus side is that they are shooters who are going to participate in most of the events.

    BTW, we charge 15 per day also and IMO that's not heavy, barely enough to break even maybe. I couldn't believe the electric bill on the dedicated line. Then you've got people who feel they shouldn't have to pay anything and are extremely demanding. Not like the days of old, Oh well.

    Shoot often while we can, Bob
     
  6. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    Big M; Tell them the rest of the story. It is $18 per night for other than the GLG and there is a dump station on the grounds.

    VNVET; Rates vary from club to club and for various reason. The more popular the shoot and a limited number of spots, you will find a higher rate.

    Campers contribute to higher electrical costs but could it be that you are using your machines more, your club house electric more all because you have attracted shooters to your facility.

    But be sure to blame the campers and maybe they will stay away the next time. But bear in mind that most campers shoot every target thrown, so not only will you save on electric, you will cut down on targets thrown saving on electric and target cost.

    Don
    Who has camped all over.
     
  7. VNVET

    VNVET Member

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    In trying to narrow down the cost I did a little research on the web and found the average cost of a Kilowatt Hour (KWh) is $.12. Amps X volts = watts divided by 1000 = KWh. Since RV are running all electric when hooked up in an RV site, running two or three 1500 watt air conditioners, 100 watt refrigerator, 1000 watt TV, microwave, lights, hot water heater and etc. Now these devices are not all running all the time, but if we can assume the total constant amp draw for the RV is 30 amps @ 240 volts, then here's what we have:

    30 amps X 240 volts = 7200 divided by 1000 = 7.2 KWh

    7.2 KWh X $.12 = $ .86 (rounded)

    $.86 X 24 hours = $20.64

    I understand that all these appliances are not all running continuously, and if they were the amp draw would be higher than 30 amps. It seems to me with a large RV and a 50 amp hookup, 30 amps is a reasonable number.

    There are some in our club who argue, lets charge $10 to get them to come. Lets loose money on the food to get them to come. Lets keep the shoot fees low to get them to come. Lets boost the added money to get them to come. We need to do this to support the NSSA and for the good of the sport.

    These are the same people who argue to keep the membership and daily fees low to attract members. Then they can't understand why the club is always broke.

    In my estimation a 50 amp hookup at $20 is about right and $15 for a 30 amp is about right. We, as a club, will eat the cost of installing and maintaining the RV sites.

    Jim
     
  8. jim brown

    jim brown Well-Known Member

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    Most commercial RV parks charge less than $20 per day on weekly rate. It's amazing to me that they can afford to loose money on them and stay in business. Or maybe there is something wrong with your electric numbers?

    jim brown
     
  9. cunninmp

    cunninmp Member

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    At Stockton Trap and Skeet here in northern CA,
    they charge $15.00 for 30 amp & water.
    Mike C.
    Groveland,CA
     
  10. Bob Hawkes

    Bob Hawkes Well-Known Member

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    Jim, You hadn't mentioned the NSSA earlier and I had avoided it in my response. "You mean you expect the referee's to pay?" You wouldn't believe what you go through with some of the campers. Like everything else in life, some are great, and yes, there's other's that should stay home. It is not a money maker, it's an accomodation that you'd like to have benefit both parties.
    Shoot often while we can, Bob
     
  11. GrubbyJack

    GrubbyJack Member

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    "30 amps X 240 volts = 7200 divided by 1000 = 7.2 KWh" that one big RV

    your math might be a little off most all campers are 120VAC, so your calc are a little high..(yea you have two hots and each one is 120, but your not running an 220 water-heater or A/C etc) that beeing said, My 37ft Sunnybrook has to 2 AC's and is about standard,that being running 50A, most TT and small 5th only have one A/C ,and have only 30A service cable.. if your that worried, only have 30A service (I'll bet most have a 50A > 30A adapter) that way "they" could only run one A/C at a time.....for a 3 day shoot, I could (dry camp) ie run off the batts and use my own 40gal of water... What is the ole saying, it takes money to make money....Grubby
     
  12. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    Not so much that the math is off as it is the random introduction of units.

    For the example above, the power use is P=IV= 30Ax240V= 7,200Watts = 7.2 Kwatts. (not KWH) If you burn this all day the power use is 7.2 KW x 24 H = 173 KWH. Then throw in the power factor which is essentially an efficiency factor, 1.15 is typical and the power use is 173KWH x1.15= 199 KWH. If the rate is $0.12/KWH then the power use cost is 199 KWH x $0.12/KWH = $24 per day. (and is would be an extreme case). Typically an RV will use about 1/3 of that amount or $8/Day.

    So if all you are offering is the power then charging $10 per day for an RV hook up will cover your power expense. You won't be able to pay for having the service installed or the off season 'service' charges at this rate though.

    The other way to look at this is that RV hook ups may bring more customers to your club and whatever money you loose on the hook ups will be more than compensated for by the additional people paying to shoot at your club.
     
  13. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    Also depends on the time of year you are talking about. Most water heaters are gas, how long do you have a Microwave on, for 3-5 minutes max. TV only for 2-3 hours per day. AC if running will only be occasionally unless it's over a 100.

    Get real you act like everything is running all the time.

    Don
     
  14. jdsfarms

    jdsfarms Well-Known Member

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    Our local rv park has a flat rate for spots with 15 amp electrical hookups,these sites will not accomodate an A/C,if you want a 30 or 50 amp hookup they have electric meters and are charged at a flat rate plus whatever the meter says.Jerry
     
  15. VNVET

    VNVET Member

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    I will admit that most of what I know about KWh I learned on the web. I suspect that wolfram may have a better grasp on the subject than I do, but how do you explain the fact that big RV's have a 50 amp power cord. Is it possible that they may have that large of power draw (50 amps). I don't own an RV but it seems those that I visited at shoots, the fan runs continuosly and the compressor kicks in when needed. As for the RV using only 120 volts, I can't say but 240 volts is available at the receptacle on the 30 amp and 50 amp sites.

    The entire reason for this post was driven by a shooter who own a 40' RV with slide-outs and complained about charging $20 for a hook-up and wanted the club to reduce the fee. With shooters dropping right and left from registered events and clubs going under across the country, shooters wanting steak diners included in the program and wanting the clubs to obsorbe the costs, seems insane to me. Now I don't know much as I am just a shoot manager at a small, members club trying to keep the club alive. Back in the day when we made money on every shoot, had great food, lots of participation, plenty of members shooting and the club was making money, things were good. Today when every dollar counts and we try to balance the cost and shoot attandance, you need to ask yourself do we need to hammer down the RV cost in order to save $15 or $20 or is it more important to keep the club alive and have a place to shoot.

    Apparently some shooters don't get it. Club doesn't make money..club goes out of business, then you can move on to golf or tennis or whatever interest you. Maybe move on to rifle or pistol and there are many gun clubs doing just fine when their cost is simply the cost of a bullseye target. Clay target clubs throw expensive targets which have to be incorporated into the shoot fees, it's as simple as that.

    Forgive my rant, but I just cant understand the owner of a $250,000 RV wanting to hammer down a club in order to save $5 per day on an RV hookup to intice him to come to my shoot.

    Jim
     
  16. grnberetcj

    grnberetcj Active Member

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    Go ahead and give the guy his $5.00 daily hook-up discount, then add a $5.00 per day shooting facility surcharge to his entry fees. Then watch the cheapskate turn into Mr. Tomato Head!!

    Curt
     
  17. Pocatello

    Pocatello Active Member

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    At the Pocatello Trap Club in Idaho we charge $10 per day for a site with electric and water hookup. Dry camping is free. There is a dump station just outside our gate. It isn't ours, perhaps the City owns it. As far as I know there is no charge to use it. I am not sure how many sites we have, but it is on the rough order of 50. At two of our yearly events the sites are essentially full. The first is the week-long Shoshone Indian Shoot in June, the second is our four-day Gun Shoot in August. So figure at least $2000 in site rental for each of June and August. Our water is from a well, and our electricty is billed on three meters. I presume one is for the clubhouse, one for the trapline, and one for the RV sites. This is based on looking at the usage patterns over the years. Anyway, last July's total electricity bill (which covered the Indian Shoot) was $621.60; last September's bill (which covered the Gun Shoot) was $456.29. There were other expenses associated with big shoots, such as about $450 each month for porta potties, and maybe $200 each month for extra garbage, but those are not entirely attributable to campers. I don't think we lost money charging $10 per night per site.
     
  18. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    Don I have no rest of story. Just answered the question straight forward. Thanks for importing your knowledge of the "why's".

    Jim
     
  19. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    The best way to do it is have the campers go to the nearest camp grounds and see what they are told for daily fees ... Most campgrounds are in the business to make money and they charge more money so they can make money ... Shooters pay to shoot and campers should pay to stay or camp at the clubs even if they are shooters because one don't offset the other ... If they can't afford to pay to camp tell them to leave an give the spot to the next one inline, samething goes for shooting ... Camping and shooting are two completely different ends of the business, one does not or should not have to cover the other's expenses ... You will not be without campers, the only difference is you will get campers who pay to be on the grounds to where they are going to shoot ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  20. likes-to-shoot

    likes-to-shoot Well-Known Member

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    I've lived in a camper for years working construction and campground fees were just a little short of motel room fees but with the convenience of doing your own cooking.

    If the shooters have to help make up campground expenses at the club I'd think it would be unfair to that group. Kind of like the health care bill. lol

    Bill
     
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